Grace folks get accused ...

[StriperAddict]

... of going soft on sin. This new post today may clear that up.
---------------

If sin is seriously evident in your life, it is not the sign that you need to get serious about sin; it is the evidence that you’re already serious about it, and need to get serious about grace.

Jesus was serious with sin, and dealt with it by the sacrifice of Himself. If you’re going to take on the same type of role that He did concerning sin—and pat yourself on the back for living like Jesus—you’re going to fail. He was God in the flesh, and you’re not. He was our Champion, and you’re not. He is the Savior, and you’re not. You’re not supposed to be!

What you’ll find by pulling on your seriously-serious-about-sin boots is a load of crap in your boots. No matter how high and tight! That’s how it works. That’s the purpose of the Law that Jesus perfectly fulfilled and perfectly brought to an end (Colossians 2:13-15). The only thing that life-by-morals, life-by-pledge, or life-by-sin-avoidance can produce is sin because the power of sin is focusing upon yourself and your behavior relative to a standard (1 Corinthians 15:56; Romans 7). All you will receive from your focus is shame—no matter how you hide it, failure will be your constant companion.

Many of us learn to live around shame. The failures of the past haunt us into the attempt to avoid more shame by doing right. But that has to mean that early shame, early failure, motivates us still. “Don’t allow for any more of it!” Throw in some sin-avoidance teaching from a teacher we respect upon that past shame, and the course magically appears again in our minds. We pull on our boots and off we go.

Failure.

You and I are set up to know Jesus, not to get better and behave decently, but to know Jesus and the grace He is for us (Romans 6:14). He is our course; not the course we choose for Him—“I’ll do it right this time!”—but who He is for us every day. Remember? You were crucified with Him and now live—and only live—by faith in Him. That’s how we live by the Spirit in us. It’s not that we don’t care about our behavior—we do. We just know we can’t manage it. We’re not supposed to—remember? We didn’t believe and receive Jesus only to avoid the behavior that leads to ****, we received Him in order to live! And in order for Him to live in us and through us. Perfect.

Forget your boots. They don’t work. You’re in Christ, and He knows the walk ahead.

See you later. /
From Ralph Harris
Author of:
God's Astounding Opnion of You
Life According to Perfect

#sin #grace #life #joy #freedom #law #faith #Spirit

 

[LittleDrummerBoy]

Nothing to disagree with there.

What I hate about the grace frauds is how they pretend at funerals that someone is in heaven because they walked the aisle and prayed the sinner's prayer decades ago and then went on to live lives characterized by drug abuse, addiction, crime, and sexual immorality without any evidence of ...

"God's grace which teaches us to say 'No' to ungodliness and worldly passions."

Better to just stay silent on the matter than to suggest that all the other drug addicts and sexually immoral in attendance will also be in heaven based on walking the aisle and praying the sinner's prayer decades ago without ever really receiving a gift of grace that produces repentance and good fruit. Funerals are for the living. Lying about the eternal destiny of the dearly departed does not bless anyone and amounts to a false gospel.

 

[Artfuldodger]

I don't think I've ever been to a funeral where the deceased wasn't in Heaven!

 

[Artfuldodger]

And thus we have the two different paths to salvation, Easy Believism or Lordship salvation. Either it's all from God's grace or one can try and work his way in through lordship!

 

[4HAND]

I remember one. I was a kid. My stepdad was a minister. An old lady's grandson has been shot & killed in a bar fight. My stepdad was an evangelist at that time & had preached at the church the old lady attended & they had known each other for years. She asked my stepdad to preach the funeral.

He did, but he certainly didn't "preach him into the Pearly Gates". He was very tactful & comforting as he could be given the circumstances.

I remember hearing him tell mama that was probably the hardest funeral he had preached at that point.

 

[gemcgrew]

I remember one. I was a kid. My stepdad was a minister. An old lady's grandson has been shot & killed in a bar fight. My stepdad was an evangelist at that time & had preached at the church the old lady attended & they had known each other for years. She asked my stepdad to preach the funeral.

He did, but he certainly didn't "preach him into the Pearly Gates". He was very tactful & comforting as he could be given the circumstances.

I remember hearing him tell mama that was probably the hardest funeral he had preached at that point.

"in the place where the tree falleth, there it shall be." (Ecclesiastes 11:3)

Death doesn't change a thing.

"He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still." (Revelation 22:11)

There is no change in eternity.

 

[Artfuldodger]

"in the place where the tree falleth, there it shall be." (Ecclesiastes 11:3)

Death doesn't change a thing.

"He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still." (Revelation 22:11)

There is no change in eternity.

This was a verse I was pondering the other day;

Revelation 13:10
"If anyone is to go into captivity, into captivity they will go. If anyone is to be killed with the sword, with the sword they will be killed." This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of God's people.

 

[Israel]

There can be no persuasion to heaven without an equally powerful conviction of he11. Otherwise we are merely men selling an upgrade from coach to first class.

 

[StriperAddict]

And thus we have the two different paths to salvation, Easy Believism or Lordship salvation. Either it's all from God's grace or one can try and work his way in through lordship!

I'm a little late picking up from this, and included a short note on Lordship salvation for reference. I think it's a good add ... enjoy:

 

[Israel]

Grace folks must get accused...

 

[j_seph]

We almost had the funeral last year that would have been he didn't go to heaven. It was very disturbing not knowing if our 23 year old nephew was saved or not. So happens that the funeral home where he was at he had done some work at several months prior. We know the man who owns it and he came in like a couple days later after he had passed away and talked with the mother. Seems that our nephew got into a conversation with someone whom worked at the funeral home when he did work there months prior. The conversation was kind of like I bet it is tough working here and dealing with death everyday from our nephew. It went on and somehow in the conversation our nephew had made it clear to them to not worry about him if he ever came through there cause he had been saved and would be in heaven. When we got the call that morning he had been killed, all his dad could say is I do not know if I will ever see my son again, I do not know where he stood with the Lord.

All the more reason to share your testimony with all that you can. Don't leave room for doubt out there for your family.

 

[StriperAddict]

All the more reason to share your testimony with all that you can. Don't leave room for doubt out there for your family.

Yes, indeed.
I would encourage you to take heart on his own testimony. No one can make such if Christ is not within. And it is not your nephew's confession or level of faith regarding his paas from death to life, remember ... it rests on the faithfulness of Christ, the wood, nails, blood and resurrection. And by what you shared I'd be at peace in that simple testimony.
There's a short book called the Hurt and The Healer by Andrew Farley, he wrote it with Bart Millard the singer of Mercy Me. These two men had experienced the loss of their fathers and wrestled with the pain of the loss, and the doubts that come along. It's a great resource, and might be for your family as well.
Peace to you ...

 

[SemperFiDawg]

... of going soft on sin. This new post today may clear that up.
---------------

If sin is seriously evident in your life, it is not the sign that you need to get serious about sin; it is the evidence that you’re already serious about it, and need to get serious about grace.

Jesus was serious with sin, and dealt with it by the sacrifice of Himself. If you’re going to take on the same type of role that He did concerning sin—and pat yourself on the back for living like Jesus—you’re going to fail. He was God in the flesh, and you’re not. He was our Champion, and you’re not. He is the Savior, and you’re not. You’re not supposed to be!

What you’ll find by pulling on your seriously-serious-about-sin boots is a load of crap in your boots. No matter how high and tight! That’s how it works. That’s the purpose of the Law that Jesus perfectly fulfilled and perfectly brought to an end (Colossians 2:13-15). The only thing that life-by-morals, life-by-pledge, or life-by-sin-avoidance can produce is sin because the power of sin is focusing upon yourself and your behavior relative to a standard (1 Corinthians 15:56; Romans 7). All you will receive from your focus is shame—no matter how you hide it, failure will be your constant companion.

Many of us learn to live around shame. The failures of the past haunt us into the attempt to avoid more shame by doing right. But that has to mean that early shame, early failure, motivates us still. “Don’t allow for any more of it!” Throw in some sin-avoidance teaching from a teacher we respect upon that past shame, and the course magically appears again in our minds. We pull on our boots and off we go.

Failure.

You and I are set up to know Jesus, not to get better and behave decently, but to know Jesus and the grace He is for us (Romans 6:14). He is our course; not the course we choose for Him—“I’ll do it right this time!”—but who He is for us every day. Remember? You were crucified with Him and now live—and only live—by faith in Him. That’s how we live by the Spirit in us. It’s not that we don’t care about our behavior—we do. We just know we can’t manage it. We’re not supposed to—remember? We didn’t believe and receive Jesus only to avoid the behavior that leads to ****, we received Him in order to live! And in order for Him to live in us and through us. Perfect.

Forget your boots. They don’t work. You’re in Christ, and He knows the walk ahead.

See you later. /
From Ralph Harris
Author of:
God's Astounding Opnion of You
Life According to Perfect

#sin #grace #life #joy #freedom #law #faith #Spirit

I’m a “grace” folk and I don’t think I could disagree more. What my experience has taught me, mostly through mistakes, is that if I am not doing my VERY BEST, to live in the center of Gods will every waking moment of my life( and a great deal of that involves avoiding sin), the only fellowship I have with God is imagined. Grace covers where I fail, but I must be continually engaged, not resting on my laurels proclaiming “Christ has my back. Let me nap in peace.”
It’s “hear and DO”, not “hear and recline.” Don’t recall one apostle that retired “resting in the grace of GOD”. Do you?

 

[gordon 2]

... of going soft on sin. This new post today may clear that up.
---------------

If sin is seriously evident in your life, it is not the sign that you need to get serious about sin; it is the evidence that you’re already serious about it, and need to get serious about grace.

Jesus was serious with sin, and dealt with it by the sacrifice of Himself. If you’re going to take on the same type of role that He did concerning sin—and pat yourself on the back for living like Jesus—you’re going to fail. (So Paul is a failure? "Be imitators of me, just as I also am of Christ." He was God in the flesh, and you’re not. ( Would Paul see the error here? Paul saw Jesus and knew people who had lived with Jesus. None of them took themselves to be as Jesus, yet they knew that his way of life was a teaching in itself independent of what scripture says about what Jesus said.) He was our Champion, and you’re not. He is the Savior, and you’re not. You’re not supposed to be!

What you’ll find by pulling on your seriously-serious-about-sin boots is a load of crap in your boots. No matter how high and tight! That’s how it works. That’s the purpose of the Law that Jesus perfectly fulfilled and perfectly brought to an end (Colossians 2:13-15).( Really it is that easy? Paul's worry about his own salvation post his baptism was all for nothing?) The only thing that life-by-morals, life-by-pledge, or life-by-sin-avoidance can produce is sin because the power of sin is focusing upon yourself and your behavior relative to a standard (1 Corinthians 15:56; Romans 7). ( Not logical or rational. Irrational. The worry of a parent for the group or individual the members of the family "hang around with" is all for nothing?)? ( Again Judes idea that avoiding creeps who pervert "the way itself" is for nothing?) All you will receive from your focus is shame—no matter how you hide it, failure will be your constant companion.

Many of us learn to live around shame. The failures of the past haunt us into the attempt to avoid more shame by doing right.( What kind of spiritual psycology is this?)? But that has to mean that early shame, early failure, motivates us still. “Don’t allow for any more of it!” Throw in some sin-avoidance teaching from a teacher we respect upon that past shame, and the course magically appears again in our minds. We pull on our boots and off we go. ( ?? I know of no serious christian that think they can join a "chain gang" for a bit and that will get them out of guilt or shame-- because it don't work. Repentance only works due the rubbing out of sin, for a sin not rubbed out is not conducive to life itself, let alone spiritual life. So by common christian sense... the argument is a failure. )

Failure.( It seems to me that if we are going to fly we need to get air above and more air below our wings. This is not self evident... since air planes are relatively new to life on earth. Looking up is ok, but looking down is a needed perspective on success, I would think. )

You and I are set up to know Jesus, not to get better and behave decently, but to know Jesus and the grace He is for us (Romans 6:14). He is our course; not the course we choose for Him—“I’ll do it right this time!”—but who He is for us every day. Remember? You were crucified with Him and now live—and only live—by faith in Him. That’s how we live by the Spirit in us. It’s not that we don’t care about our behavior—we do. We just know we can’t manage it. ( Well in many professions people have to manage their behaviours, some are better at it than others. Usually a minority falls short of codes of behavior. I suspect that the ministry is no different.) We’re not supposed to—remember? We didn’t believe and receive Jesus only to avoid the behavior that leads to ****, we received Him in order to live! And in order for Him to live in us and through us. Perfect.

Forget your boots. They don’t work. You’re in Christ, and He knows the walk ahead.

See you later. /
From Ralph Harris
Author of:
God's Astounding Opnion of You
Life According to Perfect

#sin #grace #life #joy #freedom #law #faith #Spirit

See my comments in the original text.

I wish it was simple to stay in the innocence of the state of grace due to the focus on Jesus or that His sacrifice on the cross was the blotting out of my own sin for the rest of my life. In my case when I have been with sin, with guilt and shame, after even being born again, such a focus was not my paradise regained. My focus with a troubled mind and an anxious heart was not always a great focus be it on Christ or anything else. But when my sins were rubbed out again, even after the cross, by my verbally asking my Lord, through the church which was given the power to bind and loose by my Lord... then again I was set free. And that is how it has rolled for me and how it has rolled for billions of Christians for a long, long, long time.

I'm open to other possibilities but focus on Jesus alone without the direct acknowledgement of where the problem is and an id on the sin and a willingness to say it audibly so one can hear himself/herself saying it... it ain't gona fly with me.

"Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective." I guess James was not a Ralph. Christians are not immune to the need for healing, thus these instructions-- and they don't mean focus on Jesus alone and sough off the shame and guilt for sin.

 

[StriperAddict]

Gordon the scripture of healing you bring proves the need of acknowledging our weaknesses with one another and that our prayers will bring corporate unity in the body, as well as growth in God's grace.
Don't loose the gem of the word rest gents. Even Jesus said this is why He came. *(I will bring you rest, ... my yoke is easy, etc.)
Grace and rest don't mean passivity, an active faith means God is working IN and THRU us but it doesn't have us under the old burdens of rule based religion. Most folks that object active living grace typically say nothing of the Christ that lives within them, thus they have a religious form of godliness but are open deniers of the power of God ... now resident in His church, within. Yes, that means Indwelling. Yes that means the life we now live we live by faith ... in Him who resides within.
Paul: I labored more than they (yea Paul !!), yet not I ... but the grace of God within me (oh, sorry Paul, didn't mean to give you the glory)
I'll make no apologies for Jesus' new home, even if I will confess Him IN you and I, beloved !!

Do we see this?

This is the WORK of God ... to believe in the One He has sent.
No greater love ....

 

[StriperAddict]

"Our solid relationship with God is not like our relationships with people, which can fail. Human relationships are based upon both parties remaining faithful and committed. And if one party is unfaithful or lacks in commitment, the relationship is dependent upon the other party being solid and forgiving, and remaining faithful and committed. While this can indeed happen in human relationships, and is a good thing, it's not ??????????. Humans have the capacity to fail each other.

But the good news is that there is a guarantee in our relationship with God. While we have the capacity to fail God, He always remains solid, faithful and committed to us. Our entire relationship with Him is based solely on His oath to Himself and His faithfulness to us, and not one iota on our oaths or faithfulness to Him.

2 Tim 2:13
"If we are faithless, he remains faithful, for he cannot deny Himself."

Heb 6:17-19
"Because God wanted to make the unchanging nature of his purpose very clear to the heirs of what was promised, he confirmed it with an oath. God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope offered to us may be greatly encouraged. We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, firm and secure."

Heb 7:22
"Because of this oath, Jesus has become the guarantee of a better covenant."

Human relationships have varying degrees of security, but our hope in Christ is an anchor for our soul. God's faithfulness never varies and it never ends. We are secure in Him forever!"
- Joel Brueseke
=====================
Heb 6:13: "God ... since He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself" ... that's New Covenant security!