Question for Trackers

humdandy · Dec 18, 2014

I have been watching your thread about your tracking jobs and congratulate you guys on some hard work!

Do you ask the hunter what kind of weapon they use? What caliber? How far was the shot? Etc??

Have you noticed a pattern with certain calibers, if you know?

Thanks

mattwilkes · Dec 19, 2014

I always gather as much info during the phone interview as possible. I ask about weapon, caliber, perceived shot placement ( which is often different from actual shot placement). Was the deer broadside or quartering and what was his reaction to the hit? Then I like to move on to details about the hit site. Hair? If so what color. Blood and how much? If so is it dark, bright red, or pink with bubbles. Is there stomach matter present? All of these questions allow the tracker to decide how long we need to wait before we take up the trail. It also helps us decide if we think the deer is recoverable. We get real busy during November and cannot get to all the calls so all of this info helps us decide which calls to take. I can pretty much tell before I leave the house if a deer is recoverable or not. If I'm not busy, I'll go out on a call, even if I believe it is unrecoverable, but communicate this to the hunter over the phone.
Now about caliber, I find that errant shots or deflected shots happen with all calibers. I believe that the smaller calibers like the .243 account for the majority of my rifle calls due to lack of an exit wound. Hope this helps answer your question.

humdandy · Dec 19, 2014

mattwilkes said:
I always gather as much info during the phone interview as possible. I ask about weapon, caliber, perceived shot placement ( which is often different from actual shot placement). Was the deer broadside or quartering and what was his reaction to the hit? Then I like to move on to details about the hit site. Hair? If so what color. Blood and how much? If so is it dark, bright red, or pink with bubbles. Is there stomach matter present? All of these questions allow the tracker to decide how long we need to wait before we take up the trail. It also helps us decide if we think the deer is recoverable. We get real busy during November and cannot get to all the calls so all of this info helps us decide which calls to take. I can pretty much tell before I leave the house if a deer is recoverable or not. If I'm not busy, I'll go out on a call, even if I believe it is unrecoverable, but communicate this to the hunter over the phone.
Now about caliber, I find that errant shots or deflected shots happen with all calibers. I believe that the smaller calibers like the .243 account for the majority of my rifle calls due to lack of an exit wound. Hope this helps answer your question.

Thanks!

rvick · Dec 19, 2014

Good answer, Matt. Can I add that a deer that hits the ground instantly & lays there for anywhere from 20 seconds to 20 minutes and then struggles to it's feet & gets gone is probably hit in the back above the spine or the neck near the spine. You may find a small amount of blood & some black tipped hair at the hit site, but little or no blood down the trail. This deer will probably survive & can rarely be recovered. Called a "back-whack". Also if fragments of bone are found, they are not "rib bones" but rather leg bones & this deer can usually be recovered after a long track. Especially with a tracking dog that can be turned loose to bay. Head on shots with 22 calibers are tough as they won't bleed but a couple drops & I have seen deer survive head on shots in the chest with 223's & 22-250s. Probably one lung was hit.

rosewood · Dec 19, 2014

Hmm, interesting. You trackers have some insight that the folks that think a .223 is the thing to kill deer with refuse to believe.

rosewood · Dec 19, 2014

Back whack? I am assuming you are getting hydrostatic shock that is affecting the nervous system. Much like a hit on the head that is virtually knocking them out, but not enough permanent damage to kill them since it missed the spine and other vital organs.

Thanks for the education. This is good stuff.

humdandy · Dec 19, 2014

rosewood said:
Hmm, interesting. You trackers have some insight that the folks that think a .223 is the thing to kill deer with refuse to believe.

I have a 223, it has killed half a dozen deer ranging from 50-150 yards and every deer dropped in their tracks......this is a gun I let kids use....and friends who come and hunt with me.......it is deadly accurate. I don't hunt with it.

My experience over the years with lost deer or no blood trail comes from the 308.............granted I have seen it drop deer in their tracks as well. I don't own a 308, just my experience with friends and family who use the 308.

humdandy · Dec 19, 2014

shirttail said:
Letting kids take shots at deer with a 223 is a sure way to need a tracker. smh

Not yet it hasn't, my girls will also shoot it when they feel the need to hunt.

humdandy · Dec 19, 2014

shirttail said:
Letting kids take shots at deer with a 223 is a sure way to need a tracker. smh

Ironically, the same kid who dropped 2 does with the 223 hit one with a 308 and lost it. No blood, the deer was found the next morning 50 yards away.

whitedog · Dec 19, 2014

It doesn't matter what caliber you or your kids shoot, bullet placement is king. I would submit to you that with young kids, the lack of recoil from a small caliber can trump the knockdown power of a larger caliber. My boys hunted with an old .222 for years. My youngest killed 15 deer with it between the age of 5 and 11. He never lost a deer and never tracked one over 50 yds. I don't know how many the older boy killed but it was plenty. He never lost one either. They had no fear of recoil and were deadly accurate with it. I was there with them. They learned to be disciplined and they took no marginal shots. If you put it through the heart or lungs, it's a dead deer.
2004 - 5 yrs old with a .222

He used the same gun on the buck on the right.

shirttail · Dec 19, 2014

Where did my post go?

whitedog · Dec 19, 2014

nice bucks

Todd E · Dec 19, 2014

And yet………another derail……..

This is a post directed at trackers, not is a .223 good enough to kill a deer. SMH

mattwilkes · Dec 19, 2014

Good stuff from Randy about bone at hit site. Usually misidentified as rib bones because of perceived shot placement. It's leg bone. Another thing I hear a lot is that there are "pieces of organ" along the blood trail. It's coagulated blood, that happens for a number of different reasons. My BEST piece of advice for anyone who ever considers calling a dog is this: if the deer is worth calling a dog, it's worth calling a dog first.... Before the grid searches and aimlessly wandering, hoping that you'll stumble up on your trophy. You have no idea what what this does to a very delicate scent line that would otherwise be simple, to a trained dog. An un disturbed line is the best possible chance of our dogs helping find your deer. Unfortunately,we are called in as as a last resort, when we should be the first.

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