Can a Man Be Saved from Sin or Born Again More Than Once?

Job 19:26
And when after my skin this is destroyed, Then without my flesh shall I see God;

and afterward from this, my stricken skin and from my own flesh, I must see God:

"Even after my skin is destroyed, Yet from my flesh I shall see God;

And [if] after my skin this shall be destroyed, yet from out of my flesh shall I see +God;

"yet in my flesh] Better, as above, and without my flesh. The margin, out of (or, from) my flesh, suggests the explanation how such opposite senses may be arrived at. The Heb. prep. from has the same ambiguity as from in English."

"with my whole body consumed, shall I see God."
 
It's like our salvation isn't completely through if Christ must come again to redeem us. If we still need a future redemption/salvation.

It's still just a promise of salvation. We're not 100% saved or redeemed until Christ returns, puts our souls back into our flesh, and then and only then do we receive salvation.

Very much like salvation before the cross, we only have salvation in the form of a promise. If this is true then our souls must be in Limbo when we die a physical death awaiting salvation.

If we are still waiting on a future event for redemption, then it isn't finished. Maybe only half is or 90% is but not everything. Not if I must wait for Christ's return.
 
When does one really receive salvation? When they are called and accept? When they die a physical death? or When Christ returns to redeem them?
When does one's new spiritual life begin? When is one truly no longer apart of his flesh?
 

Israel

Senior Member
Is anything we see in time, not already and for eternity established in truth?
 
No sir. It was better because it was a one time deal and was eternal. I say Jesus completed the atonement, by your own futurist ideology you must believe it is not complete... You believe He is not done and must return.. I say our Lord is King of Kings, it is finished, and He is victorious.
Eph.1:1-14 is why I believe this.

Verse 7 assures us that we ALREADY have redemption and forgiveness of sin. It's in our possession. Furthermore, He has given the Spirit as a surety of a full inheritance to come.

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Then in verse 14, he speaks of the future redemption of something that has ALREADY BEEN PURCHASED.(our bodies)
He will gather together all that was paid for.

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance UNTIL THE REDEMPTION OF THE PURCHASED POSSESSION, unto the praise of his glory.
 

hobbs27

Senior Member
Eph.1:1-14 is why I believe this.

Verse 7 assures us that we ALREADY have redemption and forgiveness of sin. It's in our possession. Furthermore, He has given the Spirit as a surety of a full inheritance to come.

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Then in verse 14, he speaks of the future redemption of something that has ALREADY BEEN PURCHASED.(our bodies)
He will gather together all that was paid for.

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance UNTIL THE REDEMPTION OF THE PURCHASED POSSESSION, unto the praise of his glory.
What do you believe is being redeemed here?
Our physical bodies?

I tell you what I see, it's the presence of God in our life both on earth and in heaven, just as it was in the garden. The relationship that Adam lost due to sin, has been redeemed, restored, brought back through Christ.
 
Job 42:5 "I have heard of You by the hearing of the ear; But now my eye sees You;


Job saw God while in his flesh..well before the worms destroyed it.
He sure did. With an eye of faith(given by the Holy Spirit), same as you and I have....

...But, in 19:26 he also says he will see God AFTER the worms destroyed his flesh.

The one concept does not cancel out the other.They both are in perfect harmony.
 
Yes. I would love to hear more about this eternal atonement and 70 AD. :D
Regardless of when the atonement happened, isn't it eternal and infinite? Meaning it goes forward before the event and afterward of the event?

The salvation from the atonement is out of time's realm but the actual atonement is in time's realm.

We have the beyond time down pat, now we are trying to coincide it with the "in time" events.
Before the Cross, after the Cross, time between the Cross & 70AD, or a furture coming for the redemption of bodies only. This future event is not is for the salvation of souls, just salvation of the human flesh.

Basically we are trying to make the "in time events" fit into the "timeline" which of course is within time.
 

hobbs27

Senior Member
He sure did. With an eye of faith(given by the Holy Spirit), same as you and I have....

...But, in 19:26 he also says he will see God AFTER the worms destroyed his flesh.

The one concept does not cancel out the other.They both are in perfect harmony.
Different people interpret that verse differently. I can show many well educated men with the opinion of Job seeing God in his flesh before death.. and others after death.
All of which will admit that Job is the hardest text in the Hebrew Bible to translate, because it is of an older dialect than most scriptures.

I would not hang my eschatology on the book of job, much less that one verse.
 
I don't believe it takes anything away from Christ's redemption on the cross for our sins if we add the part of his work/mission/redemption that was future from the Cross.
Regardless of if it was in 70AD or in the future. We do know that part of God's plan to finish it was the return of Jesus. He had to or must return to finish. To redeem or save as mentioned here;

Hebrews 9:28
so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

Romans 13:11
And do this, understanding the present time: The hour has already come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed.

There is or was a return of Christ as part of the salvation/redemption process.Perhaps one for the soul and one for the body.

Unless we are confusing two parallel story lines, one about the destruction of Jerusalem and one about the destruction of the earth. One being salvation from the destruction of Jerusalem, and the other being salvation from the destruction of the earth.

One being a mirror or type of the other.
 
Different people interpret that verse differently. I can show many well educated men with the opinion of Job seeing God in his flesh before death.. and others after death.
All of which will admit that Job is the hardest text in the Hebrew Bible to translate, because it is of an older dialect than most scriptures.

I would not hang my eschatology on the book of job, much less that one verse.
I hang my eschatology on every book in the bible, much more every verse in the bible.

It's a fine woven tapestry, with every fiber intertwined perfectly to make the whole.
 
2 redemptions
the one in vs. 14 is the physical one.
Then the one on the Cross was just for our souls right? It wasn't strong enough to save our bodies, that will take the actual return of Christ to accomplish.

Let me rephrase that, Christ's mission on the Cross wasn't to redeem our bodies. That's his next mission.

Christ's redeeming was not finished on the Cross. He must return again to 100% finish the redemption process. The first one was for our sins, the next one is for our human bodies. The process isn't finished.
 
Then the one on the Cross was just for our souls right? It wasn't strong enough to save our bodies, that will take the actual return of Christ to accomplish.

Let me rephrase that, Christ's mission on the Cross wasn't to redeem our bodies. That's his next mission.

Christ's redeeming was not finished on the Cross. He must return again to 100% finish the redemption process. The first one was for our sins, the next one is for our human bodies. The process isn't finished.
Read Ephesians 1 again.
It says Jesus paid the price in full,(vs.7), but is coming again to take full possession of what he paid for(vs. 14).
 
Different people interpret that verse differently. I can show many well educated men with the opinion of Job seeing God in his flesh before death.. and others after death.
All of which will admit that Job is the hardest text in the Hebrew Bible to translate, because it is of an older dialect than most scriptures.

I would not hang my eschatology on the book of job, much less that one verse.
I've read about this before. Perhaps Job being "from his flesh" meant that he was no longer in his flesh when he said that he would see God.

Job 19:26
And when after my skin this is destroyed, Then without my flesh shall I see God;

and afterward from this, my stricken skin and from my own flesh, I must see God:

"Even after my skin is destroyed, Yet from my flesh I shall see God;

Without his flesh, from his flesh, apart from his flesh?

Thoughts?
 

hobbs27

Senior Member
Read Ephesians 1 again.
It says Jesus paid the price in full,(vs.7), but is coming again to take full possession of what he paid for(vs. 14).

So in 70 ad. He got what He paid for at the cross...or He has still not recieved what He paid for nearly 2k years ago.
 

hobbs27

Senior Member
I've read about this before. Perhaps Job being "from his flesh" meant that he was no longer in his flesh when he said that he would see God.

Job 19:26
And when after my skin this is destroyed, Then without my flesh shall I see God;

and afterward from this, my stricken skin and from my own flesh, I must see God:

"Even after my skin is destroyed, Yet from my flesh I shall see God;

Without his flesh, from his flesh, apart from his flesh?

Thoughts?
Just look at all the different commentaries on Bible hub.

I think many people like JWs are just begging for a text to support their idea of a physical body resurrection so they take more out of this than what is truly offered.
 
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