Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
2 right now.
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Weekly Trapline SW Georgia
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Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
2 yotes today. Females. Only got a live shot of one. Big female was caught by 2 toes. Thats why I like the MB550 closed jaw.
Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
Been slow for me. Been on the same place for 3 weeks. Finished with a coyote today.
Makes a total of 16 yotes for the 3 weeks.
Makes a total of 16 yotes for the 3 weeks.
Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
Yeah, not my best work, but I’ll take it. Place has been trapped hard every year for a long time. Old quail plantation. I just picked it up this year, and trying to figure out what they have seen from the previous trapper always takes time.
Been thinking about intensive predator control and lessons learned in wildlife management. Most significant is the concept of ICMF= inter-compensating mortality factors. Simply put, if one thing don't get 'em something else will. So let's say, when you take out the cats, coons, and canines this releases the pressure on their main prey base, namely rats and mice. These populations increase and in turn start preying on some of the things you thought you were protecting i.e. the nests of ground nesting birds. You gotta' know that there are way more rats and mice in a given habitat than say quail, turkey, and deer, so predators which are opportunistic, have more opportunities of encountering and eating rats and mice. This is not to say that predators don't prey on the large items, but that without habitat management removing the large obvious predators is mostly a feel good measure for the landowner/trapper. Don't mean to rain on anybody's parade by any means, just a fact of life. KEEP ON TRAPPING AND FEELING GOOD!
Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
12,000 acres. 160 traps. Thats why I said not my best work. Should have caught double the yotes. I’m sure I caught some resident and some roaming coyotes. Most of my females were in heat.
Can you post the link to the study that says mice and rats prey on eggs, chicks, and poults? I’ve done a lot of reading but haven’t come across that yet.
Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
Pretty sure it is a Tall Timbers study or an Albany Quail Project study. It is outdated. Just like the fire ant study. Sure they do, on occasion prey on nests. But not enough to matter. Especially with adequate habitat management. The meso predators prey on nests/quail much harder, exponentially more.
Just google cotton rats preying on quail nests.
I'm not saying that meso predators don't prey on quail and turkey, just that removing them may not be all that's needed to enhance the populations. I like trapping coyotes, cats and coons as good as the next fellar, been at 50+ years. I just look at furbearers as sustainable resource. ICMF doesn't go out of date.
If you need to convince yourself of the futility of a war on coyotes whether public, private or individual all you got to do is look at how long they've been at war with 'em in the west. And there's still enough for the big coyote guys to rack up huge numbers year after year.
Keep on trapping!
I'm not saying that meso predators don't prey on quail and turkey, just that removing them may not be all that's needed to enhance the populations. I like trapping coyotes, cats and coons as good as the next fellar, been at 50+ years. I just look at furbearers as sustainable resource. ICMF doesn't go out of date.
If you need to convince yourself of the futility of a war on coyotes whether public, private or individual all you got to do is look at how long they've been at war with 'em in the west. And there's still enough for the big coyote guys to rack up huge numbers year after year.
Keep on trapping!
mossyoakpro
Senior Member
I believe they are now using the cotton rat as a gauge for the predator population on properties...at least that is what Tall Timbers has said recently. I have some experience on the large scale trapping but being a 1 man show it's tough to put up the kind of numbers it takes to trap that amount of acreage so I just stick to the smaller tracts that I can handle on my own. I work on occasion with a fella that traps full time every day, 365 days a year on those enormous properties down south and it is a different ball game for sure. My hat is off to the folks that have the stamina to do that volume day in and day out....I'm getting too old for that! LOL
Tight chains everyone!!
Tight chains everyone!!
I know what you mean!
A friend once told a group that the hardest part of trapping all day long was getting in and out of the truck. They all laughed. But think about running 100 traps - that's a heap of getting in and out of the truck! May not be the hardest part (driving cross stakes in clay w/a 3# hammer & digging dirt holes before augers gets my vote), but to the uneducated/inexperienced it's something they'd have to try to believe.
Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
According to Terhune, Palmer and Sisson in the Tall Timbers Bobwhite Quail Management Handbook, cotton rats have been falsely accused of predating on nests for decades. What they actually found is that the rats eat the egg shells after other predators already destroy the nest. They very rarely predate on the nests first.
Ol' Gobblero
Senior Member
Now there is also the idea that when rat numbers are high, with increasingly high avian predator populations, that the rats can actually reduce avian predation on quail. If this is true, then reducing meso predator numbers will increase rat numbers and decrease avain predation on quail. Some places now even have rat piles, essentially tree piles, to increase rat numbers.
Quail research is the most dynamic, ever changing research there is. What was thought to be true even 5 years ago has been proven incorrect. What always holds true is that habitat modification/management will often increase quail numbers more than any other aspect of “growing” quail.
Quail research is the most dynamic, ever changing research there is. What was thought to be true even 5 years ago has been proven incorrect. What always holds true is that habitat modification/management will often increase quail numbers more than any other aspect of “growing” quail.
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Y’all gentlemen are more educated than I am on the matter. All I know is if a landowner asks me to trap and they think it helps their quail and turkey populations then I’m giving it my all.
I wish I could trap all day or even just check during daylight hours, but right now that’s not an option so I’ll take what I can get and be thankful for the opportunity.
I’d have to think that a lot of these managers/owners have to see some sort of impact with trapping or they wouldn’t do it or have it done. They also realize it’s basically a never ending battle. Eliminating predators will never happen, it’s just to keep their numbers in check. I have been on properties that have never seen a trap and a shot deer left more than an few hours before recovering resulted in a partially eaten deer. What I’d give now to have been trapping during that time. Most of the properties I get to trap now has everyone on a tractor or ATV with a rifle just for shooting coyotes if seen.
I wish I could trap all day or even just check during daylight hours, but right now that’s not an option so I’ll take what I can get and be thankful for the opportunity.
I’d have to think that a lot of these managers/owners have to see some sort of impact with trapping or they wouldn’t do it or have it done. They also realize it’s basically a never ending battle. Eliminating predators will never happen, it’s just to keep their numbers in check. I have been on properties that have never seen a trap and a shot deer left more than an few hours before recovering resulted in a partially eaten deer. What I’d give now to have been trapping during that time. Most of the properties I get to trap now has everyone on a tractor or ATV with a rifle just for shooting coyotes if seen.
Good post.
Thanks for the info.
I apologize for besmirching the character and reputation of a fine upstanding citizen of the quail community, the cotton rat. Saw one yesterday while clearing invading cedar trees. I like seeing them. They're a sign that things are right in the critter world.
I live in Dougherty County and ride all over Baker County, big plantation country. I see where they push up oak trees out of the pines and pile 'em, but don't burn 'em. My first thought was that that created varmint (nest predator) refuges. But huh, they were one step ahead of me - rat piles - well I'll be dog.
Ever read "A Hand-Full of Feathers"? I grew up in this part of the country '50s & 60s and remember big coveys of wild birds & lots of folks with bird dogs. Always amazed me what lengths they'd go to for a hand-full of feathers! Of course this was B.D. -before deer. Now got something else to be amazed at!
Was privileged to trap some of the Thomasville plantations several years ago. Was busy making a set at a fence-row, field road boundary. Heard a little rustling in the weeds and looked up to see a covey milling around not six feet away! Put out birds I reckon.
Ever read "A Hand-Full of Feathers"? I grew up in this part of the country '50s & 60s and remember big coveys of wild birds & lots of folks with bird dogs. Always amazed me what lengths they'd go to for a hand-full of feathers! Of course this was B.D. -before deer. Now got something else to be amazed at!
Was privileged to trap some of the Thomasville plantations several years ago. Was busy making a set at a fence-row, field road boundary. Heard a little rustling in the weeds and looked up to see a covey milling around not six feet away! Put out birds I reckon.
