Why do christians have selective morality?

gordon 2 · Feb 24, 2011

Why do christians have selective morality?

James 3 ( Not Many should become teachers...);8,9-14, 15.

8.But the human tongue can be tamed by no man. It is a restless undisciplined, irreconcilable evil, full of deadly poison.

9. With it we bless the Lord and Father, and with it we curse men who were made in God's likeness!

10. Out of the same mouth come forth blessing and cursing. These things, my brethren,ought not to be so.

14. But if you have bitter jealousy (envy) and contention (rivalry, selfish ambition) in your hearts, do not pride yourselves on it and thus be in defiance of and false to the truth.

15. This (superficial) wisdom is not such as comes from above, but is earthly, unspiritual(animal), even devilish ( demoniacal).

What do you think?

formula1 · Feb 24, 2011

Re:

Because the renewal of the mind takes effort and is not completed all at once. But the fact that it is possible should cause us to hunger for it.

Romans 12:2
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.

Ronnie T · Feb 24, 2011

Verse one said: "Not many should be teachers".
Then he speaks of controlling the tongue, which actually speaks of controlling the "mind".

Then he speaks of 'selfish ambition' and other such things.

I'll provide two other scriptures:
“Now I urge you, brethren, keep your eye on those who cause dissensions and hindrances contrary to the teaching which you learned, and turn away from them. For such men are slaves, not of our Lord Christ but of their own appetites; and by their smooth and flattering speech they deceive the hearts of the unsuspecting” (Romans 16:17-18).

“Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son[/COLOR]” (2 John 9)

James brought the teacher to the center of this chapter, although it can be applied obviously to any Christian brother or sister.

When a teacher does not remain within the confines of Scripture, they lose their fellowship with God. Therefore, error is not to be brushed aside as if it is of no consequence.

I've been in the spot as the teacher, and I've been in the group with those who don't consider themselves teachers.
As those scriptures make clear, it's important that the teacher stick strictly to the scriptures. He must search for all that the scriptures provides, and he must stop where the scriptures stop.
But that's not how we deal with the scriptures when we're standing under the palm trees in the parking lot after church. Out there, we're finally able the 'think' what we want to think about the scripture. Out there, we pick and choose how we're going to allow the scriptures to prove how well I've figured things out.
It can become a contest concerning who's figured out the latest take on an old scripture.

Jesus said that when He speaks He only speaks the words of God. When we speak, and teach, and learn we have to stay within the scripture. Going beyond is a dangerous place.

I believe the best Christian and the best teacher, ultimately, is the simple thinking Christian.

I don't know if it's 'selective morality', or if it's our desire to know more than the next person.

"Not many should be teacher".
It tough to stay within the bounds.
To keep it all about Jesus Christ and not about me.

gordon 2 · Feb 25, 2011

Ronnie T said:
Verse one said: "Not many should be teachers".
Then he speaks of controlling the tongue, which actually speaks of controlling the "mind".

Then he speaks of 'selfish ambition' and other such things.

I'll provide two other scriptures:
“Now I urge you, brethren, keep your eye on those who cause dissensions and hindrances contrary to the teaching which you learned, and turn away from them. For such men are slaves, not of our Lord Christ but of their own appetites; and by their smooth and flattering speech they deceive the hearts of the unsuspecting” (Romans 16:17-18).

“Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son[/COLOR]” (2 John 9)

James brought the teacher to the center of this chapter, although it can be applied obviously to any Christian brother or sister.

When a teacher does not remain within the confines of Scripture, they lose their fellowship with God. Therefore, error is not to be brushed aside as if it is of no consequence.

I've been in the spot as the teacher, and I've been in the group with those who don't consider themselves teachers.
As those scriptures make clear, it's important that the teacher stick strictly to the scriptures. He must search for all that the scriptures provides, and he must stop where the scriptures stop.
But that's not how we deal with the scriptures when we're standing under the palm trees in the parking lot after church. Out there, we're finally able the 'think' what we want to think about the scripture. Out there, we pick and choose how we're going to allow the scriptures to prove how well I've figured things out.
It can become a contest concerning who's figured out the latest take on an old scripture.

Jesus said that when He speaks He only speaks the words of God. When we speak, and teach, and learn we have to stay within the scripture. Going beyond is a dangerous place.

I believe the best Christian and the best teacher, ultimately, is the simple thinking Christian.

I don't know if it's 'selective morality', or if it's our desire to know more than the next person.

"Not many should be teacher".
It tough to stay within the bounds.
To keep it all about Jesus Christ and not about me.

I do not equate here the teachings solely to scripture. When James wrote this there was no New Testament. Therefore sticking to the teachings of Christ must of come from somewhere other than scripture. You might say yes, but James was a witness to calvary, he had no need of the Gospels. To which I will say Paul was no such witness!

Quote: When we speak, and teach, and learn we have to stay within the scripture. Going beyond is a dangerous place.

Isn't this why Paul hunted christians and why Paul in turn was hunted and eventually killed?

My point is doesn't God reveal himself other than in scripture? In the Kingdom for example or in His (New Life) Church.

If our morality is based within the confines on Scripture solely in the hope of keeping our faith walk simpler, our earthy natures willingly will take of the old and the new in matters of morality. Of the old it will take on the morality of the patriachs and of the new it will claim grace. In doing so we will think ourselves blessed and it will not be so, because we will use two measures to truth, two measures to justice.

I believe that the light that shines from scripture must be shared with the light of the Kingdom, as we live our lives with Christ and forge ahead in the darkness. Both are our perspectives and not solely scripture. Scripture is full of darkeness for our minds. From it,from darkness, the Kingdom and its new Adam turns us away and scripture is ever fresh, lively and new.

That "going beyond is a dangerous place" is only true if from our baptism we will not learn to swim.

formula1 · Feb 25, 2011

Re:

If you dream up ideas in your head about what a scripture means, then "going beyond the scriptures is a dangerous place". You better have the Holy Spirit and the canon of scripture as we have them today to provide a standard by which we can judge righteousness and truth and eliminate deceptive teaching. That is the purpose.

2 Timothy 3
16 All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

Without the witness of the whole of scripture, you get cults and deceptions and false teaching of all kinds, rampant even in the middle of the 'church'. Jesus indeed did warn us (see Matthew 13). We best be careful and tremble before our God that we do not become captured in deception.

Ronnie T · Feb 25, 2011

formula1 said:
If you dream up ideas in your head about what a scripture means, then "going beyond the scriptures is a dangerous place". You better have the Holy Spirit and the canon of scripture as we have them today to provide a standard by which we can judge righteousness and truth and eliminate deceptive teaching. That is the purpose.

2 Timothy 3
16 All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

Without the witness of the whole of scripture, you get cults and deceptions and false teaching of all kinds, rampant even in the middle of the 'church'. Jesus indeed did warn us (see Matthew 13). We best be careful and tremble before our God that we do not become captured in deception.

That's it right there. I'm in agreement will all that you said.

I can't count the number of times someone has told me that they've prayed about an issue and God has lead them to be convicted in the heart that a particular thing is the right thing to do. But in all truth, this person has just convinced themselves to go against the very plain teachings of God's word.
People who God has "personally" convicted them to break the law, or refuse to forgive a repentant Christian.

People who might say "My church is the only acceptable church and you'll go to Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ----Edited to Remove Profanity ---- if you don't agree with me".
And "If you don't use my kind of Bible you cannot properly learn of God".

All of those things effect the morality of Christianity; and they all spring up from us deceiving ourselves.
We deceive ourselves, blame it on God, then allow our own deception to bring blindness and corruption to other people.

In the teachings of Christ, and the teachings of the apostles, we find our new birth. And Christ touches our lives through that. Then we move out into society carrying Christ and that life with us to other people. But any time we take our focus off the taught, inspired Gospel, we are in great danger. Danger of deceiving ourselves. And quite often, once self-deceived, there's no place to make a U-turn.

Even though there are plenty of Christians in this world that believe they are God's new gift to the church, every Christian would be wise to stick to the Gospel.

That doesn't mean there aren't things to be believed and said that aren't recorded in God's word. Be be warned,,,, be very very careful. We aren't as smart as we think we are.

rjcruiser · Feb 25, 2011

gordon 2 said:
Why do christians have selective morality?

Sin.

gordon 2 said:
I do not equate here the teachings solely to scripture. When James wrote this there was no New Testament. Therefore sticking to the teachings of Christ must of come from somewhere other than scripture. You might say yes, but James was a witness to calvary, he had no need of the Gospels. To which I will say Paul was no such witness!

Paul did witness the risen Christ/God. On the road to Damascus.

gordon 2 · Feb 25, 2011

rjcruiser said:
Sin.

Paul did witness the risen Christ/God. On the road to Damascus.

Agreed. I also note that for the purpose of this discussion "the scriptures" has now become " The Gospels". And so be it.

Lowjack · Feb 25, 2011

rjcruiser said:
Sin.

Paul did witness the risen Christ/God. On the road to Damascus.

He heard he didn't see.

Crubear · Feb 25, 2011

1) we're people
2) We're translating from a language that's much more specific and detailed into a language that isn't.

Best examples I know is when do the words fat, no, and slim mean the same thing? Put them in sentence and follow them with "Chance"

When you can bend something to suit your need, you tend to.

Ronnie T · Feb 25, 2011

gordon 2 said:
I do not equate here the teachings solely to scripture. When James wrote this there was no New Testament. Therefore sticking to the teachings of Christ must of come from somewhere other than scripture. You might say yes, but James was a witness to calvary, he had no need of the Gospels. To which I will say Paul was no such witness!

Quote:When we speak, and teach, and learn we have to stay within the scripture. Going beyond is a dangerous place.

Isn't this why Paul hunted christians and why Paul in turn was hunted and eventually killed?

My point is doesn't God reveal himself other than in scripture? In the Kingdom for example or in His (New Life) Church.
If our morality is based within the confines on Scripture solely in the hope of keeping our faith walk simpler, our earthy natures willingly will take of the old and the new in matters of morality. Of the old it will take on the morality of the patriachs and of the new it will claim grace. In doing so we will think ourselves blessed and it will not be so, because we will use two measures to truth, two measures to justice.

I believe that the light that shines from scripture must be shared with the light of the Kingdom, as we live our lives with Christ and forge ahead in the darkness. Both are our perspectives and not solely scripture. Scripture is full of darkeness for our minds. From it,from darkness, the Kingdom and its new Adam turns us away and scripture is ever fresh, lively and new.

That "going beyond is a dangerous place" is only true if from our baptism we will not learn to swim.

Jesus only taught the things God gave Him to teach.
The apostles only taught the things Christ gave them.
The Holy Spirit will now guide us in discerning those very things.

Paul sought to destroy the church because he was unwilling to accept what God had already revealed in holy scripture. His Phariseeical attitude prevented him from accepting the obvious.
Once Paul believed, his very first public words were: "20and immediately he began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues, saying, "He IS the Son of God."

I agree that God is also revealed in Christ's church. But that revelation will be in total accord with the Gospel. I personally don't believe your church or my church (like we had a church) has received a revelation from God that hasn't already been revealed in His word.
Anything away from the Gospel could just as well be from the devil rather than God. There's plenty of proof of that.
Something else. Do we really need anything else that wasn't a part of the Gospel?

Personally, I've already had to deal with many things that weren't of the Gospel. Still trying to wash them off.

rjcruiser · Feb 28, 2011

Lowjack said:
He heard he didn't see.

Then what blinded him?

Why do christians have selective morality?

gordon 2

Senior Member

formula1

Daily Bible Verse Organizer

Ronnie T

Ol' Retired Mod

gordon 2

Senior Member

formula1

Daily Bible Verse Organizer

Ronnie T

Ol' Retired Mod

rjcruiser

Senior Member

gordon 2

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Lowjack

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Crubear

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Ronnie T

Ol' Retired Mod

rjcruiser

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