Unbiased Opinion

matt79brown · Mar 13, 2018

Is it possible to have a truly unbiased opinion? I mean can you hear/ read something without the the lil' ''this ain't right'' alarm going off in your head? Can I come to a conclusion on anything without my brain computing what I already know?

ky55 · Mar 13, 2018

matt79brown said:
Is it possible to have a truly unbiased opinion? I mean can you hear/ read something without the the lil' ''this ain't right'' alarm going off in your head? Can I come to a conclusion on anything without my brain computing what I already know?

I think you’re talking about something called “confirmation bias” maybe?

matt79brown · Mar 13, 2018

Maybe so. I just wonder if any of us can honestly say that we're ''open minded''. I just don't know that it's possible. Then again does that make us wrong? Who made the open minded rule anyway?

NE GA Pappy · Mar 13, 2018

there is no such thing of being unbiased. Everyone views each question with the background of teaching and experience of their lives. There is no way to not view things thru the lense of your past. Now, you may be able to see another point of view and overrule your bias, but it is there to overcome.

the question is not are you biased, but which bias is the best bias to be biased with.

Israel · Mar 14, 2018

matt79brown said:
Maybe so. I just wonder if any of us can honestly say that we're ''open minded''. I just don't know that it's possible. Then again does that make us wrong? Who made the open minded rule anyway?

I think the open minded rule came from two guys who couldn't get a third one to concur with them over something they agreed was really, really important (to them). Then, when the third guy left, (or they more likely killed him) the other two were left alone to start a war over whether Argyle socks were acceptable over solid color socks.

bullethead · Mar 14, 2018

Israel said:
I think the open minded rule came from two guys who couldn't get a third one to concur with them over something they agreed was really, really important (to them). Then, when the third guy left, (or they more likely killed him) the other two were left alone to start a war over whether Argyle socks were acceptable over solid color socks.

I like that one Izzy :cheers:

SemperFiDawg · Mar 14, 2018

matt79brown said:
Is it possible to have a truly unbiased opinion?

Yes and/or No.

1gr8bldr · Mar 14, 2018

It is very hard to deprogram ourselves from our preconceived notions. Extremely hard. I once thought about how 500 different denominations or beliefs all thought they were right and all the others were wrong. They can't all be right. So I realized that 99% were wrong and did not know it. And would likely boast that they were on the side of truth. So I then thought, there is a likely hood that I could be one of the deceived. So I set out on a journey to deprogram myself from all my traditional thinking. I was surprised at how often, I realized, that assumptions were still in my thinking. Actually the most revealing for me comes from conversing with the atheist. Because they can spot those biases and point them out.

660griz · Mar 14, 2018

Yes. I believe unbiased opinions are possible. The receivers of that opinion may determine it different depending on how they believe.
For instance. It is my opinion that we have landed on the moon. Others believe we have not landed on the moon.
I feel this is truly unbiased because I could really care less if we have landed on the moon. I form the opinion based on evidence I have seen and accept.

Israel · Mar 14, 2018

660griz said:
Yes. I believe unbiased opinions are possible. The receivers of that opinion may determine it different depending on how they believe.
For instance. It is my opinion that we have landed on the moon. Others believe we have not landed on the moon.
I feel this is truly unbiased because I could really care less if we have landed on the moon. I form the opinion based on evidence I have seen and accept.

But don't we often get into areas a little more complicated...especially when we attribute motives for opinions? I know I have veered into areas of presumption (toward others) while rarely considering my own motives in the matter, particularly to that very point..."where does this inclination come from to imagine I can easily see in others what I may not be willing to see in myself?"

Now, don't get me wrong...but your sig line says a lot, does it not? And I could come to all sorts of ideas of why an opinion you hold has now taken the form of (at least to me) a recommendation. Some could say "instruction" or even demand/command. "Boycott the NFL", and although I myself have an inclination or opinion about what I may think (and why) you are saying that, I could very well be completely in the rough. And this could happen even if I agree with your recommendation/statement/instruction/command. (For all I may know an NFL team may have condemned some property of yours by eminent domain to build a stadium).

Our affinities and resistances which, though we may make most plain, may really not be as plain to even ourselves in their origins.

660griz · Mar 15, 2018

Israel said:
But don't we often get into areas a little more complicated...especially when we attribute motives for opinions? I know I have veered into areas of presumption (toward others) while rarely considering my own motives in the matter, particularly to that very point..."where does this inclination come from to imagine I can easily see in others what I may not be willing to see in myself?"

I am not a scholar by a longshot but, seems to be a slight misuse of 'motive'.

Now, don't get me wrong...but your sig line says a lot, does it not?

I guess it does. Don't overthink it though. I should change it. Season is over. It says I love America and respect what the flag stands for.

And I could come to all sorts of ideas of why an opinion you hold has now taken the form of (at least to me) a recommendation. Some could say "instruction" or even demand/command. "Boycott the NFL", and although I myself have an inclination or opinion about what I may think (and why) you are saying that, I could very well be completely in the rough. And this could happen even if I agree with your recommendation/statement/instruction/command. (For all I may know an NFL team may have condemned some property of yours by eminent domain to build a stadium).

Our affinities and resistances which, though we may make most plain, may really not be as plain to even ourselves in their origins.

You could just ask my opinion. You could even ask how I came to that opinion. Or...

WaltL1 · Mar 15, 2018

1gr8bldr said:
It is very hard to deprogram ourselves from our preconceived notions. Extremely hard. I once thought about how 500 different denominations or beliefs all thought they were right and all the others were wrong. They can't all be right. So I realized that 99% were wrong and did not know it. And would likely boast that they were on the side of truth. So I then thought, there is a likely hood that I could be one of the deceived. So I set out on a journey to deprogram myself from all my traditional thinking. I was surprised at how often, I realized, that assumptions were still in my thinking. Actually the most revealing for me comes from conversing with the atheist. Because they can spot those biases and point them out.

That kind of seems like an invitation so I'm going for it :bounce:

-

So I realized that 99% were wrong

They can't all be right

You started with the assumption that only 99% were wrong. Not 100%.
And that they cant all be right but your assumption is that some number are "right".
So I guess my point is -

I was surprised at how often, I realized, that assumptions were still in my thinking.

You started with the assumption that "God is" so the final outcome of your journey was already predetermined,
you were just wrestling with the "technicalities"?

NE GA Pappy · Mar 15, 2018

660griz said:
I feel this is truly unbiased because I could really care less if we have landed on the moon. I form the opinion based on evidence I have seen and accept.

Which is the exact definition of bias. You have been taught/told certain things and you believe them to be true, so you come into a conversation or discussion with those ideas in your head. It leaves you in a situation where you have to not only be presented of the facts, but you have to be persuaded that the information you already had may be incorrect.

ambush80 · Mar 15, 2018

Assume whatever you think is true is false, then look at all the evidence. It's the best you can do.

I guess what I'm saying is that I believe a starting position of skepticism will reduce bias.

WaltL1 · Mar 15, 2018

NE GA Pappy said:
Which is the exact definition of bias. You have been taught/told certain things and you believe them to be true, so you come into a conversation or discussion with those ideas in your head. It leaves you in a situation where you have to not only be presented of the facts, but you have to be persuaded that the information you already had may be incorrect.

I think the bigger question here should be what do we do with those opinions.
What you say above has to be true, must be true, simply due to the fact that to even have an opinion you would have to either experience it for yourself or to your point, get the info from somewhere else.
Its what we do with or how we apply our opinions that matters.

660griz · Mar 15, 2018

NE GA Pappy said:
Which is the exact definition of bias. You have been taught/told certain things and you believe them to be true, so you come into a conversation or discussion with those ideas in your head. It leaves you in a situation where you have to not only be presented of the facts, but you have to be persuaded that the information you already had may be incorrect.

Uh, no.
I have also been told/taught certain thing that I believe to be false. I know folks that don't believe we have been to the moon. I have watched all the conspiracy theories around it and the answers. I got as much information as I could and MY opinion is, we have been to the moon. I had no preconceived notions or inclination either way.(definition of unbiased) Same goes for my opinions on religion.
Some folks can find bias in any thing and conspiracies too.
Skepticism is good...in moderation.

If your livelihood, health and happiness, etc. can not be affected by an opinion, my opinion is, it is not biased. Of course, you could dig down to what happened in my past that led me to a particular opinion but...

NE GA Pappy · Mar 15, 2018

660griz said:
Uh, no.
I have also been told/taught certain thing that I believe to be false. I know folks that don't believe we have been to the moon. I have watched all the conspiracy theories around it and the answers. I got as much information as I could and MY opinion is, we have been to the moon. I had no preconceived notions or inclination either way.(definition of unbiased) Same goes for my opinions on religion.
Some folks can find bias in any thing and conspiracies too.
Skepticism is good...in moderation.
If your livelihood, health and happiness, etc. can not be affected by an opinion, my opinion is, it is not biased. Of course, you could dig down to what happened in my past that led me to a particular opinion but...

you are totally unhinged on this subject.

What you believe is your bias. You can't set it apart and look at something with no preconceived ideas about the subject.

The only way you could possibly be unbiased is for you to be totally ignorant about the subject or anything remotely related to the subject.

Go ahead and deceive yourself into thinking you don't have any biases if you want to, but it just isn't true. What you believe or don't believe colors the thought process on any subject you wish to discuss. Period.

ambush80 · Mar 15, 2018

I just heard an excellent podcast where the interviewee suggested that people not have so many opinions about things that they don't know about. He suggested that one should have adequate knowledge of any subject to which they might espouse an opinion.

ambush80 · Mar 15, 2018

NE GA Pappy said:
you are totally unhinged on this subject.

What you believe is your bias. You can't set it apart and look at something with no preconceived ideas about the subject.

The only way you could possibly be unbiased is for you to be totally ignorant about the subject or anything remotely related to the subject.

Go ahead and deceive yourself into thinking you don't have any biases if you want to, but it just isn't true. What you believe or don't believe colors the thought process on any subject you wish to discuss. Period.

One need not have any basis for a belief. If one wants their belief to correspond to reality then they will have to do some investigation.

660griz · Mar 15, 2018

NE GA Pappy said:
you are totally unhinged on this subject.

What you believe is your bias. You can't set it apart and look at something with no preconceived ideas about the subject.

The only way you could possibly be unbiased is for you to be totally ignorant about the subject or anything remotely related to the subject.

Go ahead and deceive yourself into thinking you don't have any biases if you want to, but it just isn't true. What you believe or don't believe colors the thought process on any subject you wish to discuss. Period.

You state your opinion as if it is fact. Interesting.
I smell some serious bias.
You are saying, as a young lad, growing up using outdoor plumbing, father had a six grade education, I had knowledge of space travel and what it takes to get to the moon. Guess I was a lot smarter than most.
Who knew?

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