Disappointed in church cancellations

[LittleDrummerBoy]

The Book says, "Do not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing."

Lots of counties in GA without a single case of COVID-19.

The Holy Spirit knew there would be diseases and plagues.

Sure, some steps of care are reasonable. I don't mind encouraging those sick with contagious diseases to stay home. Perhaps maintaining some "social distancing" practices in the meetings.

But this thing is likely to last a while, and the enemies of God are always looking for ways to get the saints to forsake their assembling together.

Mid-week, a number of churches were sending out encouragements for "faith over fear." But come Sunday, they had cancelled.

 

[NE GA Pappy]

The Book says, "Do not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing."

Lots of counties in GA without a single case of COVID-19.

The Holy Spirit knew there would be diseases and plagues.

Sure, some steps of care are reasonable. I don't mind encouraging those sick with contagious diseases to stay home. Perhaps maintaining some "social distancing" practices in the meetings.

But this thing is likely to last a while, and the enemies of God are always looking for ways to get the saints to forsake their assembling together.

Mid-week, a number of churches were sending out encouragements for "faith over fear." But come Sunday, they had cancelled.

one of the biggest in your area was one of the first to bail. I don't understand it myself. If you have a weak or compromised health situation, stay home. That doesn't mean that everyone needs to stay home.

To me this is just another sign that we may not believe what we say we believe.

 

[4HAND]

We had service this morning. We're having our evening service too.

 

[NE GA Pappy]

We had service this morning. We're having our evening service too.

us too.

I stayed home with grandbabies that are getting over the flu ( thank you Jesus that the adults have dodged it) because don't nobody need that. We did participate over the internet though. We will be attending Wednesday night.

 

[4HAND]

Our Pastor said we will continue having our regular services until/unless our Governor bans gatherings at the level of our monthly average attendance.

 

[SemperFiDawg]

So much for belief in Christ removing the sting of death. During the first couple of centuries Christians stayed and cared for the sick and dying during the plagues that hit the Roman Empire They did it out of love and the confidence that death to them would mean a better place. Death to todays Christians means no more TV, eating out or going to their kids sporting events. Yeah, I would say something was lost along the way.

 

[LittleDrummerBoy]

one of the biggest in your area was one of the first to bail. I don't understand it myself. If you have a weak or compromised health situation, stay home. That doesn't mean that everyone needs to stay home.

To me this is just another sign that we may not believe what we say we believe.

I tend to agree that while the week or health compromised need to stay home, wholesale church closures are not called for, especially in counties with no reported cases of COVID-19. And while I don't mind a situational church cancellation here or there, I think the church will become much less effective if this lasts very long - especially if organizations stop meeting in person.

One church we attend, Free Chapel, moved their big Sunday meetings online, but small groups were still meeting over the weekend. Pastor Jentzen gave an excellent message that reached over 200,000 people, which is many more that can fit into our main campus in Gainesville. Another fellowship we attend occasionally, First Century Ministries, held their normal service in person.

Our Pastor said we will continue having our regular services until/unless our Governor bans gatherings at the level of our monthly average attendance.

The government does not have the authority to cancel meetings of the church, as this would violate the 1st Amendment protections of freedom of assembly and freedom of religion. Why is it that so many people who accept "separation of church and state" think that government can cancel church meetings? The mayor of Atlanta has already moved to ban church meetings over a certain size. We must obey God rather than men.

Allowing government to cancel meetings of the church sets a very dangerous precedent. There may be specific locations where the reasons seem justified in the present purported "crisis" but if all "justification" requires is government scientists saying "we need to do this" then future governments will be able to find those scientists.

Decisions of the church may be informed by government and/or scientists. But both the Bible and the Constitution require that decision making belongs to the church, and the church should remain autonomous from government decrees forcing cancellations and closures.

Giving the government authority to determine how and where churches meet is not working out well for Christians in China.

 

[4HAND]

I tend to agree that while the week or health compromised need to stay home, wholesale church closures are not called for, especially in counties with no reported cases of COVID-19. And while I don't mind a situational church cancellation here or there, I think the church will become much less effective if this lasts very long - especially if organizations stop meeting in person.

One church we attend, Free Chapel, moved their big Sunday meetings online, but small groups were still meeting over the weekend. Pastor Jentzen gave an excellent message that reached over 200,000 people, which is many more that can fit into our main campus in Gainesville. Another fellowship we attend occasionally, First Century Ministries, held their normal service in person.

The government does not have the authority to cancel meetings of the church, as this would violate the 1st Amendment protections of freedom of assembly and freedom of religion. Why is it that so many people who accept "separation of church and state" think that government can cancel church meetings? The mayor of Atlanta has already moved to ban church meetings over a certain size. We must obey God rather than men.

Allowing government to cancel meetings of the church sets a very dangerous precedent. There may be specific locations where the reasons seem justified in the present purported "crisis" but if all "justification" requires is government scientists saying "we need to do this" then future governments will be able to find those scientists.

Decisions of the church may be informed by government and/or scientists. But both the Bible and the Constitution require that decision making belongs to the church, and the church should remain autonomous from government decrees forcing cancellations and closures.

Giving the government authority to determine how and where churches meet is not working out well for Christians in China.

So your church already cancelled their services & yet you're questioning my Pastor's decision to continue until/unless the Governor bans gatherings of people over a certain amount?

My Pastor said we will follow the law unless it conflicts with our beliefs. Seems reasonable to me.

 

[NE GA Pappy]

So your church already cancelled their services & yet you're questioning my Pastor's decision to continue until/unless the Governor bans gatherings of people over a certain amount?

My Pastor said we will follow the law unless it conflicts with our beliefs. Seems reasonable to me.

UH... Yeah.

I don't get it. Does this make sense???

1. disappointed in church closings

2. reached over 200,000 by closing church

3. gooberment can't make us close, so nah nah nah nah nah

 

[SemperFiDawg]

Giving the government authority to determine how and where churches meet is not working out well for Christians in China.

I'm pretty sure nobody "gave" the Chinese government the authority to determine how and where churches meet. You may want to look into that.

As for the rest of your post, it's just contradictory political blather.

 

[SemperFiDawg]

UH... Yeah.

I don't get it. Does this make sense???

1. disappointed in church closings

2. reached over 200,000 by closing church

3. gooberment can't make us close, so nah nah nah nah nah

It makes sense if one is wanting to flash their beliefisms, church size, church activity, etc. Yeah, there's a trend there of spiritual 'virtue signaling'.....and has been for a while. Just look at the history.

 

[Throwback]

So when folks at your church get this and spread it because they came to church what you gonna say?? “sorry”??
It’s not like you don’t know

 

[Israel]

All things are working for the revelation of the glory of the Lord Jesus Christ.
To whatever end God is patiently working to deliver us from distractions we may find the grace to recognize and confess.

Things big in the world's eye were never to be our portion, whether they are described or appearing as "good" or "bad". There has been and remains a church, a remnant not concerned with the world's favor nor scorn.

It is not as though the Lord has left us comfortless nor alone, as orphans at the whim of a cold machine. Nor that He is wearied in reminding us, as often and as much as necessary "do not fear what they fear". This is His good pleasure...to provide His children's bread. As ever only He has. Even to the telling us of that which we have been made able to ask. Even to instructing us, as now able, what to ask for.

Any numbness of which we may have not even been aware...first to the Lord and then to one another is disclosed to us most plainly by any longing that things (to our sensibilities) "return to normal." May the Lord show His continuing graciousness that we be able to bear reproof.

For the very best of the world's normal is "we may be able to help you stay comfortable till you die...and the cost is only the soul. We may keep you distracted...even stuporous."

And God knows where I have, and continue to need a sharp awakening of light into a dim eye. If we have enough strength to complain...we may yet have "too much" strength...till reduced plainly, and in our own sight...to only plea. How much is ready to be shown as ours...if we but ask.

I am either a man like you, or not. God knows. If I make any claim to be like you, how easily is offense made. For I so barely at any time "want to be like me"...how terrible to hang that upon another!

Yet, if I claim to be unlike or unique...even how much more so!

But I will tell you of a man who has "asked". I make no claim his asking is anything, or even at all sufficient. But he has, for better or worse asked, asked when falling, asked when tripping, asked when stumbling, asked when shame came knocking and looking for a home...asked as he felt the earth opening beneath him in loss..."Lord, is there escape from being the man who never knows what he has till it seems lost, the man who takes all for granted...till it is taken...and only then...he begins to see its truer value...and also the shame of blindness in his now very clear lack of appreciation?"

As Joni Mitchell asked "Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone...?"


Lord...must it be...always?

Oh, how the Lord desires with such burning desire to give what cannot be taken for granted. It is excluded by its nature...it has no place provided for in it...for the taking for granted. And by that very nature itself...throws the light of life...even upon those things...which once seemed able to be "taken for granted". Things need not be lost to be appreciated...too late. By the gaining of that one thing...even the all things are shown...as gain.

"Count your blessings" sounds so very platitudinous. But it is only made so by what would have us count something else. Lest we come to see who is our blessing One.

We can have, and be among those to whom more is given. We can, I am told...even grow in gratitude. Not needing loss as teacher.

or...


And a man needs reminding.

Nevertheless, we cannot escape being taught.

 

[Israel]

If the above at all smells of my own self righteousness.

It is not that we "do wrong" when things of this temporal age become large in our sight, (God knows how shaking things make themselves plain...by their shakiness) we shall simply never be satisfied...we have a life that must push through, and occasion, occasions are provided.

Has it ever been else...than this?

 

[LittleDrummerBoy]

My point is we ought not rest in our work of making disciples, and we certainly ought to obey God rather than men.

The governor of Louisiana has cancelled all church meetings over 250 people until April 13, saying "get ready for the new normal" and that the cancellations may need to be extended. It would not surprise me if the number of attendees government allows is reduced to 50 or even to 10. So far, very few have questioned governmental power to dictate church meetings. It is shocking how many purported Christians are so quick to submit to unBiblical orders from the government. COVID-19 has not even been found in 52 of 62 Louisiana Parishes, and many churches ordered closed are hundreds of miles away from any known COVID-19 cases.

It is important to note the key difference between a voluntary closure and an ordered one. With voluntary closures, the church itself decides when it may resume normal operations. With government orders, one is waiting for government to give the OK to open again for public services. They may have a very different idea of "how long" is long enough.

The internet is a great communication resource that can be valuable in carrying out the great commission. But as the main delivery service, it is subject to censorship. No major Internet Service Provider claims to maintain "free speech." Offensive content can and will be censored. YouTube and FaceBook have already implemented new procedures for identifying and censoring content. The move online subjects content to those censors. Over a longer period, tailoring content to avoid those censors brings increasingly greater compromise to "whole counsel of God" and teaching "everything" Christ commanded.

It also shocks the conscience how many Christians in government and law enforcement support these forced closures and believe Christians should submit, forgetting both their oaths to support and defend the Constitution as well as the Apostles' instruction that "we must obey God rather than men." Sure, the real church will continue underground. But many who reckoned themselves Christians may become persecutors of the church by forcing closures. To my knowledge, not a single Christian who is a law enforcement agent has said they would resist "doing what I'm told" regarding enforcement of church closures. Every one who does it is a Judas.

 

[Israel]

But many who reckoned themselves Christians may become persecutors of the church by forcing closures. To my knowledge, not a single Christian who is a law enforcement agent has said they would resist "doing what I'm told" regarding enforcement of church closures. Every one who does it is a Judas.

Leave a little room for a Saul. To become a Paul.

Even a Hebrew of Hebrews may discover something of being a Jew that was once hidden from his sight in his presumption of "but I am already one" LOL...and a quite good one at that!

Poems are made by fools that's true

But only God can make a Jew.

(BTW, if we do not yet recognize what Judas "looks like" in a very intimate way, we will need those "external" representations)

 

[The Original Rooster]

I can find a lot of verses in the Bible saying obey government authority but only a few saying resist government authority.

 

[4HAND]

My point is we ought not rest in our work of making disciples, and we certainly ought to obey God rather than men.

The governor of Louisiana has cancelled all church meetings over 250 people until April 13, saying "get ready for the new normal" and that the cancellations may need to be extended. It would not surprise me if the number of attendees government allows is reduced to 50 or even to 10. So far, very few have questioned governmental power to dictate church meetings. It is shocking how many purported Christians are so quick to submit to unBiblical orders from the government. COVID-19 has not even been found in 52 of 62 Louisiana Parishes, and many churches ordered closed are hundreds of miles away from any known COVID-19 cases.

It is important to note the key difference between a voluntary closure and an ordered one. With voluntary closures, the church itself decides when it may resume normal operations. With government orders, one is waiting for government to give the OK to open again for public services. They may have a very different idea of "how long" is long enough.

The internet is a great communication resource that can be valuable in carrying out the great commission. But as the main delivery service, it is subject to censorship. No major Internet Service Provider claims to maintain "free speech." Offensive content can and will be censored. YouTube and FaceBook have already implemented new procedures for identifying and censoring content. The move online subjects content to those censors. Over a longer period, tailoring content to avoid those censors brings increasingly greater compromise to "whole counsel of God" and teaching "everything" Christ commanded.

It also shocks the conscience how many Christians in government and law enforcement support these forced closures and believe Christians should submit, forgetting both their oaths to support and defend the Constitution as well as the Apostles' instruction that "we must obey God rather than men." Sure, the real church will continue underground. But many who reckoned themselves Christians may become persecutors of the church by forcing closures. To my knowledge, not a single Christian who is a law enforcement agent has said they would resist "doing what I'm told" regarding enforcement of church closures. Every one who does it is a Judas.

I'm certainly glad you're not my judge.

 

[LittleDrummerBoy]

I'm certainly glad you're not my judge.

So you would enforce the governor's orders to close down churches?

May I recommend you consult a good 1st Amendment attorney before doing that. "Just following orders" is no excuse for violating the 1st Amendment, and officers can be held individually accountable for following illegal orders.

 

[BeerThirty]

Here's what my church sent out. I respect it:

"After careful consideration, discussion, and prayer, our Elder and Lead Team have decided to follow the recommendations of our governing officials and suspend all activities through March 20. While God does not give us a spirit of fear, He does call us to love our neighbors. We believe we are demonstrating love when we do everything we can to protect those around us.


At this time, the following will be in effect March 14-20. We will make decisions regarding future activities on a week-by-week basis."

I will comment that, I believe the decision is easier for our church since we stream it live every Sunday, so many folks can still can participate in service.