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Old 12-26-2013, 10:52 AM
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Default Winchester Longbeard XR

Was wondering if anyone has tried these shells and how much they are?
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Old 12-26-2013, 10:53 AM
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Sum Toy has been shooting them with incredible results.. Price is about 18 bucks for 10...
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Old 12-26-2013, 11:10 AM
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Sum Toy has been shooting them with incredible results.. Price is about 18 bucks for 10...
Yeap!! I saw some pics the other day over on Old Gobbler. I seriously thinking of sending my 870SM down there to see about getting it fitted with one of their chokes.
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Old 12-26-2013, 01:00 PM
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I was looking at the same thing. When will they be available? Hopefully this will bring down the price of the HTL loads. Can't wait to try them though.
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Old 12-26-2013, 05:16 PM
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18.00 for 10 is CHEAP. HTL is either gonna go down or Longbeard XR going up. Better stock up on them. Probly gonna buy quiet a few boxes now from what I've been reading and seeing on OG.
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Old 12-26-2013, 05:17 PM
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They are available. Think Cabela's has them.
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Old 12-26-2013, 05:48 PM
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Sum Toy has been shooting them with incredible results.. Price is about 18 bucks for 10...
Been having good results, but not as good as the Hevi shot shoots.. It is cheaper though.
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Old 12-26-2013, 08:46 PM
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It is a very good load for the money. It has a pattern that will turn the HTL world up side down if they keep the $$$ in the 18 to 20 a box. I have not been told the release date on them but must be soon. I got the go ahead to release all the test stuff.
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Old 12-26-2013, 10:54 PM
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Been having good results, but not as good as the Hevi shot shoots.. It is cheaper though.
Can you please show me a Hevi load of 2oz 6s that produces 250 in a 10 inch circle....
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Old 12-26-2013, 11:45 PM
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Can you please show me a Hevi load of 2oz 6s that produces 250 in a 10 inch circle....
No, not 6s, but 7s which is what I shoot. Go look at SumToy Facebook page and you will see the picture of 3" Hevi 7s with 309 in 10" @ 40 yards. I'm throwing about the same thing give or take a little with my VersaMax, SumToy, and Hevi 7s 3.5" but I don't take pictures of my pattern. I should've said IMO because, with my setup it'll be real hard to beat the Hevi shot.
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Old 12-26-2013, 11:59 PM
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Gonna be hard to compare 7s to 6s when it comes to total #s. But a $20 box of 10 that puts 250 in the 10" trumps 300 plus, that cost $30+ for a box of 5. After all a dead turkey is a dead turkey!
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Old 12-27-2013, 12:18 AM
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Can you please show me a Hevi load of 2oz 6s that produces 250 in a 10 inch circle....
I was able to get over 250 with 3.5 inch 2.25 oz magblends (5,6,7) at 40. Which i can tell you from experience is absolutely devestating on a turkey at 40 yards because of the knockdown the htl produces. I was able to get my cost on these shells down to less than $3 last year with the rebate hevi shot ran last year so that is why i do shoot them. I will agree that those are impressive numbers for the win longbeard shells at that price no matter how you look at it.
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Old 12-27-2013, 12:35 AM
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Gonna be hard to compare 7s to 6s when it comes to total #s. But a $20 box of 10 that puts 250 in the 10" trumps 300 plus, that cost $30+ for a box of 5. After all a dead turkey is a dead turkey!
I couldn't agree with you more! I'm going to stick with what I know will kill one though. Plus, not real sure about those Long beards. Could just be me, or maybe it was explained to me wrong, but the way it was explained tells me that if everything doesn't go just right there could be a disaster.
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Old 12-27-2013, 07:52 AM
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See and thats where one cannot compare 7s or MBs to anything really, nobody knows the compilation of 7s or smaller pellets in each..

Before the 7s when everyone shot 6s at 2oz load most would settle in a range of 180-200.. Heck the 2.25oz load of Hevi 6s would struggle to reach 250.. Gotta compare apples to apples.. 56.9% efficiency is getting it done..
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Old 12-27-2013, 08:31 AM
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Well shells are like guns. You shoot $20 a box of 10 or
$30 to $40 a box of 5. Shoot a $300 (870) or a $1500 (SBEII). Both are dead birds if you do your part (40 yards and in). It comes down to how much money do you want to spend.

Now I like the HV13 but not the money they ask for them. Plus they very form lot to lot at times. I have seen some of them shoot like junk and some be smoking hot patterns.


As always how dead is dead. If you one of them that gets into numbers pick HV13 if you want a dead bird just pick up the lead shell.
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Old 12-27-2013, 08:55 AM
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As always how dead is dead. If you one of them that gets into numbers pick HV13 if you want a dead bird just pick up the lead shell.
It's the ones that don't die that hunters should worry about. About every survey you look at will show about a 20-25% "miss" rate. I figure most of those "misses" are birds that are hit. A couple years back there was a survey on another forum that asked how many guys missed. It was a percentage in that range. Then another survey was done that was limited to guys who loaded their own shells - the vast majority of who loaded HTL shot. The miss rate among those guys was 1/2 the rate of the survey that included everybody.

So, if you want a dead bird, shoot the best performing ammo you can, and make sure you can put the pattern where you want it.
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Old 12-27-2013, 09:19 AM
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Gonna be hard to compare 7s to 6s when it comes to total #s. But a $20 box of 10 that puts 250 in the 10" trumps 300 plus, that cost $30+ for a box of 5. After all a dead turkey is a dead turkey!
Actually, to be fair, you have to compare the Longbeard #6s with Hevi-13 #7s in the MagBlend- because those have approx the same penetration energy.

IMO, from 30-50 yds, the Longbeard is going to be a big improvement over any other lead loads. But inside of 30 yds, it's going to be an increased liability due to the tight pattern coming out of that resin it's encased in at close ranges.

Here it is at 20 yds (3" shell)...


Compared to a Hevi-13 #6 at 20 yds (10" circle)...


Compared to a typical lead load at 20 yds (10" circle)...


So, except for those for whom saving a few dimes takes precedence over increasing your chances per turkey, seems to me you're still going to be better off with the Hevi-13 shells....
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Old 12-27-2013, 09:20 AM
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It's the ones that don't die that hunters should worry about. About every survey you look at will show about a 20-25% "miss" rate. I figure most of those "misses" are birds that are hit. A couple years back there was a survey on another forum that asked how many guys missed. It was a percentage in that range. Then another survey was done that was limited to guys who loaded their own shells - the vast majority of who loaded HTL shot. The miss rate among those guys was 1/2 the rate of the survey that included everybody.

So, if you want a dead bird, shoot the best performing ammo you can, and make sure you can put the pattern where you want it.
Don't think it is the shell in that case. The guys that hand load are the guys that spend more time getting to know the gun. I was surprised at the folks that stop by that have NO CLUE the POA/POI of the gun they had. The guy that gets into the numbers game I don't think have a better choke, gun or shell. I think they have learned the gun. 50% is equipment and 50% is hunter
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Old 12-27-2013, 09:34 AM
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Actually, to be fair, you have to compare the Longbeard #6s with Hevi-13 #7s in the MagBlend- because those have approx the same penetration energy.
I do not after shooting the 7s for two years and pulling numerous pellets out of breasts near side skin and pallets it is hard to compare Hevi on an equal plane with anything do to the floor sweepings in every shell.. I had fly specks called pellets wedged between layers of cardboard.

In my best Forrest Gump voice "hevi shot is like a box of chocolates, ya never know what your gonna get"

The Hevi 7s are a fantastic 40 yd load but one would have to measure each individual pellet to get some form of average penetration.
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Old 12-27-2013, 09:37 AM
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William have you had a chance to run any 5s down the pipe?
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Old 12-27-2013, 09:39 AM
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Don't think it is the shell in that case. The guys that hand load are the guys that spend more time getting to know the gun. I was surprised at the folks that stop by that have NO CLUE the POA/POI of the gun they had. The guy that gets into the numbers game I don't think have a better choke, gun or shell. I think they have learned the gun. 50% is equipment and 50% is hunter
No question that guys who load their own spend more time at the range and therefore are surely going to do a better job performing well when they pull the trigger, compared to the average Joe who is looking to buy the cheapest stuff he can find and then starts shooting at turkeys.

I am not sure exactly what your definition of the "guy who gets into the numebers game" is, but I can say with confidence that the ammo makes a huge difference in performance when it comes to whether a turkey lives, is crippled, or dies when the guy pulls the trigger. It gives the biggest bang for one's turkey hunting buck. I can only speak for myself, but I can't see the point of spending thousands of dollars to hunt every year, and then skimping when it comes to the moment of truth, just to save a few dimes.

IMO, whatever one shoots, just make sure you know what the pattern of shot is doing out there, and then keep within the shell's limitations. As ethical hunters, it should be our goal to have a dead turkey, every time we point the gun at one and pull the trigger. And since most hunters don't play the numbers game enough to know better, I'm afraid a lot of hunters are going to fall for the deceptive 60+ yard marketing job Winchester is doing.
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Old 12-27-2013, 09:46 AM
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I do not after shooting the 7s for two years and pulling numerous pellets out of breasts near side skin and pallets it is hard to compare Hevi on an equal plane with anything do to the floor sweepings in every shell.. I had fly specks called pellets wedged between layers of cardboard.

In my best Forrest Gump voice "hevi shot is like a box of chocolates, ya never know what your gonna get"

The Hevi 7s are a fantastic 40 yd load but one would have to measure each individual pellet to get some form of average penetration.
I won't shoot the Hevi-13 7s, for that reason. And I won't be shooting the Longbeard 6s either, for the same insufficient energy reasons.

But the Hevi-13 size issue goes both ways - smaller and larger.

I suspect the Longbeard shells are also going to be a fantastic 40 yd load - but not a fantastic 20 yd or 60 yd load. Due to the laws of physics, it's going to have a more narrow range where it give high performance, compared to the HTL stuff.
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Old 12-27-2013, 10:41 AM
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Hawglips what was saying is they spend the time looking for numbers they are spending time learning the gun. It shoots this way clean that way dirty. It likes this shell that choke. I know the old school guys walk up shoot paper walk out look at it say that is a dead bird and walk off. Most them you hang paper with 2 inch square at 50 feet tell them blow hole in it they can. I see both sides of this. Get guys come around they look at you like you from outer space when you ask when have you cleaned the gun. Guy buy a choke or gun then say it not put up the numbers other guy did. A lot more to it then plug and play. That is why I ask if someone calls with TSS who's load are you shooting.

Now as in short rang of the new long beard it is going to be a bad shell because the guy that looks at the patterns. Got to have that and don't realize A lot more work to it when it comes to this load. This liad is like the Fed FCW HW in the 20. Good load 30 to 40 yards but need to be on your a game if bird is at 20 yards
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Old 12-27-2013, 10:59 AM
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I see in the Winchester ad that the Drury brothers are bragging about a gobbler they shot at 66 yards. Said the load was so effective they were going to move their decoys out further! No telling how many wounded gobblers this type advertising will cause this Spring.
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Old 12-27-2013, 11:44 AM
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I couldn't agree with you more! I'm going to stick with what I know will kill one though. Plus, not real sure about those Long beards. Could just be me, or maybe it was explained to me wrong, but the way it was explained tells me that if everything doesn't go just right there could be a disaster.
I understand the sticking with what you know works. That's why if I get to try the Longbeards this spring I will have my Hevi-choke and a couple MagBlends in my pocket in case I need to revert back.
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