Artfuldodger
Senior Member
How do you balance and perform that fruit in the form of obedience without seeming like pride or that you are doing it for the rewards?Yes....obedience is the FRUIT of my salvation, not the ROOT of our salvation
How do you balance and perform that fruit in the form of obedience without seeming like pride or that you are doing it for the rewards?Yes....obedience is the FRUIT of my salvation, not the ROOT of our salvation
Even though there is no longer Jew nor Gentile as far as salvation goes, we still have Jews and Gentiles. That same passage says there is no longer male and female either. Yet we know there is. Paul shows many verses that states there is a difference. It doesn't pertain to salvation but Paul has different rules & roles for men and women.I still find it really hard to relate to masonic Jews. They seem bent on changing our traditions. Just because it doesn't tell us dates in the bible. Just because the Bible doesn't tell us to celebrate Easter or Christmas. This doesn't make it a sin to celebrate our Savior. Once you accept Jesus as the Messiah you are a Christian. Not A Jew. You can try to keep Gods laws. You can love Jesus as Lord. You can even be baptized. You can celebrate the feast instead of Christmas and Easter. But you is a Christian now! I still haven't figured out why Gon stick us with the Jews on this page. Unless there are not any Jews on this forum? In which case they can be stuck on any of the forum pages. They just a need a home I guess???
Since obedience to God's commands, fruits, works, lordship, etc. are a result of salvation and not the cause, why is it so important how we manifest that obedience to God's commands through our fruit in the same way as the next Christian?
Meaning from each other, why can't I show my manifestation differently than someone else?
So you have said your elected yet you also say here “once you accept Christ as your savior”. That looks like a decision and not a force of God to make you chosen. Which it reality is free will that you accepted him. Which if you didn’t “accept him” you would still be lost.To be clear about the devil. He hates everyone. From experience I can tell you that he is different once you accept Christ as your savior. His game is providing just enough worldly gain to keep us comfortable in his grasp. He becomes vicious when ones heart turns to Christ. God's laws never have been abolished and they never will be on this earth. Keeping the law is a good thing. Just won't save you.
I do think the idea of what it means to obey God has changed over the years among Christians even in my life time. I asked on this forum years ago what it meant and most said it means believe, confess, and repent. To believe in the Good News.It is the only way He has asked us to show Him love. John 14:21 I John 5:3
I think many Christians struggle with believing that a believer could possibly obey Him out of love only. It's evident in this forum. If someone is keeping the commandments, surely they are doing it as a way to earn salvation! lol There also seems to be a belief that God doesn't want us to even try to obey if we can't do it perfectly. lol It may be an excuse, though, for those who don't want anything to do with God's Law Proverbs 28:9
Many are okay with religion, as long as it doesn't interfere with their life. ;-)
Something I also remember from past discussions was salvation was 100% from grace except when it comes to homosexuals. Then the discussion quickly changed to how important works was for salvation. I mean the struggling alcoholic didn't have to change but the poor soul of the homosexual was in jeopardy if he didn't.It is the only way He has asked us to show Him love. John 14:21 I John 5:3
I think many Christians struggle with believing that a believer could possibly obey Him out of love only. It's evident in this forum. If someone is keeping the commandments, surely they are doing it as a way to earn salvation! lol There also seems to be a belief that God doesn't want us to even try to obey if we can't do it perfectly. lol It may be an excuse, though, for those who don't want anything to do with God's Law Proverbs 28:9
Many are okay with religion, as long as it doesn't interfere with their life. ;-)
Every one of the elect accept Christ as Savior. There is no other Place for them to go.So you have said your elected yet you also say here “once you accept Christ as your savior”. That looks like a decision and not a force of God to make you chosen. Which it reality is free will that you accepted him. Which if you didn’t “accept him” you would still be lost.
And some folks actually believe what Scripture says about election. They will not place their feelings for you... above their reverence for God.Election just breaks my heart that folks actually believe that.
Those that believe election know why and how “whosever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved”.From years past I’ve been round and round with folks in here about election and they still believe in election and I still believe in free will and that “whosever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved”. My list goes on and on.
Of course the believer would be alright with that. To not be would indicate that they would do it differently.What actually hurt me the worst was I asked someone on this forum “if God chose to save one of your sons and the other was chosen for he!! Hiw would that make you feel”. He replied “we serve a just God and if that’s what he chose to do I would be alright with that”
????
Bandersnatch never said he kept the Law in order to be saved nor did he do it to look good.
He does it the same reason most of us show fruit or works. It's a way to show obedience and love to to God.
Thank you, Art. absolutely true. I had lived the grace life my entire christian life but when I learned how God asked me to show love and appreciation, it was a done deal for me. I'm already saved, no different than any of you, as long as I hold to faith in Him and His atoning work. Obedience won't make me more saved, either. lol
The walk I walk is not for everyone, and few will walk this way. A "remnant" of God's family, if you will. Rev 12:17 "the REMNANT of the seed of the woman, who believe in Jesus and keep God's commandments".
I certainly don't want to put words in anyone's mouth. I was responding to everyone as a whole in my remarks. Good works being a result of fruit to me is the same as keeping the law as a result of pure intentions. Why we do what we do is important to the Lord. Jesus changed that for us. Before Christ ones intentions behind keeping the law didn't matter. I assume that is the same today in the Jewish faith. I still just wonder if the forum lumped us together so that followers of Christ can minister to the few Jewish people that are on the forum? Or was the intent to create conflict and hard conversations? Are Christians still considered another sect of Judaism? Did a atheist lump us together? Was there intentions behind this or did someone simply not care enough to separate us? Can you imagine if they lumped us in with the Atheist page? That would not fly. One group denied thier own Savior. The other group would die for the Lord Jesus.
I ain't been around since its inception but from what I understand the AAA forum was formed by a request submitted after the "spiritual" forum was already here.
A place where they too might discuss...
Before that wasn't there just one religious forum? I think it's divided up enough already.The Athiest Subforum was made and put here in 2009.
How is your fruit example different than this?
matt 5:17 jesus fulfills Law
matt 5:18 Law is forever lol
matt 5:19 You will be great in heaven if you keep the law
rev 22:14,15 You will be blessed in heaven if you keep the commandments.
Isn't obeying God's commands after salvation the same as "fruit?" Fruit, works, law keeping, keeping God's commands is all the same thing isn't it?
The only problem I see performing fruits or keeping God's commandments would be doing it for the rewards. Yet wouldn't seeking one's on salvation be for the reward of eternal life. Just to ask for salvation is sorta self centered. I mean unless you are doing it for God and not to save your own soul.