What is faith?

RH Clark · May 26, 2016

I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and I've come to the conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is, much less how to operate in faith, so let's talk about it a little and see if we can shed some light and clear up some wrong thinking.

1. What is faith?
Hebrews 11:1 defines faith as the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. I submit to you that what most Christians call faith, is nothing more than hope. Most times a Christian is hoping that God will do something about their situation. They don't know what or why, or even how but they are hoping and calling it faith. Where is the substance? Where is the evidence of their faith?

I submit that actual faith comes from hearing and the hearing of God's word. Faith is a knowing and assurance in God's word, so much so that you will act on it, and believe that word over even what your natural senses tell you.

The faith of Abraham hoped against hope when his body was old and Sara's womb was dead with age. He believed God's word even though what God said wasn't possible naturally. Abraham and Sarah had to act on that faith. They didn't have a child at a hundred years old by just laying down and waiting on God to do something. Faith in God always has substance and evidence attached to it.

Later we will look at some more bible examples of faith. I hope to get some good comments and help from you folks too. Thanks for your consideration.

EverGreen1231 · May 26, 2016

RH Clark said:
I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and I've come to the conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is, much less how to operate in faith, so let's talk about it a little and see if we can shed some light and clear up some wrong thinking.

1. What is faith?
Hebrews 11:1 defines faith as the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. I submit to you that what most Christians call faith, is nothing more than hope. Most times a Christian is hoping that God will do something about their situation. They don't know what or why, or even how but they are hoping and calling it faith. Where is the substance? Where is the evidence of their faith?

I submit that actual faith comes from hearing and the hearing of God's word. Faith is a knowing and assurance in God's word, so much so that you will act on it, and believe that word over even what your natural senses tell you.

The faith of Abraham hoped against hope when his body was old and Sara's womb was dead with age. He believed God's word even though what God said wasn't possible naturally. Abraham and Sarah had to act on that faith. They didn't have a child at a hundred years old by just laying down and waiting on God to do something. Faith in God always has substance and evidence attached to it.

Later we will look at some more bible examples of faith. I hope to get some good comments and help from you folks too. Thanks for your consideration.

It seems in many places where the Bible uses the word "hope" it's not being used in the modern connotation of an anticipated likelihood that may or may not come to pass, but an expected eventuality.

but sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

Here, the hope is not something that might happen, or some occurrence that could take place in the certain circumstances, but knowledge of facts; this is faith.

RH Clark · May 26, 2016

EverGreen1231 said:
It seems in many places where the Bible uses the word "hope" it's not being used in the modern connotation of an anticipated likelihood that may or may not come to pass, but an expected eventuality.

Here, the hope is not something that might happen, or some occurrence that could take place in the certain circumstances, but knowledge of facts; this is faith.

Yes, I agree. Let's add the Hebrews definition to that and say that faith gives an actual substance to that hope.

It's a substance that causes a person to believe and act differently than they would without that substance.

Israel · May 26, 2016

Faith is what allows you to survive having done it all wrong, when you imagine you have done it right.
Faith is knowing that when Jesus says "Father forgive them, they know not what they do" I am the "they".
Faith is what reveals a man sees nothing until he does, knows nothing until it is made known, considers nothing until he is told to.
Faith is what saved Abraham after listening to his wife and begetting Ismael. And then finding God still faithful to his word in Isaac.
Faith is what considered Hagar and Ismael when cast out.
Faith is what showed Abraham he needn't be clever nor exercise his wits to the preserving of his household before the King to whom he said "she is my sister".
Faith is what allows a man to deal in truth among men when that very truth will be turned against the speaker and used as a device of weapon. (Tear down this temple) And the speaker has the faith that has already informed him of this.
Faith is what allows a man to believe in the great gathering to God even as he becomes a stranger to himself and all others in the seeming profoundest of driftings apart.
Faith is what allows a man who knows well the scriptures to have faith for what is beyond his understanding of them.
Faith is what allows a man to know...what he does not know.
For faith is of God, in Christ.

gordon 2 · May 26, 2016

"I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and I've come to the conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is, much less how to operate in faith, so let's talk about it a little and see if we can shed some light and clear up some wrong thinking." Quote RH Clark

I would be interested in knowing what is the bases for your conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is....? What do the majority of Christians believe regarding faith according to you?

As for me, a Christian, faith has its genesis in our Lord's Resurrection, especially that Peter was not smart enough a witness to speak from both sides of his mouth and therefore Jesus is He whom Isaiah wrote about to the Hebrews..." He comes Himself and will save you." And my faith comes from patience and charity which are aspects of love--which have their profoundest meanings in the classrooms of the Holy Spirit.

Israel · May 26, 2016

gordon 2 said:
"I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and I've come to the conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is, much less how to operate in faith, so let's talk about it a little and see if we can shed some light and clear up some wrong thinking." Quote RH Clark

I would be interested in knowing what is the bases for your conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is....? What do the majority of Christians believe regarding faith according to you?

As for me, a Christian, faith has its genesis in our Lord's Resurrection, especially that Peter was not smart enough a witness to speak from both sides of his mouth and therefore Jesus is He whom Isaiah wrote about to the Hebrews..." He comes Himself and will save you." And my faith comes from patience and charity which are aspects of love--which have their profoundest meanings in the classrooms of the Holy Spirit.

Ain't that a kicker?
It could even be:

Faith is what even allows a man to be saved from himself when he is sure he has faith, and equally sure few, if any, others do.

Artfuldodger · May 26, 2016

When prayer's aren't answered it's because most Christians don't know what faith is? Don't they have faith in the things hoped for? We can only have hope in "expected eventuality."

Let's use the example of a wife praying that her drunkard husband give up the bottle. Can she not have faith in the hope that God can intervene? If prayer is only for "expected eventuality" then why pray?

If I get deathly sick, I'm praying for "intervention" not the expected eventuality of sure death.

gordon 2 · May 26, 2016

Artfuldodger said:
When prayer's aren't answered it's because most Christians don't know what faith is? Don't they have faith in the things hoped for? We can only have hope in "expected eventuality."

Let's use the example of a wife praying that her drunkard husband give up the bottle. Can she not have faith in the hope that God can intervene? If prayer is only for "expected eventuality" then why pray?

If I get deathly sick, I'm praying for "intervention" not the expected eventuality of sure death.

The things hoped for in faith are more than not the promises of God. Regards prayers I understand that God knows what we require before we ask... we don't always pray for what is required.

Artfuldodger · May 26, 2016

Is faith in God for salvation different than faith needed for God's intervention?

EverGreen1231 · May 26, 2016

Artfuldodger said:
Is faith in God for salvation different than faith needed for God's intervention?

I wouldn't think so, but I may not understand your question. You either believe God or not.

gordon 2 · May 26, 2016

Artfuldodger said:
Is faith in God for salvation different than faith needed for God's intervention?

Possibly because lots of people thank God for unanswered prayers--especially cancer patients who bargain for time to get the kids to school ( an extra three yrs) Because they think they have only a yr or two and are still kicking around 30 yrs after the fact.

RH Clark · May 26, 2016

gordon 2 said:
"I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and I've come to the conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is, much less how to operate in faith, so let's talk about it a little and see if we can shed some light and clear up some wrong thinking." Quote RH Clark

I would be interested in knowing what is the bases for your conclusion that the majority of Christians don't have a clue what faith is....? What do the majority of Christians believe regarding faith according to you?

As for me, a Christian, faith has its genesis in our Lord's Resurrection, especially that Peter was not smart enough a witness to speak from both sides of his mouth and therefore Jesus is He whom Isaiah wrote about to the Hebrews..." He comes Himself and will save you." And my faith comes from patience and charity which are aspects of love--which have their profoundest meanings in the classrooms of the Holy Spirit.

Because I listen to how people pray and what they say after they have prayed. A man prays for God to heal him of cancer but based on what? Does he know a single scripture concerning his healing or is he just hoping? After praying he continually talks about how bad his cancer is, yet Jesus told us to believe when we pray. Did that man believe anything happened when he prayed or is he just hoping that sometime in the future maybe God will heal him?

God certainly knows what we need before we pray but you will never have faith in generalities. I listened to a man pray just last Sunday because the church has need of a van. It was basically just an acknowledgement that God knows what we need. God is never moved by need, only by faith. A better way to have prayed would have been going to God with his promise and expecting God to keep his word. Then thanking God for his promise even if you can't yet see it in the physical realm. That's where the force of patience comes in.

Let's talk about patience and charity. Both are necessary to activate faith but faith comes from believing the promises of God. Patience does not mean waiting until God does what he has promised. Patience is continuing to believe the promise is true no matter what the circumstance says. Charity or the God kind of love is the avenue through which faith works. Faith workth by love.

RH Clark · May 26, 2016

Artfuldodger said:
When prayer's aren't answered it's because most Christians don't know what faith is? Don't they have faith in the things hoped for? We can only have hope in "expected eventuality."

Let's use the example of a wife praying that her drunkard husband give up the bottle. Can she not have faith in the hope that God can intervene? If prayer is only for "expected eventuality" then why pray?

If I get deathly sick, I'm praying for "intervention" not the expected eventuality of sure death.

The wife praying for the drunken husband would be better off using the authority God has given her to battle spiritual forces that are influencing her husband then asking Jesus to overpower a man's free will. Jesus is seated at God's right hand expecting until his enemies be made his footstool. Jesus has already conquered those enemies and given us authority over them. He is expecting us to place those enemies under his and our feet.

Concerning your healing, you should have hope but it should be hope in what Jesus has already done about your healing and in so doing you should stand on those promises. An unsure hope for what Jesus might do is not faith at all.

hobbs27 · May 26, 2016

Faith...
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

RH Clark · May 26, 2016

hobbs27 said:
Faith...
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

Good scripture application my friend. That's exactly what I'm talking about. A lot of Christians want to believe it when they see it. That's the way the world believes. Bible faith believes it because God said it, even before it can be seen.

gordon 2 · May 26, 2016

RH Clark said:
Because I listen to how people pray and what they say after they have prayed. A man prays for God to heal him of cancer but based on what? Does he know a single scripture concerning his healing or is he just hoping? After praying he continually talks about how bad his cancer is, yet Jesus told us to believe when we pray. Did that man believe anything happened when he prayed or is he just hoping that sometime in the future maybe God will heal him?

God certainly knows what we need before we pray but you will never have faith in generalities. I listened to a man pray just last Sunday because the church has need of a van. It was basically just an acknowledgement that God knows what we need. God is never moved by need, only by faith. A better way to have prayed would have been going to God with his promise and expecting God to keep his word. Then thanking God for his promise even if you can't yet see it in the physical realm. That's where the force of patience comes in.

Let's talk about patience and charity. Both are necessary to activate faith but faith comes from believing the promises of God. Patience does not mean waiting until God does what he has promised. Patience is continuing to believe the promise is true no matter what the circumstance says. Charity or the God kind of love is the avenue through which faith works. Faith workth by love.

So what your getting at is faith healing and prayers in faith to receive something as opposed to faith in general promises?

I have studied faith healing somewhat and although faith is often accompanied in healing on the part of the person receiving or in receiving due to a prayer, sometimes healing and blessings have happened to people who were just desperate and had no faith. In some cases they believed post a miraculous answer, but some still did not believe and yet they received blessings.

RH Clark · May 26, 2016

gordon 2 said:
So what your getting at is faith healing and prayers in faith to receive something as opposed to faith in general promises?

Yes and no. I think faith is faith. You can have faith for all God's promises. What I'm saying more is to let faith be more specific. If I needed extra money, just knowing that God is good won't likely help me any, but if I am a giver, I can stand on Luke 6:38, that I have given and I can have faith that it will be given again to me, pressed down and running over.
I have studied faith healing somewhat and although faith is often accompanied in healing on the part of the person receiving or in receiving due to a prayer, sometimes healing and blessings have happened to people who were just desperate and had no faith. In some cases they believed post a miraculous answer, but some still did not believe and yet they received blessings.

I don't suppose I know exactly what you mean here. Some didn't believe at all but received anyway? Yes, miracles do happen and we know the scripture says that God makes the rain to fall on both the righteous and the unrighteous. However the scripture also says that Jesus himself could do no mighty works in his home town because of their unbelief Mark 6:5. Let me say that again, not Jesus wouldn't but Jesus couldn't because of their unbelief.

gordon 2 · May 26, 2016

RH Clark said:
I don't suppose I know exactly what you mean here. Some didn't believe at all but received anyway? Yes, miracles do happen and we know the scripture says that God makes the rain to fall on both the righteous and the unrighteous. However the scripture also says that Jesus himself could do no mighty works in his home town because of their unbelief Mark 6:5. Let me say that again, not Jesus wouldn't but Jesus couldn't because of their unbelief.

Yes, but I think if one studies faith healing for example, people have done more than Jesus did and for people who had no faith in some cases.

I have read that at least one faith healer claimed that healing was to further people's faith and that people who had faith more than not were not healed, but rather it was expected that due their faith they knew to " suffer" as per Christ 's suffering due the "flesh" and "world.

Romans 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Also, their is an understanding in Christianity that our Lord's miracles were for purpose of sign so that the jews would believe he was the promised Saviour.

Isaiah 35:4-7King James Version (KJV)

4 Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you.

5 Then the eyes of the blind shall be opened, and the ears of the deaf shall be unstopped.

6 Then shall the lame man leap as an hart, and the tongue of the dumb sing: for in the wilderness shall waters break out, and streams in the desert.

7 And the parched ground shall become a pool, and the thirsty land springs of water: in the habitation of dragons, where each lay, shall be grass with reeds and rushes.

King James Version (KJV)

Artfuldodger · May 26, 2016

RH Clark said:
Good scripture application my friend. That's exactly what I'm talking about. A lot of Christians want to believe it when they see it. That's the way the world believes. Bible faith believes it because God said it, even before it can be seen.

Then it would be wrong to ask for prayers that end with "seen" results?

Romans 1:19
They know the truth about God because he has made it obvious to them.

Things unseen? We must admit there is some evidence that God exists.

Artfuldodger · May 26, 2016

RH Clark said:
I don't suppose I know exactly what you mean here. Some didn't believe at all but received anyway? Yes, miracles do happen and we know the scripture says that God makes the rain to fall on both the righteous and the unrighteous. However the scripture also says that Jesus himself could do no mighty works in his home town because of their unbelief Mark 6:5. Let me say that again, not Jesus wouldn't but Jesus couldn't because of their unbelief.

Could those same people in Jesus' home town have the faith to believe? An individual or two perhaps? I understand one must have faith in order to believe but is it wrong to ask for God to help you overcome things even if the odds are against you for overcoming without his intervention?

Should we only have faith to pray for unseen things like everlasting life and not for seen things like financial peace? I'm not really following your biblical definition of faith only being for unseen things. It does take more faith to believe in unseen things but I think part of faith could also be faith in seen things such as the result of prayer.

We pray for God to watch over our loved ones when they travel. When they reach their destination unscathed, that is a "seen" event. That is faith in God too.

What is faith?

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