Handgun Makers Should Rethink Rear Sights

GunnSmokeer

Senior Member
Rear sights on handguns have gotten wider over the generations. They all used to be tiny slits. And that's because the prevailing view of handgun marksmanship was to forgo the sights for any combat / self-defense fast shooting, and just point. Point-shoot out to 25 yards. If you had to shoot a pistol slowly, carefully, THEN is when you'd use the sights. So you could take the time to line up that short, dull-colored front sight into the tiny little notch of a rear sight.

In the old days, all shooting was practiced one-handed, too. That further worked against the idea of aimed fire, using a sight picture, in rapid fire, under combat conditions.

In modern times, WE ACTUALLY USE HANDGUN SIGHTS. In fact, point shooting is now something of a lost art. And among semi-automatic pistols, handgun sights have improved a lot in the last 100 years, even the last 50 years. Standard sights, even fixed sights, have gotten taller, bigger, with wider notches for the rear.
Unfortunately, that's not true for revolvers. Most defensive revolvers have too-narrow rear sights, even if they're the adjustable kind. Revolver sights are stuck in the 1920s and 1930s, technologically. Except for the few revolvers that come with fiber-optic rods that gather light for the front sight post, or have an actual glow in the dark night sight, with a capsule of radioactive tritium in there.

WHAT I WANT TO SEE is more gun manufacturers making BIGGER sights on ordinary, medium-priced (and low-priced) defensive handguns. The notch of the rear sight should be twice as wide as even a modern pistol like a Glock, SiG, Kimber, etc. Twice as wide would mean the sight is optimized for fast shooting at distances of 25 yards or less, even down to 5 or 7 yards. Current sights on modern handguns may be "usable" and "acceptable" at 15 yards, but they're really optimized for shooting man-sized targets at 50 yards (because that's the standard for military-contract pistols).

When I go to shooting ranges where people can choose to shoot the target from any distance they want, 95% of the time people with open-sighted normal-sized handguns shoot them from 5 or 7 yards. Spitting distance, basically. Rarely do they put the targets past 10 yards. The only time you see people shooting at 25 yard targets with a pistol is if they have a match gun, made for target shooting in competition, usually fitted with an optical sight of some sort. OR the other kind of people you see shooting at 25 yards are cops and security guards who are practicing to pass their agency's firearm qualification, and some of the shots fired at such a mandatory qualification are done from 25 yards.

FOR MOST PEOPLE, UNDER MOST CIRCUMSTANCES, the ideal handgun sight would have a rear sight with a shallow U-shaped notch, like the bottom half of a circle that is 8 mm diameter, with a bright colored outline (white or yellow or lime green) and a high-viz front sight of a contrasting color (red or orange).
This kind of sight would best suit the type of shooting MOST PEOPLE ALREADY DO... I'm not trying to change how they shoot. I'm suggesting gun companies recognize that NRA slowfire bullseye shooting at 50 yards / 50 meters (AKA "Camp Perry style") is not popular anymore, but today's handguns have the type of sights that are excellent for that use.
 

GunnSmokeer

Senior Member
Some actual data, measured by myself personally with a digital micrometer on various guns that I own, or my friends own. RANKED ACCORDING TO AGE OF GUN.

1930s era S&W M&P revolver, pre-model 10, K-frame round butt, 2" bbl. Fixed rear sight (milled into topstrap of frame) is 0.09" or 2.28 mm.

1982 era S&W M34 Kit Gun, J frame, 4" bbl. adj. sights. 0.10" or 2.5 mm wide.

1985 era S&W M66-2, K-frame, adj. sights. 0.126" or 3.21 mm.

1997 era S&W 317, J-frame .22 snubby, fixed sights. 0.128" or 3.26 mm.

2000 era Springfield XD9 tactical, fixed sights. 0.148" or 3.77 mm.

2015 Taurus Millennium G2, adj. sights. 0.162" or 4.1 mm.

2018 S&W Shield EZ380, fixed sights. 0.167" or 4.24 mm.
 

GunnSmokeer

Senior Member
I'd like to see a rear sight that's got a notch 8 mm wide, or about .30"
 

GunnSmokeer

Senior Member
P.S. The "Weaver stance" which started in the 1950s and became more and more popular through the years, in action pistol competitions and in law enforcement training, naturally places the gun a little closer to your eyes than the "isosceles" stance or any other method that fully extends your dominant arm.
This means the sight picture from a Weaver stance will seem to have a wider rear notch, making it faster to get on target with at least a "flash sight picture" if not a perfectly-aligned one (depending on how much time you have to get the shot off).
 

rayjay

Senior Member
One thing I'm having to deal with is my aging eyes. I am now in trifocals and I need to rock my head back to get the right lens between the pupil and the sights. Not natural at all. I have taken to "mounting" [ can't come up with the right word ] the gun every time I handle it [ which is when I put it in my pocket before going out and when I get home and empty my pockets]. I pick an object at an appropriate distance, bring the gun up into the stance and then make sure I have my head in the right position so the front sight is sharp.
 

Dub

Senior Member
The beauty of it is that there are some superb sight options available for many guns. You can swap them out for what works best for you.....and for what the intended purpose is for the handgun.

It's not hard to find a sight that is to one's liking. It's not hard to have it installed or DIY.
 
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Lilly001

Senior Member
One thing I'm having to deal with is my aging eyes. I am now in trifocals and I need to rock my head back to get the right lens between the pupil and the sights. Not natural at all. I have taken to "mounting" [ can't come up with the right word ] the gun every time I handle it [ which is when I put it in my pocket before going out and when I get home and empty my pockets]. I pick an object at an appropriate distance, bring the gun up into the stance and then make sure I have my head in the right position so the front sight is sharp.
That is why I have gone to red dots on my handguns that allow it.
Darn eyes just aren't getting any better.
It's also probaly why I'm trending to better glass on my rifle scopes.
 

transfixer

Senior Member
I don't like rear sights which have white dots, or in the case of Glock, a white bucket, you're suppsed to focus on the front sight in self defense situations especially, and white marks on the rear sight distract from that, another reason I like my CZ p10s I picked up a while back, the rear sight is plain black serrated , so as not to pick up glare, the front sight is tritium with an orange outline, makes it easy to pick up the front sight fast,

At 7yds or closer if you try to use your sights in a defensive situation you're wasting time, we should all practice point shooting at that distance and closer, it can cut off a second or more, which could mean the difference in who survives,
 

tad1

Senior Member
The beauty of it is that there are some superb sight options available for many guns. You can swap them out for what works best for you.....and for what the intended purpose is for the handgun.

It's not hard to find a sight that is to one's liking. It's not hard to have it installed or DIY.

I did just this on my mk2 target pistol. A smaller round bead front site and a v notch rear. Thing is an absolute tack driver! Purchased them from maybe brownells and they weren’t particularly $$.
JT
 
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delacroix

BANNED
Different strokes. I'm a point shooter at distances I practice for actual defensive use. If I got time to aim I got time to run. I ain't runnin' from a mugger. I'm runnin' from the civil suit.

The market is moving to red dot sights on pistols.
 

cowhornedspike

Senior Member
A guy in Florida use to make a sight called "one ragged hole" which was a large peep sight to replace your rear sight on a revolver. I have one on mine and although I am normally a bad pistol shot, I can hit tacks with that pistol. As far as I know he had medical issues and quit making them years ago but if you can find one ...buy it.
 

GunnSmokeer

Senior Member
I want a new type of handgun rear sight NOT for precise accuracy at distance, but better practical accuracy (keeping them in maybe an 8" group) at normal pistol training distances of 7 yards, 10 yards, 15 yards, and up to 25 yards, although at 25 the difference between an extra-wide rear notch and a modern "new normal" width notch would be slight.

People who take handgun training and have to qualify with their pistols should be able to keep a tighter group than just "minute of bad guy." Point shooting isn't always going to cut it, if your instructor gives you a drill to do a Mozambique on two targets, six shots total, from 7 yards, in only 5 seconds. You can't "point shoot" that.
And while WITH A LOT OF PRACTICE you could do it with almost any handgun with normal sights, the kinds of sights I'm advocating for would make it easier, especially for new shooters, or shooters who are new to fast sighted shooting.
 

rayjay

Senior Member
In my near daily 'mounting' of my carry pistol I have found that the 3 white dots help a lot. Sometimes it's dim in the bedroom and maybe it's cloudy outside so there is even less light. Sometimes the bathroom light is on so it's bright where my 'target' is but dim where I am standing. Often even the white dots are difficult to see. If there were no white dots the sights would be invisible.
 

transfixer

Senior Member
In my near daily 'mounting' of my carry pistol I have found that the 3 white dots help a lot. Sometimes it's dim in the bedroom and maybe it's cloudy outside so there is even less light. Sometimes the bathroom light is on so it's bright where my 'target' is but dim where I am standing. Often even the white dots are difficult to see. If there were no white dots the sights would be invisible.

Try a pistol with a blacked out rear sight and a very bright tritium/orange outlined front sight, that configuration works much better for my eyes, on a three dot setup the two rear dots always appear brighter than the front one, and distracts from focusing on the front sight,, at least for my eyes.
 
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transfixer

Senior Member
one of the better night sight setups I've seen is the XS F8 night sights, it uses a large tritium front sight dot, and a smaller tritium dot right below the rear sight channel, you simply line up the dots , much like a post and dot setup I had on a Sig229 years ago, I loved that sight configuration, and it was excellent for precise shooting at distance also.

my stepson just got a PPQ that has the F8 night sights on it, and he really likes it, being in LE he has shot with a lot of different sight setups, most having night sights.
 

rayjay

Senior Member
one of the things I have relearned after starting my gun mounting is that repetition is huge. The first 5+ times I had trouble finding the front sight, having my head rocked into the right position to get the right lens in front of the only good eyeball I have and finding the point of aim. Now after a couple of months it's almost automatic to have the pistol in my line of sight and my head in the right position. The gun comes up, the front sight is THERE and all I am doing is choosing the object that I will use as my aiming point this go around.
 
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