The light of God abiding in politics today?

Spineyman · Oct 12, 2017

gordon 2 said:
Why is it that for one Christian a liberal is the plague and for another Christian far right wing conservative is the plague? Same Jesus, same kingdom, same scripture? Both claim to value being a servant as per Jesus' instructions?

Anything in the bible about this or politics? Got an ear to the HS on this?

Romans 9:5-7
God's Sovereign Choice
5Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them proceeds the human descent of Christ, who is God over all, forever worthy of praise! Amen. 6It is not as though God’s word has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. 7Nor because they are Abraham’s descendants are they all his children. On the contrary, “Through Isaac your offspring will be reckoned.”…

I personally believe it has to do with actual interpretation of His Written Word. In all honesty we do not have a right to private interpretation, but rather should use scripture to interpret scripture. The Bible says to study to show yourself approved, a workman unto God to good works. Which is your reasonable service. If you look at Jesus, He was liberal in His administration of mercy and grace but very conservative on His Law. It was plain and simple, His way or the highway. So I cannot find any reason in the scripture to stand for the left and their liberal leanings. Jesus was and still is what you would say " radical". He said I am the way , the truth , and the life. No man comes to the Father but by me. He also said
John 10:9

9 I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture. He also talked about the rich man. The riches wern't the problem, the heart towards riches was the problem. So having riches is no problem if you keep your priorities straight. No where can you show me that it is alright through forced coercion ( taxes ) (theft ).that you can take from one against their will and give it to any other. Other than that I am not sure what you are referring to liberal vs conservative.

gordon 2 · Oct 12, 2017

Spineyman said:
Romans 9:5-7
God's Sovereign Choice
5Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them proceeds the human descent of Christ, who is God over all, forever worthy of praise! Amen. 6It is not as though God’s word has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. 7Nor because they are Abraham’s descendants are they all his children. On the contrary, “Through Isaac your offspring will be reckoned.”…

I personally believe it has to do with actual interpretation of His Written Word. In all honesty we do not have a right to private interpretation, but rather should use scripture to interpret scripture. The Bible says to study to show yourself approved, a workman unto God to good works. Which is your reasonable service. If you look at Jesus, He was liberal in His administration of mercy and grace but very conservative on His Law. It was plain and simple, His way or the highway. So I cannot find any reason in the scripture to stand for the left and their liberal leanings. Jesus was and still is what you would say " radical". He said I am the way , the truth , and the life. No man comes to the Father but by me. He also said
John 10:9

9 I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture. He also talked about the rich man. The riches wern't the problem, the heart towards riches was the problem. So having riches is no problem if you keep your priorities straight. No where can you show me that it is alright through forced coercion ( taxes ) (theft ).that you can take from one against their will and give it to any other. Other than that I am not sure what you are referring to liberal vs conservative.

That will do it... thanks. So taxes for the common good of all... ( which must mean giving it and its benefits to another) taxes decided by representatives of the constituents is not ok? it is always theft?

And Regards being conservative on the law... I understood Jesus differently... did he not glean on the Sabbath? overturn some tables..?

Liberals would see "radical" in a very different sense. And they would come back and say that scripture does not interpret scripture, but through the intermediary that is man it is interpreted, that the inanimate can interpret the inanimate is false.

Spineyman · Oct 13, 2017

gordon 2 said:
That will do it... thanks. So taxes for the common good of all... ( which must mean giving it and its benefits to another) taxes decided by representatives of the constituents is not ok? it is always theft?

And Regards being conservative on the law... I understood Jesus differently... did he not glean on the Sabbath? overturn some tables..?

Liberals would see "radical" in a very different sense. And they would come back and say that scripture does not interpret scripture, but through the intermediary that is man it is interpreted, that the inanimate can interpret the inanimate is false.

There is nothing in and of itself bad about taxes, but when you strong arm someone to give and then use said taxes for unGodly uses then there is a problem. The Bible clearly states that if a man doesn't work, doesn't eat. Therefore giving to those less fortunate who need a hand up is no problem. Giving to those who want a hand out and will not work for it creates a problem. Show me in scripture where coerced theft is biblical.

Jesus following the Law of keeping the Sabboth is no surprise. He gave the Law.

The misinterpretation is precisely why we have so many denominations and disagreements about Gods Word. But trust me it was written at a specific time in history to a specific people for a specific reason. Therefore we have to use scripture to interpret scripture in light of what I just said using the original language as our guide. That is why we are admonished in scripture to be like the Bereans to search the scriptures daily and see if what is being said is so. it also tells us to study to show yourself approved unto God which is your reasonable service. So please tell me how you can understand it clearly without using all that I have mentioned above?

gordon 2 · Oct 14, 2017

Spineyman said:
There is nothing in and of itself bad about taxes, but when you strong arm someone to give and then use said taxes for unGodly uses then there is a problem. The Bible clearly states that if a man doesn't work, doesn't eat. Therefore giving to those less fortunate who need a hand up is no problem. Giving to those who want a hand out and will not work for it creates a problem. Show me in scripture where coerced theft is biblical.

Jesus following the Law of keeping the Sabboth is no surprise. He gave the Law.

The misinterpretation is precisely why we have so many denominations and disagreements about Gods Word. But trust me it was written at a specific time in history to a specific people for a specific reason. Therefore we have to use scripture to interpret scripture in light of what I just said using the original language as our guide. That is why we are admonished in scripture to be like the Bereans to search the scriptures daily and see if what is being said is so. it also tells us to study to show yourself approved unto God which is your reasonable service. So please tell me how you can understand it clearly without using all that I have mentioned above?

I have never understood scripture 100% clearly...from my study or trying to understand someone else's study clearly. When I thought I knew something of scripture to a T, and a matter seem definite and settled often latter I found more or less than originally because my faith has not always been the same... ( My relationship with God is always changing.) Sometimes what I found myself strong in, I latter found it was weakness, and what I thought myself weak in, I found I was of great strength after all.

It seems to me that life in the way is a growing thing, as one's relationship with God grows with time. Scripture is important but my relationship with God is far more important.

To be honest the most simple things I learned that were God's, His way with the Hebrews and through his son Jesus or Jesus' way with the Jews, when I was a child continues to be a great light remembered and inspiration into the truth that is Christianity. ( Perhaps it is difficult to corrupt God's love in the heart of a child.) I could have been illiterate and almost ignorant of scripture as it was my parents who first informed me concerning the God of the patriarchs and Jesus and then the church followed by many examples of believers who were in the way.

In otherwords I understood clearly or just as clearly as studying scripture by the many examples of individuals, near and far, who had lived and some as I hope you are today, this very day, living in the way.

Perhaps the reason for so many denominations is not so much interpretations of scripture, but perhaps due to peoples who distress their born again lives by excessive study of that life to the detriment of what should be impressively living it.

I think that perhaps we need to ask who gives us liberty? Is it from the judgement of men and women who study scripture or God's judgement come through the lives of the people of faith???

From the get go, re: Christianity, many studied and knew scripture but did not recognize Jesus and in effect God. And not knowing life with God they were lost yet they claimed God to be especially theirs and so their way was false and so they were blinded.

gordon 2 · Oct 15, 2017

And concerning the Bereans, the original ones; It has always seemed to me, even to this day or it has been my impression that the testing of Paul's ministry ( his message to them) was their purpose in searching scripture and not so much for growth in faith.

And so since it is plain that we don't need to mistrust Paul or his message, I don't know why we would need to double check scripture and cross its every T to live our life in God?

Spineyman · Oct 15, 2017

gordon 2 said:
I have never understood scripture 100% clearly...from my study or trying to understand someone else's study clearly. When I thought I knew something of scripture to a T, and a matter seem definite and settled often latter I found more or less than originally because my faith has not always been the same... ( My relationship with God is always changing.) Sometimes what I found myself strong in, I latter found it was weakness, and what I thought myself weak in, I found I was of great strength after all.

It seems to me that life in the way is a growing thing, as one's relationship with God grows with time. Scripture is important but my relationship with God is far more important.

To be honest the most simple things I learned that were God's, His way with the Hebrews and through his son Jesus or Jesus' way with the Jews, when I was a child continues to be a great light remembered and inspiration into the truth that is Christianity. ( Perhaps it is difficult to corrupt God's love in the heart of a child.) I could have been illiterate and almost ignorant of scripture as it was my parents who first informed me concerning the God of the patriarchs and Jesus and then the church followed by many examples of believers who were in the way.

In otherwords I understood clearly or just as clearly as studying scripture by the many examples of individuals, near and far, who had lived and some as I hope you are today, this very day, living in the way.

Perhaps the reason for so many denominations is not so much interpretations of scripture, but perhaps due to peoples who distress their born again lives by excessive study of that life to the detriment of what should be impressively living it.

I think that perhaps we need to ask who gives us liberty? Is it from the judgement of men and women who study scripture or God's judgement come through the lives of the people of faith???

From the get go, re: Christianity, many studied and knew scripture but did not recognize Jesus and in effect God. And not knowing life with God they were lost yet they claimed God to be especially theirs and so their way was false and so they were blinded.

I too had an extremely Godly mother who loved the Lord with all her heart. She also instilled in me a love for the Word of God and prayer. She loved the Bible and spending time in prayer with the One who purchased her salvation. Man shall not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God. His Word is recorded for us in the Holy Bible. It is very important for us to read and meditate on it. The Psalmist wrote, oh how I love Your Law, it is my meditation all the day. I could go on for days. There is nothing wrong with looking at other people as long as they are following Christ.

Spineyman · Oct 15, 2017

gordon 2 said:
And concerning the Bereans, the original ones; It has always seemed to me, even to this day or it has been my impression that the testing of Paul's ministry ( his message to them) was their purpose in searching scripture and not so much for growth in faith.

And so since it is plain that we don't need to mistrust Paul or his message, I don't know why we would need to double check scripture and cross its every T to live our life in God?

That is also an admonition for us to do as they did, because not all that speak from the pulpit preach the entire Word of the Living God. That is why it is up to us to see if what is said and preached lines up with His Word. Paul even said, you follow me as I follow Christ!

gordon 2 · Oct 16, 2017

Spineyman said:
That is also an admonition for us to do as they did, because not all that speak from the pulpit preach the entire Word of the Living God. That is why it is up to us to see if what is said and preached lines up with His Word. Paul even said, you follow me as I follow Christ!

I suspect if everyone had to do as you say, checking the pulpit against Scripture, Christianity would be muchly a church hopping affair! due by what was understood to be said or meant and what was meant and by what was understood as read and meant and in faith meant. And the outcome would be many various and sundry denominations, sects, cults, social upheavals, the mixing of politics with the church(es), the inappropriate mixing of the worldly to the heavenly, etc... Let us hope that for the efforts of God towards man it does never comes to this...

The light of God abiding in politics today?

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