Famous atheist says he identifies as a 'cultural Christian' and is 'horrified' by promotion of Islamic holiday

[SemperFiDawg]

Famous atheist says he identifies as a 'cultural Christian' and is 'horrified' by promotion of Islamic holiday

Scientist and outspoken atheist Richard Dawkins said if he had to choose between Christianity and Islam, he would choose Christianity every time.

www.foxnews.com

Thought this was an interesting article in two aspects:
1) Dawkins draws a clear moral distinction between Christianity and Islam. That in itself is a major philosophical shift from “DNA neither cares nor knows. DNA just is. And we dance to its music.”
2) Dawkin's tone does indeed seem to have become tempered since his authoring of The God Delusion.

 

[WaltL1]

I wouldnt read too much into it. His bottom line is still.....

"It's true that statistically, the number of people who actually believe in Christianity is going down and I'm happy with that.

"I do not believe a single word of the Christian faith."

"To be fair, much of the Bible is not systematically evil but just plain weird," he wrote. "Do those people who hold up the Bible as an inspiration to moral rectitude have the slightest notion of what is actually written in it?"

The rest is just acknowledgement that he feels the tenants of Christianity are less dangerous than that of Islam. I would guess thats something that most Christians and most A/As would agree on.

 

[bullethead]

I wouldnt read too much into it. His bottom line is still.....



The rest is just acknowledgement that he feels the tenants of Christianity are less dangerous than that of Islam. I would guess thats something that most Christians and most A/As would agree on.

Yeah, he is picking which sister he likes better out of the conjoined twins.

 

[SemperFiDawg]

I wouldnt read too much into it.

I didn't. The headline is a bit misleading to say the least

 

[brutally honest]

The BB’s version:

In Desperate Bid To Save Cultural Christianity, Dawkins Dons WWJD Bracelet, Christian Novelty Shirt

OXFORD — Atheists worldwide were surprised to hear that one of their movement's prominent leaders had undergone a potential worldview shift as several witnesses reported they had seen Richard Dawkins wearing a WWJD bracelet and Christian novelty shirt.

babylonbee.com

 

[WaltL1]

I didn't. The headline is a bit misleading to say the least

First - I really dont know squat about Dawkins other than he's an outspoken Atheist. I honestly have never seen an entire vid of his, just a few minutes of one posted here.
But I will give him a brownie point or two for at least acknowledging certain things. I mean a rabid, brain washed Atheist couldnt even bring himself to say that churches can be beautiful.
At least thats a sign of being reasonable.

 

[ddd-shooter]

Dude is blessed to live in western society, largely influenced by judeo Christian belief systems. Makes money railing against the worldview that props up the society he cherishes.
Now he’s worried the collapse of those ideals may be bad for society as a whole, but he’s still determined to call those who believe fools.
It’sa simple proof of what believers have said for years. You might not like what we believe, but you owe a lot more to it than you’d like to admit.

 

[oldfella1962]

Dude is blessed to live in western society, largely influenced by judeo Christian belief systems. Makes money railing against the worldview that props up the society he cherishes.
Now he’s worried the collapse of those ideals may be bad for society as a whole, but he’s still determined to call those who believe fools.
It’sa simple proof of what believers have said for years. You might not like what we believe, but you owe a lot more to it than you’d like to admit.

It sounds to me like by saying he is a "cultural Christian" his is choosing "the lesser of two evils" because he's comparing the Christian culture to Islamic culture. Being realistic, a few hundred years ago - depending on the location - this situation would be reversed. In a few hundred years, the situation could flip yet again. But in the year 2024 CE in America as a non-believer in any religion I would still rather live in a predominantly Christian culture than a predominantly Islamic culture*. Personally, I am not "horrified" by Islamic holidays but then again, I'm not jazzed by any holidays except Halloween because who doesn't like cute kids/pets and candy? That's a no-brainer to me.

* granted not all Islamic countries - or regions - are bad, but Islamic theocracies with no separation of church and state tend to become very, very bad very quickly.

 

[oldfella1962]

First - I really dont know squat about Dawkins other than he's an outspoken Atheist. I honestly have never seen an entire vid of his, just a few minutes of one posted here.
But I will give him a brownie point or two for at least acknowledging certain things. I mean a rabid, brain washed Atheist couldnt even bring himself to say that churches can be beautiful.
At least thats a sign of being reasonable.

Churches can indeed be beautiful! Those old churches in Europe were generally well funded and built with the best talent, materials & technology.

 

[ddd-shooter]

It sounds to me like by saying he is a "cultural Christian" his is choosing "the lesser of two evils" because he's comparing the Christian culture to Islamic culture. Being realistic, a few hundred years ago - depending on the location - this situation would be reversed. In a few hundred years, the situation could flip yet again. But in the year 2024 CE in America as a non-believer in any religion I would still rather live in a predominantly Christian culture than a predominantly Islamic culture*. Personally, I am not "horrified" by Islamic holidays but then again, I'm not jazzed by any holidays except Halloween because who doesn't like cute kids/pets and candy? That's a no-brainer to me.

* granted not all Islamic countries - or regions - are bad, but Islamic theocracies with no separation of church and state tend to become very, very bad very quickly.

Lesser evil? lol

 

[WaltL1]

Churches can indeed be beautiful! Those old churches in Europe were generally well funded and built with the best talent, materials & technology.

Yeah the Catholic church I attended had the huge wood beams on the ceiling and gigantic stained glass windows all around. If someone cant see the beauty in that then somethings wrong.

 

[ambush80]

It sounds to me like by saying he is a "cultural Christian" his is choosing "the lesser of two evils" because he's comparing the Christian culture to Islamic culture. Being realistic, a few hundred years ago - depending on the location - this situation would be reversed. In a few hundred years, the situation could flip yet again. But in the year 2024 CE in America as a non-believer in any religion I would still rather live in a predominantly Christian culture than a predominantly Islamic culture*. Personally, I am not "horrified" by Islamic holidays but then again, I'm not jazzed by any holidays except Halloween because who doesn't like cute kids/pets and candy? That's a no-brainer to me.

* granted not all Islamic countries - or regions - are bad, but Islamic theocracies with no separation of church and state tend to become very, very bad very quickly.

The Torah, Koran, and Old Testament are the same book. Plug that influence into different societies at different places in their development, under different cultural and economic conditions and you may get a Crusade, a Jihad or the burning of witches, as in modern day Africa. The ideas in the book can be used to promote prosperity and flourishing or to produce destruction and maladaptive behavior. The claim "They're not doing it right" doesn't take into account the many other variables that shape how the message is used.

 

[oldfella1962]

Lesser evil? lol

According to the Bible itself God has done things that - had they been done by any human or any god from religions other than our own - we would all be horrified by and condemn in a New York minute. There are countless threads discussing the character & morality of the Biblical God in this subforum. But considering that the God of Abraham is the same god for all three major Abrahamic religions "God" isn't really the issue when I say "the lesser evil". By lesser evil I mean in the year 2024 CE the general society & culture of the nations that are majority Jewish or Christian are more stable, prosperous, and tolerant compared to the Muslim countries in most cases. This is of course from my perspective and probably that of Richard Dawkins and millions of other people. In a few centuries all three Abrahamic religions will be treated like we treat Greek & Norse mythology today - as ancient history & literature.

 

[oldfella1962]

The Torah, Koran, and Old Testament are the same book. Plug that influence into different societies at different places in their development, under different cultural and economic conditions and you may get a Crusade, a Jihad or the burning of witches, as in modern day Africa. The ideas in the book can be used to promote prosperity and flourishing or to produce destruction and maladaptive behavior. The claim "They're not doing it right" doesn't take into account the many other variables that shape how the message is used.

Exactly. Dawkin's England in 2024 CE is a snapshot of Dawkin's England in 2024 CE - nothing more, nothing less. Decades or centuries from now things might be completely different. Religions don't exist in a vacuum - they are influenced by and reflect the society in which they operate.

So far at least, no supernatural deity has ever taken over the entire planet and put everybody on the same page. No supernatural deity has ever caused an event that affected the entire planet, nor revealed itself to the entire planet. Granted the events and revelations were written about many centuries ago when no society was aware of just how big the planet was and how many other different societies existed. My point being that an all-encompassing theocracy - instigated by any supernatural deity - will never happen and is highly unlikely to happen when instigated by any human government.

 

[SemperFiDawg]

The Torah, Koran, and Old Testament are the same book.

 

[oldfella1962]

No, not the same book - but they are all based on the same Abrahamic God, as is the New Testament.

 

[ambush80]

Have you read the Torah or Koran?

 

[ambush80]

No, not the same book - but they are all based on the same Abrahamic God, as is the New Testament.

Have you read the Torah or Koran?

 

[oldfella1962]

Have you read the Torah or Koran?

I have heard & seen other people read excerpts from both, not in their original languages of course. As is the case with the Bible, they are full of so much information that most things can be interpreted six ways from Sunday. One of the Muslims I served with in the Army tried to preach now & then about how the Quran reveals "scientific" information that nobody at the time it was written could have known about - just like Christians and Jews and probably followers other religions too - but nobody was buying it.

 

[CarolinaDawg]

The Torah, Koran, and Old Testament are the same book. Plug that influence into different societies at different places in their development, under different cultural and economic conditions and you may get a Crusade, a Jihad or the burning of witches, as in modern day Africa. The ideas in the book can be used to promote prosperity and flourishing or to produce destruction and maladaptive behavior. The claim "They're not doing it right" doesn't take into account the many other variables that shape how the message is used.