Back to basics

christianhunter said:

Because the devout Jews do not believe The LORD JESUS,is the messiah they are waiting for,but they will find out HE is.

Click to expand...

Yes they will. They are temp. blinded so's that us'ns the unclean gentiles can be grafted into the vine. Not because they are stupid, not because of anything....that's the way God worked it.

Short version.

Acts 10:27-29 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain



27And as he talked with him, he went in, and found many that were come together.

28And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean.

Romans 11:18-20 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain



18Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

19Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.

20Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:


John 12:39-41 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain



39Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

40He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

41These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.

Dixie Dawg said:

Really....??? So if you showed up at church one morning and the pastor said, you know, today instead of wine, we are actually going to use real human blood for communion... you wouldn't have a problem with it? If yes, then why?

Click to expand...

No, because that is nasty.

Eating blood has absolutely NOTHING to do with Jewish food laws. If you don't know this, then you probably should go back and review the Torah again. In fact, it's right there in Leviticus 11, completely surrounding the verse you use as proof of the (non) requirement for blood sacrifice.

Click to expand...

I don't remember what I was thinking when I responded about food laws to that part of the quote. Maybe I didn't read it all the way and just saw the eating and drinking part? I dunno.

I do not eat Jesus or drink his blood at communion. No offense to by Catholic brethern, but I think Jesus makes it pretty clear it is symbolic.

Dixie Dawg said:

And Jesus wasn't talking about the 'blood' of the grape (juice)... he said specifically that it represented his own blood.

Click to expand...

No, I think he makes it pretty clear what is actually in the cup.


27 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. 28 For this is My blood of the new<SUP>[c]</SUP> covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father’s kingdom.”

farmasis said:

No, I think he makes it pretty clear what is actually in the cup.


27 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. 28 For this is My blood of the new<SUP>[c]</SUP> covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father’s kingdom.”

Click to expand...

Great way to put it.

I guess what boggles my mind is that salvation is basically handed to us on a silver platter. We don't really have to do all that much.
The OT is made up of so many things to do that it makes me dizzy just even trying to comprehend it.
Mostly what I get from the OT though is the pathway to Jesus. Jesus makes it too easy to love Him, too easy to follow and believe in Him that I just can't help myself.

farmasis said:

No, I think he makes it pretty clear what is actually in the cup.


27 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. 28 For this is My blood of the new<SUP>[c]</SUP> covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father’s kingdom.”

Click to expand...

I guess Jesus forgot about his promise....

John 19:29 Now a vessel full of sour wine was sitting there; and they filled a sponge with sour wine, put [it] on hyssop, and put [it] to His mouth.

John 19:30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished!" And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.

I'm heading to the mountains for the day... y'all have fun!

"Light,in the absence of sight,illuminates nothing.Many have eyes,but do not have sight."
Your signature!
How ironic,or is it?
JESUS is the light of the world,He illuminates Heaven!
Many have eyes,but do not have sight.Very close to what He said to the religious leaders,who mocked HIM,2000 years ago,and carries over until this day.You have really answered all of your own questions,with your signature,and you just can't see the LIGHT.
I pray that you do.
The vinegar was used for medicinal purposes then,one of them pain,to prolong HIS suffering,as it is still used for ailments today by some people.
I pray that you see the light,and enjoy the mountains that JESUS created,because" Nothing was created,that was not created by HIM."
Michael

farmasis said:

No, I think he makes it pretty clear what is actually in the cup.


27 Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. 28 For this is My blood of the new<SUP>[c]</SUP> covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father’s kingdom.”

Click to expand...

"Symbolic" and "representative" - those are the key words in understanding the Welch's grape juice and the little cracker.Pretty simple,actually.

Dixie Dawg said:

I don't see it as making it up as I go... I see it as similar to how I am in my political views... I can't commit to either Democrat or Republican because neither one do I agree with 100%... so I'm Independent

And no, I'm not absolutely convinced... as I said in the previous post, there is something that was posted within the last 3 days that has me re-thinking a few things and having to do more reading and prayer about. So I always learn something new from these discussions, that's why I come on this part of the forum.






I'm heading out of town tonight for the weekend and then next week I have clinicals, so I probably won't be on much or posting much, so the rest of the things that were posted (like by farmasis) I'll have to read more and can talk about when I have more time if I don't get to them tonight. Just didn't want anyone to think I was ignoring anything God bless!!

Click to expand...

God bless you,too,D.D. May you have safe travel - spiritual AND automotive!

christianhunter said:

Also show me the verse,where HE received it,my BIBLE says he didn't.

Click to expand...

I did.... right under the first verse. John 19:30
Not sure which version your bible is, but every version at Blueletterbible.org said he received it. And they have every version from the KJV, NKJV, NASB, NIV, Youngs Literal Translation, etc.

rangerdave said:

God bless you,too,D.D. May you have safe travel - spiritual AND automotive!

Click to expand...

Thank you! It was a gorgeous day and we had a great time
I can't stay on much tonight to reply to much else, my clinicals start in the morning so I've got to turn in 'early' tonight

I'll try and bounce in and out when I can this week
Hope y'all have a good one!

I'm ashamed,I made a statement without checking first,thats what the verse says,and I will not twist words,and change the meaning.May The LORD JESUS forgive me,for misquoting The Holy Word,it was not intentional,and I publicly ask HIS forgiveness!
You still remain very selective,as to what you quote,I promise I will never rebuke again,without first checking.FATHER forgive me.I also deleted the error from the previous post.

Dixie Dawg said:

I did.... right under the first verse. John 19:30
Not sure which version your bible is, but every version at Blueletterbible.org said he received it. And they have every version from the KJV, NKJV, NASB, NIV, Youngs Literal Translation, etc.

Click to expand...

I don't want to be nickpicking, but we do not know that Jesus drank it. John said he recieved it. That could mean that he drank, or simply that he recieved the offer, but not that he had to accept it. He could have taken it in the mouth and tasted it, and spit it out just as he did with the vinegar mixed with gall before.

In Matthew, Mark, and Luke, it was only offered. (Matt 27:47) (Mark 15:36) (Luke 23:36)

Also, the substances were not the same.

The sour wine (vinegar) was much different from what the fruit of the vine (wine or grape juice) used in the passover of the last supper.

Jesus said he would not drink of this fruit of the vine until with them in heaven. Because it was a communion it sacred in the fact of what it was being used for. Just as a glass of wine drank at a dinner is not the same as one at communion, even though it is the same substance because of it's purpose.

farmasis said:

Just as a glass of wine drank at a dinner is not the same as one at communion, even though it is the same substance because of it's purpose.

Click to expand...

Absolutely!