Got a problem; need a good muzzleloader gunsmith.

GAHUNTER60

Senior Member
I recently broke the trigger sear at the range on my TC Hawken. Unfortunately, it was the day before opening day of muzzleloader season. Desperate, I got on the phone and found a gunsmith in Cleveland, GA that had a bunch of TC Hawken parts. An hour later, I was in his shop and he was installing a sear from a cannibalized Hawken lock. It worked -- sort of!

Turns out ,with the new (old) part, after you set the trigger, the sear only releases the hammer about 60 percent of the time. The rest of the time, when you try to touch her off, all you get is a "click," and the hammer hammer falls about a 1/10 of an inch and stops. However, if you leave the hammer in that position and reset the double set trigger a second time, she fires 100 percent of the time. When I took her back to the smith, he didn't have another sear. So he tried disassembling the lock and polishing the sear he installed. Now, the hammer falls about 65 percent of the time!

So, I've been hunting with it this way. What I've done to ensure ignition is to get in my stand, and with an uncapped and cushioned nipple, cock the hammer, set the trigger and pull it. If the hammer falls, I repeat the process until I get that 1/10" fall. At this point, she's ready to hunt! (Like I said, I get 100 percent ignition when the hammer is in this position on a second trigger pull.)

The first day I hunted like this, I started off sitting with a capped nipple, making dang sure to keep her pointed in a safe direction. Finally, I decided that this was just too dangerous! I don't know how much of the notch in the hammer is being held back by the sear. And, God forbid, should I drop the rifle from the stand (It DOES happen -- never happened to me, but I know folks that it has happened to), it is guaranteed to fire upon impact.

So, I uncapped her and started holding the top hat musket cap in my fingers of my right hand, ready to place the cap on the nipple when a deer appears. Over the last four weeks, I've gotten good at being able to quickly cap her at the first sign of a deer approaching. I'm pretty selective about what I shoot, so I get a lot of practice "cap on; cap off; cap on; cap off." (My apologies to Mr. Miyagi)

So it was under these conditions with the buck I shot last Saturday pictured in the separate thread. It worked, but it ain't right! I want it right.

I've done a little research, and found out that TC manufactured this rifle with two different sears -- an early rifle version, and a later rifle version. It does no good to contact TC to find out which sear mine had, because a fire at the TC plant years ago wiped out all serial number records. I suspect mine to be the earlier, and least common, sear, since I bought my gun new in 1976 (they stared making them in 1970). Unfortunately, Gun Parts Corp (Numrich Arms), only has the more common "later sear" in stock. There are a few private sellers online who say they have an early TC Hawken sear, but there is no way to know if what they have will work.

So, after all the above, I need to find a gunsmith, preferably one in north Georgia, who can either make the sear I have work, or tell me where I can get one. Any smith who does a lot of muzzleloader work should be able to help me. If push comes to shove, I will buy a hole new lock, but TC made three different locks for their Hawken, so which one do I buy?

Anybody know a good muzzleloader smith?
 

Darkhorse

Senior Member
I think your problem is the sear. But not the way you think it's the problem. Sears are a simple part of a lock and will work with any trigger just as all triggers are made to work with numerous sears.
I think something is rubbing a little wood somewhere, most likely the tip end of the sear. Look inside the mortice in the stock where the sear goes when the lock is reattached to the stock. Use a good light and look for a shiney looking spot in the bottom of the hole, this is where your sear is rubbing. Even if you don't see the shiney spot get a small chisel or sharpened screwdriver and scrape away some wood in the bottom of the hole. I would go ahead and scrape away all the old finish to bare wood. Put it back together and try it. If it still doesn't work scrape away some more wood and try it again. It might take a few scrapings to get it right. If you do be sure to get some sealer down to that bare wood.
Most of the time this shows up in an older rifle when the wood swells from humidity just enough to bind the sear tip.
 

Mr Bya Lungshot

BANNED LUNATIC FRINGE
I had a remotely similar promblem with my sear. I took it out replaced the spring and now it works flawlessly.
I’m not a gunsmith but got it done with a new spring.
 

flconch53

Senior Member
In thinking about it a defective sear wouldn't hold in cock. Check for swollen wood around the sear and the trigger. A good check with TC's is to try just using the front trigger. You have to pull a little harder but you should be able to fire the gun with just the front trigger
 

GAHUNTER60

Senior Member
If its cocked and going to hang up, it will not release with a pull of just the front trigger. I have to set the back, pull the front to get her advance to a firing position. Then to fire her, I have to either set and fire again, or just pull the front trigger.

It's weird!
 

flconch53

Senior Member
I think the problem is the relationship between the trigger and the sear. It would seem that the trigger isn't hitting the sear with enough force to trip it the 1st time. Again swelling wood could change the the distance slightly. Take the trigger out and make sure it operates smoothly. I have seen this before and it is just a case slight adjustment.
 

Darkhorse

Senior Member
You can always grind a little off the end of the sear. The place where the trigger bar contacts the sear should show a little mark, be sure and stay well away from this spot. It usually only takes .010 to .020 ground off the tip to free it from wood contact. In the rifles I build I fit the sear by grinding a little off the tip.
This is how set triggers work; Pulling the front trigger applies pressure directly against the sear. The amount of pressure is determined by the person pulling the trigger. This is why the front trigger is not as affected by wood contact.
When you pull the rear trigger it basically locks that bar down with spring pressure underneath. Now pulling the front trigger releases the bar and it springs up from the spring pressure underneath, and strikes the sear with enough force to trip the sear. Problem is when something goes a little wrong, like wood contact, that spring may not apply enough force to strike the bar with enough force to fire the rifle.
 

SASS249

Senior Member
If it were mine: First I would back off on the lock bolt a turn or so. If you over tighten you can bend the lock plate causing your sear to bind.

I would check as Darkhorse wrote for any indication of rubbing on the wood. This is likely your problem.

If that did not work I would buy a new sear. I would then carefully remove the old sear and set it aside. I would polish the new sear and install it. If it works then you are done. If not then carefully work on the sear engagement again as Darkhorse indicated. If you cannot fix the problem then all you are out is the cost of the new sear and you can re-install the old one. These locks are not that complicated and this is an opportunity to learn more about how they work.
 

GAHUNTER60

Senior Member
Thanks for the advice, guys. I'll remove the lock during the week next week and look for binding. I'm hunting with her Friday and Saturday, and I don't want risk doing something I might be sorry for when I know I can make her function.
 

flconch53

Senior Member
One more quick thought is to loosen lock screw 1/4 to 1/2 a turn. If it is bidding on the sear this may fix it temporarily.
 
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