ambush80
Senior Member
That one right there. Thanks for answering the question almost exactly as I would have.
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Case against Creationist
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That one right there. Thanks for answering the question almost exactly as I would have.
Madman
Senior Member
NCHillbilly.....
I have no idea. ......... I think it is possible that maybe every religion is describing a piece of it, like the blind men and the elephant.
But then you would be saying that all the blind men are wrong and you are right.
NCHillbilly....
Maybe no one is right or wrong.
someone is wrong because they are fundamentally all different, no one is right is a possibility.
I have no idea. ......... I think it is possible that maybe every religion is describing a piece of it, like the blind men and the elephant.
But then you would be saying that all the blind men are wrong and you are right.
NCHillbilly....
Maybe no one is right or wrong.
someone is wrong because they are fundamentally all different, no one is right is a possibility.
No, I am saying that maybe none of us are right. Maybe we are incapable of understanding God. Perhaps God transcends all religions.
Well, you cook pretty good, too.
Israel
BANNED
Whether one believes men are limited to, (at best in their seeking to understand and likewise be manifestly understood by that "omnipotent power") the promulgation of a religion, is of no consequence.
That, there, is as much presumption as found anywhere.
And all presumption is of no consequence.
And if any presume Jesus has come to start a religion...even "christianity" in particular, that presumption also, is of no consequence.
Nothing flushes out presumption like the cross. Nothing flushes out what is of no consequence as the work of Jesus Christ.
That, there, is as much presumption as found anywhere.
And all presumption is of no consequence.
And if any presume Jesus has come to start a religion...even "christianity" in particular, that presumption also, is of no consequence.
Nothing flushes out presumption like the cross. Nothing flushes out what is of no consequence as the work of Jesus Christ.
bullethead
Of the hard cast variety
Liquid Plumber and Draino work as good on similar substances.
1eyefishing
...just joking, seriously.
Hey, I was just cruising through this thread and others like it trying to get a handle on some of the people who are professional arguers. Daylight to dark carrying on six different arguments a day every day it seems and none of their conversations are anything else but an argument. Not naming names nor bashing anybody, just taking my own notes about some people that are not worth arguing with. Anyway, I saw this here post by hillbilly and just had to say,
"Hear,hear, this is the way it will be in my heaven."
Well, I guess someone might come on here and tell me how it really is going to be in heaven...
Please don't. This sub-forum is for the A.A.A.'s
I would be more interested to know if anyone ever gets converted over from the AAA column to the Christianity column or vice versa.
Carry on... Respect to all...
ambush80
Senior Member
Hey, I was just cruising through this thread and others like it trying to get a handle on some of the people who are professional arguers. Daylight to dark carrying on six different arguments a day every day it seems and none of their conversations are anything else but an argument. Not naming names nor bashing anybody, just taking my own notes about some people that are not worth arguing with. Anyway, I saw this here post by hillbilly and just had to say,
"Hear,hear, this is the way it will be in my heaven."
Well, I guess someone might come on here and tell me how it really is going to be in heaven...
Please don't. This sub-forum is for the A.A.A.'s
I would be more interested to know if anyone ever gets converted over from the AAA column to the Christianity column or vice versa.
Carry on... Respect to all...
A guy named TripleXXX became a Christian. He fell in love and married a Christian girl. I would guess that had something to do with it.
Israel
BANNED
Hey Hillbilly...Ya got a minute?
Jesus says some stuff it's very hard to "get around"... especially if you start to read it. I'll say...for me, anyway. If only me. I'll concede that. I'll leave the broad brush painting to Him, one, for whom I believe He is and has every right to, and secondly, I'm sloppy enough when just trying to paint a baseboard. No need to encourage someone like that to go "whole hog"...if anything, a painter like that needs to be told "trim it up".
I've got no obligation to represent Christianity. Don't really know what that means, anyway. When I see all the problems accruing to just seeking to understand one man, and the things he has said, I'd be more than a liar to think I could answer for probably a billion others today, let alone all those who have gone before. I might as well admit, too, that in the matter of obligation I've got no obligation to even try to answer for Jesus, He pretty well states men answer...only for themselves. It's a curious thing about obligation...we tend to try to equally burden everyone if we are under it.
We don't much like the guy...(do we?...should I just say "I"?)...that sleeps in the back of the lifeboat, when everyone else is rowing furiously to make landfall. And if that "I" does indeed become a "we" ("hey Roger...see that guy in the back sleeping while we're rowing our butts off? whatta you think of that?") stuff usually follows.
But yeah, "I" can't say that always happens. After all, Roger could say "yeah, that's my brother, he's paralysed from the neck down, mind yer business and keep rowing if you think that's what you should be doing...and leave me to what I think I should be doing! Besides, my brother's narcoleptic, too!" Funny? Who knows?
So, if you can allow for that, I can easily allow for the "benevolent Polynesian" (or whatever you may have had in mind in your response). I can't disavow reading this "I haven't come for the righteous, but to call sinners to repentance". It's way too late for me to think I fall into anything but the second group...but maybe that smiling, affable, and harmless "remote Islander" really does exist, I also can't discount that based on what Jesus has said.
If I have any "job" in response to what Jesus has said (and firstly and lastly now, it's for me to just believe Him in any and all at any moment) I sure can't discount there could be a "righteous" section of the boat. Yeah, it's true, there's all sorts of other stuff that gets said, but I can only know what I have learned sitting in the "sinner" section. Or especially for me, at least the (possibly, only one) seat. I do know there's at least one sinner seat. (yeah, it could well be true Jesus came only for me..."that" sinner)
Will I be jealous of the righteous (that might well exist? but for whom he did not need to come?)
There's a question, huh? Cause I know that jealousy, have tasted it. Can't say savoring it has ever led to anything...but more sin. Leaves a man like me in an odd place if I say Jesus takes away sin but I regret I need Him so much. ("do you want the cure...or don't you? why you still "looking round the boat?" could be a pretty direct question to someone like that)
Seems like any desire to rid myself of that need (if I do indeed regret needing Him...so very very much) could well leave me sicker...than when found. But hey...it's true...that's "just me". Learning how to bear my need (that I can't deny...and would be stupid to regret) without trying to foist it on everyone else. Yeah, that "obligation sharing thing" often rears its head. "If I'm obliged...then buddy, you are, too!" Who knows, right? Seems an odd way to go about sharing what most like to call "a gift", huh?
Maybe that "need" to look around the boat to see what everyone else is doing (who's sleeping, who's slacking?) is a direct result of feeling burdened. We could say perhaps "well, it's just a pretty normal thing to see who is "helping"...and who is either not...or perceived to be in opposition...even...like rowing backwards!"
Practically speaking it probably happens...but that's not really the question...the question is why? That's kinda the biggy, always, or am I wrong? "Why"? do we do what we do, think like we do, observe what we do (and it seems inescapable, observe others in "what they do"?)
Can it be as simple as "I can't seem to get away from being affected?"
And I am simply the effect of all those affections?
But I don't like some of what affects me...I truly don't. How can I "clean slate it?" How can I ever really know who this person is I can't ever get away from...me...? (Is it true...as it seems "to me"...what a friend at work said? He's worked in x-ray for about 30 years. "No ones x-rays are more interesting to a person...than their own?") He also said this (as I have heard it elsewhere in some other iterations) "There are only two reasons anyone ever does anything...the one they tell you is the reason...and the real one" Cynical? Or closer to true?
Who knows themselves so well as to say "I know exactly why I do and say everything I do"? And who is not, at least in one sense...interested? Or, at the very least, curious?
So, for me, at any rate (if you care to call me a "christian" I don't mind, but I don't know what that means) no one has ever told me the simple truth like Jesus. As plainly as can be said he told me all I didn't think I could ever want to hear...but because I know it's true...I really can't deny it. I am just an effect of all the things affecting me. That's it. I can't make anything of myself out of myself...to be anything but that. I am just a target you hear go "plinggggg" when it is hit. That's all.
At the end of Tombstone Doc Holliday says "Wyatt, you are the only man who has ever given me hope". I think I like true things when spoken. I don't think Doc would have had to say "hey, I also have to admit, I didn't always act in hope or speak in hope, I sometimes acted of fear, and anger, and jealousy, and bitterness...but to you Wyatt, it's important I let you know what you mean to me...despite all the other garbage you have no doubt seen of me".
So I can have little other response myself to the only man who has ever both...told me the truth about myself, and also given me hope at the same time. I'm just an effect...nothing more. But...it's okay. To just be that.
So, in this little pool of AAA postings...what "of your effect"...affects me?
Yeah...it's something Jesus said about sheep and goats. You kinda called it to mind...do you know it?
When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy[a] angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’
“Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’
“Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’
“Then they also will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
Do you notice anything?
The sheep didn't say "Oh yeah, Jesus...we read about your parable of sheep and goats "in the Bible", and so we made "Feed the Hungry Ministry International...LLC" and "Clothe the Naked of the World...LLC" and "Visit the Sick for Jesus!...LLC"...cause after all...we knew we couldn't "get into Heaven" without trying to do what you told us.
No, the "righteous" didn't even know what they were doing...when they were doing it. I don't think they even knew why...they just "did".
I could blame the world...or the devil...or some such for affecting me in such a way as to tell me "you're smart (or at least...should be)...and smart people should know why they do what they do" (and I don't think I am the only man ever "pressed" [felt obligated]...to be smart...or at least smart enough to "know what you're doing"). But, the truth is out about me, who could deny it? I haven't a clue.
But the same one who told me I'm just an effect, absolutely clueless (how could he get away with that...when I'm ready to fight anyone else about it?) Also said this: "Forgive them Father, they know not what they do".
There's a forgiveness to be found, only found...toward the clueless.
I have learned...I can't afford to forfeit that.
I don't think smart people get "tricked" by Jesus, they just may find out they only tricked themselves.
It lets me be...without me having to supply my reason for being. Or why I even do...anything.
Like this.
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bullethead
Of the hard cast variety
NC Hillbilly, you have just been the victim of a random blogging.
Just found this. Wow. I think about half of that went right over my head and the rest of it is still in orbit somewhere.
If I understand any of what you're getting at, it's somewhat in line with what I was saying earlier - when I was told in no uncertain terms that works and deeds or being a good person doesn't make you righteous or able to enter heaven or avoid roasting in He!!; that only performing the repentance ritual will get you there.
I don't know if I'm a sheep or a goat. I don't call myself a Christian, but I was raised by a Baptist preacher; so I don't have anything against Christianity unless it's pushed on me. I don't follow it, but I respect it if you do.
There hasn't anybody ever went hungry much around me, for sure. I would help you row the lifeboat, but I didn't go bail this feller out of jail that called me one time wanting me to; because he was a meth head and a thief and I figured prison was a good enough place for him.
Israel
BANNED
Just found this. Wow. I think about half of that went right over my head and the rest of it is still in orbit somewhere.
If I understand any of what you're getting at, it's somewhat in line with what I was saying earlier - when I was told in no uncertain terms that works and deeds or being a good person doesn't make you righteous or able to enter heaven or avoid roasting in He!!; that only performing the repentance ritual will get you there.
I don't know if I'm a sheep or a goat. I don't call myself a Christian, but I was raised by a Baptist preacher; so I don't have anything against Christianity unless it's pushed on me. I don't follow it, but I respect it if you do.
There hasn't anybody ever went hungry much around me, for sure. I would help you row the lifeboat, but I didn't go bail this feller out of jail that called me one time wanting me to; because he was a meth head and a thief and I figured prison was a good enough place for him.
Hey, thanks for reading and responding.
As to not knowing of whether one is sheep or goat, I get that.
I've been around a certain set of folks...seems mostly my whole life, who, in one form or another were more glad about being "not one of them" than they were glad to be alive. I can't blame "those folks"...cause I'm pretty sure the attraction to me was more about my wanting to be "not like others" than anything I could blame them for.
So friends were chosen, position and estate, more according to that than anything else. I've always wanted to get rid of the feeling of being an "outsider", by selling myself off to most anyone who would help me feel like an "insider".
When I was put in special classes I could tell myself "at least I'm not like the dumber kids".
When I had no money at all, I could find a way to tell myself "at least I'm not like the greedy folks". When I finally came face to face with Jesus, (or at least thought I did) I found a whole other group I could sell myself to. Things seemed fine till something happened.
I can't put my finger on it as to particular time or event...but something happened. The group was safety for something in me, but never resolved the desire to be a stand out...in that group. The pull of belonging met the need to be unique, of seeing that thing that could never let go of me...being...me. (cause I think the truth of it was, whenever I felt "comfortable" enough in any group to let the "me" out...sideways glances from the group seemed to follow). There was always a thing about "toeing the line" that met "me"..."no lines for my toes!".
Like I said, I can't really recall the moment. But somehow I came to hear a resolution that is almost unwelcome, but I can't shake because inside I know it's absolutely true.
"Don't worry or fret, you are completely unique...just like everyone else". Being the "them".
