Job's Experience No Excuse For Christians To Live In Defeat

[BanjoPicker]

Thousands of sick and defeated Christians are using Job and his sufferings as the divine pattern for all men to be content in sickness and calamity. They use him as excuse to continue in defeat and unbelief. They oppose God's Word and contend that they must be in the will of God and special subjects of God's grace when in times of sickness, pain, or failure in business. They miss altogether the true teachings of the experience of Job. God never intended men to use the case of Job for any such purposes. God intended all men to see how He is glorified, not in sickness and calamity, but in deliverance from such.

 

[formula1]

Have you ever been sick?

 

[tell sackett]

Phil.4:11-12; 1Tim.6:8; Heb.13:5

No man’s circumstances control or determine God’s glory. I don’t mean to be rude, but that is sheer foolishness.

 

[gordon 2]

A fellow I know once languished on a county jail cot after being arrested on the street for preaching. The time seemed to drag.

And for as much as he believed he was called to serve the Lord with gladness he found something sapping him so as to find little to no no desire to even venture from his cell/room. More comfort found in sleeping the time away...for as long as that might be. He had no idea of how long this might last.

But he was troubled. He felt a compelling to be "out" amongst the other prisoners sharing the gospel fervently...but he found no fervency to implement. Aren't these the ones who need "it" most?

Finally he felt a need to repent of his inactivity saying, "Father, forgive me for not being out and about and seeing to the glory of your Son's name"


came an instant response..."My son's glory is assured no matter what you do or don't do..."


What was rebuke to one thing...was life to another.

We do not determine matters already settled. By anything.

I'm starting to see like this.

I have always found it strange when I would meet ministers other than my own's denomination that they would call my faith, "Catholic Faith" the Catholic Faith. I no longer find this strange. I accept it with joy. I have found that I'm settle to it this otherness of my faith and that my "Catholic Faith" does not need corrections from itself to feel lively. The bible has no sway to steer me to error either this or that way. I have no need to use the bible as a color pallet applied to my canvas--so it might better teach than someone else's canvas and color scheme and art work.

Like you say " We do not determine matter already settled" and in my particular case my Catholic Faith is a matter settled in the person I am and the life I live. As a matter of fact there is not need to say what I just said regards faith, which is not the topic of the post. The topic is Job's life trajectory assimilated to the devotees of the bible alone Grace Christianity, ---job having a faith that is stubborn to human fate for a hindsighted specially gleaned bible concept of Grace.

Job is like Solomon... in that he is wise to a faith that endures good and bad times. Both are a few cards short or the Christian deck-- according to my faith. I'm not sure you can tag both Job or Solomon as similar to the bible grace believers. Maybe. There is something about this faith, the Grace Faith, that the non grace believers see as similar with J&S and those who understand fate in Faith and no faith. Job understood this way perhaps. And Solomon too. It's like Job and Solomon need not repent or cannot due their brand of faith or cannot find good causes to repent... but by golly I am gland I have to which I learned due my Catholic Faith.

 

[brutally honest]

 

[BanjoPicker]

When the inspired writer used Job as an example it was not to encourage anyone to believe that it is in the will of God for him to remain sick that he should tolerate sin, sickness, and financial defeat that he should accept these things as being sent by God that he should use Job as an example of failure to get from God those things which Christ died to deliver him from, and which God promised to keep us from, provided that certain conditions are met. Job was used as an example of patience and of deliverance. In James 5 the writer predicted labor troubles in the last days and how the rich men would have calamities strike them because of their oppression of the poor (James 5:1-6). James next advised Christians to be patient in such times for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh (James 5:7-9). He then stated that the prophets were examples of suffering and of patience (James 5:10). The sufferings of the prophets was not that of sickness and disease as much as other sufferings as can be seen in Heb. 11:4, 7,, 19, 23-39. Not one example of sickness is given in all the list of sufferings in these passages. They were afflicted with wars and persecutions by the ungodly but not with sickness. Job is the only example given concerning physical diseases among the prophets (James 5:10, 11). Naturally, God wants all men to be patient in sickness as well as in other troubles but this no excuse to accept sickness as the will of God [blaming God] or as being sent from Him. This is no excuse to make up our minds to remain sick and give in to the attacks of the devil. Such attacks should never be accepted as the work of God or as being sent from God. God did not send the sufferings upon Job that he went through.

 

[tell sackett]

I may be wrong, but I do believe that I’m catching a whiff of HaginCopelandMeyer.

 

[BanjoPicker]

These are from the very devil himself. It is true that God permitted it just like He will permit anyone today to be attacked by Satan. But God's permission is not the same as the attack of the devil. God will even permit one to commit suicide but this is not God's will and He is not the cause of the suicide. God permits saints today to become sick and even die because they will not appropriate the benefits of the gospel and get healed (1 Cor. 11:29, 30). In other words, Satan is free to attack people who will tolerate such and who will permit him to do so. His works are manifest in the bodies of many Christians simply because they do not know his devices and because they will not rebuke the devil and get the victory over him by the name of Jesus Christ. God has made provision whereby every believer can ward off such attacks can get healed immediately and stay healed and free from Satan and his works but if men do not fight him and believe they are delivered from his works they will have to suffer. God longs to help them but He will not act contrary to His Word.

 

[BanjoPicker]

JOB'S GREAT MISTAKE

Job made the big mistake, like most Christians today, in blaming God for his suffering and trouble. This is clear from statements made by Job while he went through his trouble. He said, "The Lord gave, and the Lord taketh away; blessed be the name of the Lord" Job 1:21. "what? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil" Job. 2:10, "Why is light given to the man whose way is hid, and in whom God hath hedged in" Job. 3:23. "The arrows of the Almighty are within me, the poison whereof drinketh up my spirit: the terrors of God do set themselves in array against me" Job. 6:4, "I will speak in anguish of my spirit; I will complain in the bitterness of my soul . . . thou [God] scarest me with dreams, and terrifiest me through visions: so that my soul chooseth strangling and death rather than life. I loathe it . . . What is man, that thou shouldst magnify him . . . and try him every moment? Why hast thou set me as a mark against thee, so that I am burden to myself? And why dost thou not pardon my transgressions, and take away my iniquity?" Job. 7:11-21.

 

[BanjoPicker]

"For he breaketh me with tempest, and multiplieth my wounds without cause. He will not suffer me to take my breath but filleth me with bitterness . . . He destroyeth the perfect and the wicked . . . Yet thou shalt plunge me into the ditch" Job 9:17, 18, 22, "I will say unto God do not condemn me; shew me wherefore thou contendest with me. It is good for thee that thou shouldst oppress, that thou shouldst despise the work of thine hands, and shine upon the council of the wicked . . . thou dost destroy me . . . Hast thou not poured me out as milk, and curdled me like cheese? . . . Thou huntest me as a fierce lion . . . Thou renewest thy witnesses against me, and increaseth thine indignation upon me . . . cease then, and let me alone, that I may take comfort a little" Job 10:2, 3, 8, 10, 16 17.

 

[Spotlite]

Was Job’s experience really about sickness / defeat?

 

[Spotlite]

God did some digging with Job. Job was a good man. The problem is Job knew he was a good man. He dwelt on it a few chapters and even reasoned with God. Even told his friends he wasn’t less than them……maybe a little touch of pride. God rebuked him a few chapters. Job finally repented, Job received his blessings.

So when folks tell me they’re just like Job…..I quietly say really, now……..

 

[Madman]

Christianity saved civilization by doing one thing, and doing it in all situations, it loved each other and showed the world it loved them too.

Christians live in sickness and health, wealth and poverty, in times of peace and times of war.

The ancient Church spread the gospel, “God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten son…….”.

“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.” John 13:34

 

[BanjoPicker]

"The tabernacles of robbers prosper, and they that provoke God are secure; into whose hand God bringeth abundantly" Job 12:6, "Withdraw thine hand far from me: and let not thy dread make me afraid . . . wherefore hidest thou thy face, and holdest me for thine enemy" Job 13:21-24, "Thou destroyest the hope of man" Job 14:19, "God hath delivered me to the ungodly, and turned me over into the hands of the wicked. Iwas at ease, but he hath broken me asunder: he hath also taken me by the neck, and shaken me to pieces, and dey me up for his mark. His archers compass me round about, he cleaveth my reins asunder, and he doth not spare; he pourth out my gall upon the ground. He breaketh me with breach upon breach, he runneth upon me like a giant . . . Not for any injustice in my hands" Job 16:11-17, "He hath made me also a byword of the people" Job 17:6, "Know now that God hath overthrown me, and hath compasses me with his net. Behold I cry out of wrong, but I am not heard: I cry aloud, but there is no judgment . . . He hath set darkness in my paths. He hath stripped me of my glory, and taken the crown of my head. He hath destroyed me on every side . . . He hath kindled his wrath against me, and he counteth me unto him as one of his enemies. He hath put my brethren far from me . . . the hand of God hath touch me" Job 19:6-13, 21, The Almighty troubleth me" Job 23:16, "As God liveth, who hath taken away my judgment; and the Almighty who hath vexed my soul" Job 27:2, "He hath lossed my cord, and afflicted me . . . He hath cast me into the mire" Job 30:11, 19.

 

[BanjoPicker]

Christians live in sickness and health, wealth and poverty, in times of peace and times of war.

All Christians are commanded to use the name of Jesus in Salvation Mt. 1:21; Acts 4:12, in healing Acts 3:6-7, 16.

Acts 3:16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong. Whom ye see and know; yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

 

[Madman]

All Christians are commanded to use the name of Jesus in Salvation Mt. 1:21; Acts 4:12, in healing Acts 3:6-7, 16.

Acts 3:16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong. Whom ye see and know; yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

^^^^ This has a point?

 

[BanjoPicker]

The statements above are of Job during his sufferings. They do not speak the truth any more than modern statements of men who accuse God of being the cause of their sicknesses, calamities, and failures. God did not do even one of the above-mentioned things to a child of His and He never will. It was the devil who had affected Job, as is plainly stated in Job 2:7. Not one of Job's statements mentioned above should be taken as true of the dealings of God with His children. They were uttered by a man in great distress and by a man who had the wrong conception of God and His dealings with man. It is no wonder when God came to Job and rebuked him for the above accusations that Job said, "Who is he that hideth council without knowledge? therefore have I uttered what I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not . . . Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes" Job 42:1-6.

 

[BanjoPicker]

To consider God as the cause of Job's miseries is to make Him the most unjust, inhuman, and unmerciful being that one could conceive of. God's main purpose in recording the experiences of Job is to show men of all ages that He is not this kind of God, as the devil and men in general constantly refer to Him as being. Un-fortunately men have missed this all important truth about Job. They have used his experience to magnify sickness as the will of God, as caused by God, and as necessary for children of God to undergo in order to learn patience. They have completely missed the mark.

 

[BanjoPicker]

God did not take away Job's riches, kill his children, take away his health and position, or cause hie wife and friends to become estranged from him. Job did not receive evil from God. God did not hedge him in, shoot him with His arrows, poison him send him terrors scare him with dreams and visions, cause him to choose death rather than life, set him up for a mark to shoot at, break him with tempest, multiply his wounds without cause, take his breath fill him with bitterness plunge him in the ditch condemn him without cause, oppress him despise him destroy him hunt him as a lion witness against him, increase his wrath upon him torment him count him as an enemy destroy his hope deliver him to the ungodly be unmerciful to him refuse to hear him or afflict him with suffering. Go did not destroy the prefect, prosper the wicked, make the ungodly secure, and oppress the godly. These are false lies of the devil that he got Job to utter. God is not this kind of evil being. The devil is the cause of all these misfortunes, and this is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Anyone who accuses God of doing these things is falsely accusing Him of wrongdoing.

 

[brutally honest]

HaginCopelandMeyer.