Keeping Working Knives Sharp

[Knotwild]

I have two knives I use daily. One is a neck knife, used constantly that has a grind on the blade that has a pretty high angle on it, I assume to make it last during heavy cutting work. The other is a D2 steel Ontario Knife RatII. They work and are tools. I am addicted to the neck knife and can't find another to have as a backup.

For instance, yesterday I got caught in a situation where I had to cut holes in the ribs on a 12" plastic pipe so it would sink and the Rat handled it easily, but now needs touching up.

So, I am the world's worse at sharpening a knife, but need a way to keep them both sharp. I am thinking I want a Lansky sharpening system as I would be terrible free hand. I have a work sharp, but it can ruin a knife in the blink of an eye if you are not careful. I am terrible with a steel and often roll the edge over.

What do you guys think I should do, or buy?

Doug Stice Neck Knife

 

[Anvil Head]

It's more about practicing technique than what methodology you choose. Dressing a edge can be done on most any devise pretty quickly if you train your hand(s). All about teaching your hand and arm muscles how to maintain a proper angle. If you learn on a jig, you will be subject to always using a jig. If you learn to use a basic stone you will be able to sharpen/dress a blade by most any method. Biggest trick is to sharpen a blade before it becomes too dull to cut well and before the cutting, final bevel is rounded over too much to feel it's way down a stone.

Hard to beat a good little necker, way more handy than most realize.

What part of coastal SC you from? I worked out of Walterboro for 4 years back in the early 70's.

 

[Knotwild]

Thanks Carl - that makes sense. I have been trying to keep both knives up on a steel each time I use them because they seldom get an easy slicing job. Both knives have very different edges, I would say the neck knife has a grind similar to an ax and the RatII is more fine like a kitchen knife. So, I guess I really need to practice. For instance I rolled the neck knife over on a kitchen steel the other day so bad I could see it.

I love the neck knife and can't find anything similar for a backup. They originally sold for $125 and I found that one brand new on Ebay, bid $65 and got it. I wear it everywhere I go and no one notices it.

I do live in Walterboro and was born and raised here. I started driving in 1972. I take care of Hutchinson Island down at Bennett's Point.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[watermedic]

The Ratt is D2 steel and you rolled it with a kitchen steel?

something isn't right there.

 

[Knotwild]

It is supposed to be D2. I used it to cut the ribs open on some 12" drain pipe so it would sink and I figured I would hit it a few licks on the kitchen steel. I made one stroke that hit the guard of the steel and when I looked directly at the edge I could see a spot pushed over. I kept working it on the steel and got rid of it.

I wish I knew more about knives, but most of my life a knife was a farm tool or something you lose. Now I am coming to appreciate them but don't have a clue on how to properly care for one.

Maybe I'm not on the web enough?

 

[tbrown913]

Youtube the kitchen steel. You should be going from the handle to the tip of the steel. The steel drags down the blade from spine to tip to straighten the blade.

Not trying to be condescending, your post about hitting the handle just sounds like you were going the wrong direction!

Get a leather strop and some compound. I have a pocket knife I use daily. I have to bring out the stones about twice a year. I keep the strop in my bedside table drawer and run the blade across it a few times before bed each night.

 

[ldw308]

I use a Lansky and a whetstone . The Lanky works really well , will sharpen most any knife. The whetstone takes some practice but will also do the job . The most important thing I guess is to not left the blade get really dull . I also finish the sharpening on a leather strop .

 

[Cmp1]

Here ya go,,,,lots of good info and tools,,,,

http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?cat=1&p=43072

 

[baddave]

I use a Lansky and a whetstone . The Lanky works really well , will sharpen most any knife. The whetstone takes some practice but will also do the job . The most important thing I guess is to not left the blade get really dull . I also finish the sharpening on a leather strop .

Hey Idw380- i was hoping someone would mention a leather strop as i've been thinking about that since i saw a guy do it on forged in fire.. could you elaborate.. i know barbers and others have been doing it for a long time

 

[Anvil Head]

I was working as a forester during those days, fresh out of UGA. Loved working in that area because the hunting and fishing were so good. Did a little side work out of the sporting goods store that David ran down on the south end of town. Gunsmithing, reel repair, etc. Sold a few blackpowder rifles quite a few knives during those years out of his store. Probably passed each other many times in and around town. Shot a lot of ducks down just below Wiggens and gaught a lot of bull reds down that way as well.

Now on the knives - the necker sounds like a scandi grind. It can be redressed fairly easily, looks like plenty of steel to work with. Kind of agree with Watermedic on the D2, pretty hard to "roll" that steel if heat-treated properly, unless maybe at sometime someone "cowboy" sterilized the blade in a campfire (happens more than one would expect). Quick way to ruin the temper on most blades.

My take on using a steel to dress a blade is that most watch too much TV and start whacking away like a chef. The steel is a micro round file that removes material quite quickly and roughly. Still one has to maintain a proper angle to get proper results and is, again, a practiced skill. Have repaired the edges on hundreds of knives that met their temporary demise on a steel. The tendency with most when using a steel is to be a bit too pronounced on the angle to start with, then the next time the angle is accentuated over and over until the edge angle is more like a cold chisel than a knife. Cutting becomes a chore and almost none doable.
Need to have the edge redressed by a knife maker back to the original angle and learn to use a flat stone to maintain that angle.

I totally understand using a knife as a tool. I have carried and used them all my life (so far). Been carrying sense I was 5. Learned early how to maintain a cutting edge from my G-dad, he only sharpened mine once so I could see how. Like I said practice, practice, practice.

I am sending a pm about the necker.

 

[baddave]

this is enough for me - thanks anyway

 

[ldw308]

I use an old barber strap. Its about 3 inches wide, had a rough side and a smooth side. After sharpening a blade I pull it across the rough at the same angle 6-7 times , then turn the strap over and pull the blade across the smooth side 6-7 times. Not being a smart aleck just remember to pull the blade across the strap not push into the strap.

 

[Anvil Head]

It's a good point and reminder Idw, I've seen a lot of strops ruined by people you'd think would know better.
Leather stropping is a great final dressing of the edge, pulling that last little bit of a burr off the edge from sharpening and polishes the micro edge. Not really removing worn or damaged edge issues, it will only work for so many times.
I keep several hanging around the shop for those quickie dressings. They are easily made from plain old belts one can find hanging at thrift shops for a $. Mounted one 18" length to a small paddle like board that I load with rouge and use to dress my leather cutting tools. Eventually some methodology will be necessary to remove metal and reset the edge geometry for the blade to continue to work efficiently and correctly.
Any of the devices mentioned above will accomplish this, some more aggressively than others. Not seen any that are totally foolproof, all will require practice to produce that desired "edge". Find the one that works for you and practice, practice, practice ... until you get it right.

 

[baddave]

i had an old belt in my leather working box and tried it .. THAT'S what i've been needing . always have gotten my knives sharp but not quite like a razor . now i canthat really dries my tears

 

[Knotwild]

Anvilehead:
I am sure we probably passed each other. I was just driving then, but he dog hunted deer on Cheehaw Combahee. When it came to guns, I always saved my money and went to RPM Gunshop in Charleston. Since you were a forester, you probably met Mr. Paul Warren who owned/ran the sawmill in Williams.

I've been thinking about this sharpening thing and trying to work with steels but I can't get the angle right. I think the Lansky will help me learn what the angle I was to sharpen at feels like.

One thing I really learned here is that the temptation is to start out to coarse on a blade and that I should be using the steel regularly to keep it sharp.

For the life of me I can't get the hang out of using a kitchen steel from the handle out to the tip. And I am a little ticked off that I just threw out an old belt that would have been perfect to strop with.

Thanks for the solutions. They make sense.

 

[Anvil Head]

Can't say I actually remember Mr. Warren, but I visited that mill many times while in SC. (in and out of most of them every week). We chased deer down around Greenpond and over along the Salkahatchee. Biggest came from over north of RoundO, hunting with the Creel brothers along the Edisto. Lot of good hunting back then.

Not trying to start anything with T up above, but I learned using a steel to dress an edge working around butchers (both brothers), fish mongers (grouper boat), and chefs for which I've made many knives. All of them worked the blade from tip to handle like trying to skin a thin barked stick. Only time I use a steel is when butchering game or cleaning fish and need a quick tuneup on the edge. The steel is expedient in these circumstances because you don't have to stop what your doing. Just a couple of strokes and back to work. The way most "old school" steels were designed with a distal taper toward the tip made drawing the blade toward you work to your advantage on maintaining proper angle. I have noticed a lot of the newer style steels are pretty much non-tapered so it may not matter with them. I would practice not pulling all the way to the handle, but make sure you are getting full length of the blade on each stroke in a sweeping curved motion. Biggest thing is to not look for the steel to sharpen the blade just as a means of dressing the edge. All those folks I learned from sharpened their blades on big india stones or the like and only used the steels for quick fix.

 

[godogs57]

Pretty country by RoundO isn't it?

 

[Anvil Head]

Was in the early 70's, haven't had the op to go back.

 

[Knotwild]

Round O is still pretty, but Summerville is creeping west pretty quick. Also near Ravenel. I love working in the Bennetts Point area.

I found a very old steel that has what I can only describe as a "frosted" finish that touches up my knives pretty well. It is a little smaller than the diameter of a pencil.

I wish I had started learning about this stuff years ago.

Merry Christmas everyone and thanks for the advice.

 

[Knotwild]

Update: I was listening to you guys. I touched up my two main knives with the old frosted steel and I was able to do all my Christmas packaging with my D2 Rat II instead of scissors.

Many thanks.