Our nation pitched in once before...

Thread starter #1
From an email today.

=================================

Subject: THINK ABOUT IT!!



Any of you old enough to have lived in WW2 can well
remember all that is said here.

Michael Sullivan wrote:

President Bush did make a bad mistake in the war on terrorism. But the
mistake was not his decision to go to war in Iraq. Bush's mistake came in
his belief that this country is the same one his father fought for in WWII.


It is not. Back then, they had just come out of a vicious depression.
The country was steeled by the hardship of that depression, but they still
believed fervently in this country. They knew that the people had elected
their leaders, so it was the people's duty to back those leaders.
Therefore, when the war broke out the people came together, rallied behind,
and stuck with their leaders, whether they had voted for them or not or
whether the war was going badly or not. And war was just as distasteful and
the anguish just as great then as it is today.
Often there were more casualties in one day in WWII than we have had in
the entire Iraq war. But that did not matter. The people stuck with the
President because it was their
patriotic duty. Americans put aside their differences in WWII and worked
together to win that war. Everyone from every strata of society, from young
to old pitched in.
Small children pulled little wagons around to gather scrap metal for the
war effort. Grade school students saved their pennies to buy stamps for war
bonds to help the effort. Men who were too old or medically 4F lied about
their age or condition trying their best to join the military. Women
doubled their work to keep things going at home. Harsh rationing of
everything from gasoline to soap, to butter was imposed, yet there was very
little complaining. You never heard prominent people on the radio
belittling the President. Interestingly enough in those days there were no
fat cat actors and entertainers who ran off to visit and fawn over
dictators of hostile countries and complain to them about our President.
Instead, they made upbeat films and entertained our troops to help the
troops' morale. And a bunch even enlisted. And imagine this: Teachers in
schools actually started the day off with a pledge of allegiance, and with
prayers for our country and our troops!

But nobody wrote about certain weak spots in our cities where bombs
could be set off to cause the maximum damage. No newspaper would have dared
complain about what we were doing to catch spies. A newspaper would have
been laughed out of existence if it had complained that German or Japanese
soldiers were being "tortured" by being forced to wear women's underwear,
or subjected to interrogation by a woman, or being scared by a dog or did
not have air conditioning.

There were a lot of things different back then. We were not subjected to
a constant bombardment of pornography, perversion and promiscuity in movies
or on radio. We did not have legions of crackheads, dope pushers and armed
gangs roaming our streets. No, President Bush did not make a mistake in his
handling of terrorism. He made the mistake of believing that we still had
the courage and fortitude of our fathers. He believed that this was still
the country that our fathers fought so dearly to preserve. It is not the
same country. It is now a cross between Sodom and Gomorrah and the land of
Oz. We even have the wicked witch of the west as the new Speaker of the
House of Representatives. We did unite for a short while after 911, but our
attitude changed when we found out that defending our country would require
some sacrifices.

We are in great danger. The terrorist are fanatic Muslims. They believe
that it is okay, even their duty, to kill anyone who will not convert to
Islam. It has been estimated that about one third or over three hundred
million Muslims are sympathetic to the terrorists cause ... Hitler and Tojo
combined did not have nearly that many potential recruits.

We either win it - or lose it - and you ain't gonna like losing.
So YOU better think about THAT!!!!!!!!!



"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
- Benjamin Franklin, 1759
 

Flash

Senior Member
My generation (myself included) is far from what my parents/grandparents were.
 
Thread starter #3
Yes, sadly this is so, Flash. If it were not for those who have volunteered for this fight, we would be in far worse shakes than now.
 

drhunter1

Senior Member
Liberalism has no clue what the greatest generation was all about. We could have been great also if the truth about this generation was taught in our public schools or If we had made it a priority to teach it to our children. Public schools should be banned and we should scrap the whole education system and start over.

The country is prime for a purging. I only hope it's not too late.
 

gordon 2

Senior Member
I don't agree that the enemies were/are the same, nor that the publics response need be the same. Perhaps this is what is the matter, to many american individuals, polititians and military folk, see all enemies as the same and the need to respond similarly in all cases with the results presently.

It is true that society has changed since 19--, way back then dirt farmers, boiler makers, and the like were folk heros. Folk hero's today are sex symbols who make the taboids now and then.

If some of you were around during Vietnam, their was a look back on Korea, (Mash et al), to try to smooth out current events. WW11, I'm wondering if it is another phycological safety net. The logic goes something like this; WW11 was a just war, where the nation pitched in collectively and won; Present Iraq conflict is equally a just war and the nation needs to pitch in collectively to win.

Problem is that their are over three hundred million reasons why it won't happen this way. Way back in the 1940s ordinary folk hand at best the start of senior high school education and were not conservative or liberal socially. Some folk were sociallist and the conservatives who controlled social institutions and the levers of power were for the most not folk or ordinary citizens..:banginghe.
 

drhunter1

Senior Member
I don't agree that the enemies were/are the same, nor that the publics response need be the same. Perhaps this is what is the matter, to many american individuals, polititians and military folk, see all enemies as the same and the need to respond similarly in all cases with the results presently.




It is true that society has changed since 19--, way back then dirt farmers, boiler makers, and the like were folk heros. Folk hero's today are sex symbols who make the taboids now and then.

If some of you were around during Vietnam, their was a look back on Korea, (Mash et al), to try to smooth out current events. WW11, I'm wondering if it is another phycological safety net. The logic goes something like this; WW11 was a just war, where the nation pitched in collectively and won; Present Iraq conflict is equally a just war and the nation needs to pitch in collectively to win.

Problem is that their are over three hundred million reasons why it won't happen this way. Way back in the 1940s ordinary folk hand at best the start of senior high school education and were not conservative or liberal socially. Some folk were sociallist and the conservatives who controlled social institutions and the levers of power were for the most not folk or ordinary citizens..:banginghe.
Uh, I'm not sure what you just said there, but for we Americans, it is split. You are either for what is best for this country or you want it to do down in flames. If you want to label it as Conservative and Liberal, be my guest, but it's not much more complicated than that.
 

jimbo4116

Retired Moderator
The generation before me shared in the sacrifice of the soldiers overseas, it was their war too. Not since that war has the American Population as whole sacrificed or suffered as in WWII. We are not involve in the effort to win. No rationing, no war factories, no war bond drives.

Can you imagine the lack of response to a War Bond drive even 6 months after 9/11. Before the start of the war in Iraq, most peoples concern was will the market comeback and save their 401K.

We are not a nation of Americans anymore, we are a hodge podge of cultures. There is not a common thread to bind us. The history of the Revolutionary War and The Constitituion are mostly just footnotes in the education of our children.

We grew up with stories of George Washington, Patrick Henry, the Green Moutain Boys, Francis "swamp fox" Marion, Alvin York and Audy Murphy. Do you reckon you could find a 6th grader who knew who Alvin York was?

We are losing our history, our National pride will be next and then our identity as Americans. We are already divided into the hyphenated America that Teddy Roosevelt spoke of. You hear this, I am a proud Hispanic-American, African-American, Muslim-American, Christian-American.

How often do you hear, I am proud to be an AMERICAN born in the land our ForeFathers fought and and died for.
 

drhunter1

Senior Member
The generation before me shared in the sacrifice of the soldiers overseas, it was their war too. Not since that war has the American Population as whole sacrificed or suffered as in WWII. We are not involve in the effort to win. No rationing, no war factories, no war bond drives.

Can you imagine the lack of response to a War Bond drive even 6 months after 9/11. Before the start of the war in Iraq, most peoples concern was will the market comeback and save their 401K.

We are not a nation of Americans anymore, we are a hodge podge of cultures. There is not a common thread to bind us. The history of the Revolutionary War and The Constitituion are mostly just footnotes in the education of our children.

We grew up with stories of George Washington, Patrick Henry, the Green Moutain Boys, Francis "swamp fox" Marion, Alvin York and Audy Murphy. Do you reckon you could find a 6th grader who knew who Alvin York was?

We are losing our history, our National pride will be next and then our identity as Americans. We are already divided into the hyphenated America that Teddy Roosevelt spoke of. You hear this, I am a proud Hispanic-American, African-American, Muslim-American, Christian-American.

How often do you hear, I am proud to be an AMERICAN born in the land our ForeFathers fought and and died for.
Jimbo- thats a pretty bleak look at it. I don't disagree that there are those out there who are more concerned with who won on American Idol last night than any sort of national pride. Heck, I'm married to one of them (though I'm working on her).

With that said, I'm not willing to throw my hands up and say it's gone. You asked about how often you hear "I"m proud to be American". Well I hear it every day because I say it to whom ever will listen, I say it to myself.

We could all say it's over with, but I chose not to, because I know I'm not the only one who loves this country. I'm sure you express your love for America more often than you realize, and that can be contageous.
 
I don't agree that the enemies were/are the same, nor that the publics response need be the same. Perhaps this is what is the matter, to many american individuals, polititians and military folk, see all enemies as the same and the need to respond similarly in all cases with the results presently.

It is true that society has changed since 19--, way back then dirt farmers, boiler makers, and the like were folk heros. Folk hero's today are sex symbols who make the taboids now and then.

If some of you were around during Vietnam, their was a look back on Korea, (Mash et al), to try to smooth out current events. WW11, I'm wondering if it is another phycological safety net. The logic goes something like this; WW11 was a just war, where the nation pitched in collectively and won; Present Iraq conflict is equally a just war and the nation needs to pitch in collectively to win.

Problem is that their are over three hundred million reasons why it won't happen this way. Way back in the 1940s ordinary folk hand at best the start of senior high school education and were not conservative or liberal socially. Some folk were sociallist and the conservatives who controlled social institutions and the levers of power were for the most not folk or ordinary citizens..:banginghe.
gordo, its' good to see you alive and posting again. Once again, I fear your observations from afar about we Americans has again missed the mark.

Unless you "are" one, its' impossible to know what we are all about. Perhaps to the rest of the world "enemy" is a nuanced word. Not with us. We are pretty black and white in that regard.
 

jimbo4116

Retired Moderator
Jimbo- thats a pretty bleak look at it. I don't disagree that there are those out there who are more concerned with who won on American Idol last night than any sort of national pride. Heck, I'm married to one of them (though I'm working on her).

With that said, I'm not willing to throw my hands up and say it's gone. You asked about how often you hear "I"m proud to be American". Well I hear it every day because I say it to whom ever will listen, I say it to myself.

We could all say it's over with, but I chose not to, because I know I'm not the only one who loves this country. I'm sure you express your love for America more often than you realize, and that can be contageous.

I know that I painted a pretty bleak picture. But it is a bleak picture. I love this country and I do profess it.

But it will take more than cheerleading to set this country back on the right path. Just as in most civilized societies that have failed, politics and the quest for power is crumbling the foundations of this country. The individualism, the pioneer spirit that forged this country out of wilderness is gone.

A pioneer today is somebody that creates a new kind of video game or cell phone.
 

drhunter1

Senior Member
I know that I painted a pretty bleak picture. But it is a bleak picture. I love this country and I do profess it.

But it will take more than cheerleading to set this country back on the right path. Just as in most civilized societies that have failed, politics and the quest for power is crumbling the foundations of this country. The individualism, the pioneer spirit that forged this country out of wilderness is gone.

A pioneer today is somebody that creates a new kind of video game or cell phone.

I agree- were not carving a livlihood out of the wilderness, but I don't believe that because we are technilogically advanced that America is still not destined for further greatness.

Would it be a stretch to say that it's time purge this country of it's cancer? Would I be considered a right wing nutball, just short of a Ruby Ridge resident, if I suggested that a new revolution is in order? I bet I would, though I bet most on the right have thought of it from time to time. At what point do we decide that the politicians and leaders are not going to do what is needed to be done to set this country back on the correct path. The path that it was once on. The path that it was intended to travel on. There was a time when a group of great men made a tough decision and then carried though with it.

"The tree of liberty must be fertilized with the blood of patriots and tyrants from time to time". I don't know who said that, but it's a quote that sticks with me.

Look I agree that this country is headed down the wrong path, but we cannot rely on politicians to do the right thing because they, for the most part, are the cancer.

Do you want to know why George Washington was the greatest president this country has ever had. It wasn't because he helped win our independence. It wasn't because he was a god fearing man, though these are great attributes. What made him the greates president was because he refused to be a King. It was offered to him and he turned it away. Power did not corrupt him and he is the only president that you can truely say that about.

Now take present day politicians and leaders for example. All too easily does power corrupt them. They go in as good men, yet the courage of their convictions are not enough to keep them good. And so we are left with conservative politicians who's only distinction is that they are the lesser of the two evils. Very few if any have the principles and convictions that they had when they set out to change the course of things.
 

jimbo4116

Retired Moderator
I agree- were not carving a livlihood out of the wilderness, but I don't believe that because we are technilogically advanced that America is still not destined for further greatness.

Would it be a stretch to say that it's time purge this country of it's cancer? Would I be considered a right wing nutball, just short of a Ruby Ridge resident, if I suggested that a new revolution is in order? I bet I would, though I bet most on the right have thought of it from time to time. At what point do we decide that the politicians and leaders are not going to do what is needed to be done to set this country back on the correct path. The path that it was once on. The path that it was intended to travel on. There was a time when a group of great men made a tough decision and then carried though with it.

"The tree of liberty must be fertilized with the blood of patriots and tyrants from time to time". I don't know who said that, but it's a quote that sticks with me.

Look I agree that this country is headed down the wrong path, but we cannot rely on politicians to do the right thing because they, for the most part, are the cancer.
Do you want to know why George Washington was the greatest president this country has ever had. It wasn't because he helped win our independence. It wasn't because he was a god fearing man, though these are great attributes. What made him the greates president was because he refused to be a King. It was offered to him and he turned it away. Power did not corrupt him and he is the only president that you can truely say that about.

Now take present day politicians and leaders for example. All too easily does power corrupt them. They go in as good men, yet the courage of their convictions are not enough to keep them good. And so we are left with conservative politicians who's only distinction is that they are the lesser of the two evils. Very few if any have the principles and convictions that they had when they set out to change the course of things.
This is the keyword, POLITICIANS. The Constitution directs us to elect REPRESENTATIVES. We elect POLITICIANS who consider us the capital that keeps their business up and running. They go to Washington and send us our DIVIDENDS, and we are happy. It is all the other POLITICIANS that are the problem not our Representative.

Our Representative provides us with funding for all our special needs, While the POLITICIANS bring home the BACON for the PORK BARREL projects that no one really needs.

I once heard a lawyer proclaim after many unkind words had been said about his profession, "there is no such thing as a good attorney until you need one". Turn that around and there is no such thing as a good politician until you don't have one". As long as the he is bringing home the bacon he is a good Representative not a politician.

Yes we need to get rid of career politicians and politicians that become career lobbyist.

In today's America a skateboarder or snowboarder garners more attention that scientists and engineers.
For example did you know that a Ga. Native shared in the Nobel Prize this past year. I bet you remember the face of that redheaded kid that won Olympic Gold in Snowboarding.

Yes I hope for great things. And Americans will alway do great things, but America's Greatest days may be passing with its Greatest Generation.

My Opinion.
 
I am so conservative that I am somewhat to the right of Ghengis Khan but I think one of the difficulties of this situation is that we are told this is going to be a long protracted battle--and I believe that--but we are not, as was pointed out by others, being called to sacrifice or contribute other than our taxes to fund it. Our youth are volunteering to serve in the Armed Forces and for that I am more grateful that mere words can attest. However, our service members and their loved ones are the only ones who are sacrificing for you and I. In my opinion, as far as a lot of Americans are concerned, this is just a messy situation that has increased the price of gas and if it goes away so gas can be $1.50 a gallon, all the better.

It is hard to garner the nation's support when no one but our Armed Forces and their families are the ones who are suffering the sacrificing. (And I am no way advocating a return to the draft at this time because I saw first hand that debacle.)

My attitude about my security within my country's borders has been forever altered by 9/11 but realistically my day-to-day goings on haven't changed. Except that every night I pray for the safety of those young men and women who have volunteered to go in harm's way on my behalf.

Day-to-day, my government has not asked me to cut my gas consumption. Day-to-day, my government has not asked me to conserve electricity. Day-to-day, my government has not asked me to participate by my sacrifice in any way whatsoever. The Army is scrambling to meet enlistment quotas as it closes out its recruiting year, yet the Commander in Chief has not asked for America's youth to volunteer.

I don't know what it will take. But this is got Armageddon written all over it if we don't unite to destroy this evil that masquerades as religious faith.

Maybe Schwartzkof should be recalled to active duty and given the assignment to write the "How to Combat Islamic Terrorism" Op Order.
 

jimbo4116

Retired Moderator
I am so conservative that I am somewhat to the right of Ghengis Khan but I think one of the difficulties of this situation is that we are told this is going to be a long protracted battle--and I believe that--but we are not, as was pointed out by others, being called to sacrifice or contribute other than our taxes to fund it. Our youth are volunteering to serve in the Armed Forces and for that I am more grateful that mere words can attest. However, our service members and their loved ones are the only ones who are sacrificing for you and I. In my opinion, as far as a lot of Americans are concerned, this is just a messy situation that has increased the price of gas and if it goes away so gas can be $1.50 a gallon, all the better.

It is hard to garner the nation's support when no one but our Armed Forces and their families are the ones who are suffering the sacrificing. (And I am no way advocating a return to the draft at this time because I saw first hand that debacle.)

My attitude about my security within my country's borders has been forever altered by 9/11 but realistically my day-to-day goings on haven't changed. Except that every night I pray for the safety of those young men and women who have volunteered to go in harm's way on my behalf.

Day-to-day, my government has not asked me to cut my gas consumption. Day-to-day, my government has not asked me to conserve electricity. Day-to-day, my government has not asked me to participate by my sacrifice in any way whatsoever. The Army is scrambling to meet enlistment quotas as it closes out its recruiting year, yet the Commander in Chief has not asked for America's youth to volunteer.

I don't know what it will take. But this is got Armageddon written all over it if we don't unite to destroy this evil that masquerades as religious faith.

Maybe Schwartzkof should be recalled to active duty and given the assignment to write the "How to Combat Islamic Terrorism" Op Order.
You keep preaching and I'll lead the Chior.
 
"The tree of liberty must be fertilized with the blood of patriots and tyrants from time to time". I don't know who said that, but it's a quote that sticks with me.
"The tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its' natural manure." - Thomas Jefferson

:cheers:
 
We all saw how the country came together after 9-11. Then Bush told us Bin Laden had been marginalized to the point that Bush didn't think about him anymore and we had to invade Iraq. Bush had to sell the country on that, and most of us now recognize that we were sold a bill of goods.

All this to say, when this country is faced with a grave threat the people will rally to the cause. I dare say most of the country would approve now of pulling out of Iraq and concentrating on destroying Al Qaeda in Afghanistan/Pakistan. You know, the original purpose for going to war.
 

drhunter1

Senior Member
This is the keyword, POLITICIANS. The Constitution directs us to elect REPRESENTATIVES. We elect POLITICIANS who consider us the capital that keeps their business up and running. They go to Washington and send us our DIVIDENDS, and we are happy. It is all the other POLITICIANS that are the problem not our Representative.

Our Representative provides us with funding for all our special needs, While the POLITICIANS bring home the BACON for the PORK BARREL projects that no one really needs.

I once heard a lawyer proclaim after many unkind words had been said about his profession, "there is no such thing as a good attorney until you need one". Turn that around and there is no such thing as a good politician until you don't have one". As long as the he is bringing home the bacon he is a good Representative not a politician.

Yes we need to get rid of career politicians and politicians that become career lobbyist.

In today's America a skateboarder or snowboarder garners more attention that scientists and engineers.
For example did you know that a Ga. Native shared in the Nobel Prize this past year. I bet you remember the face of that redheaded kid that won Olympic Gold in Snowboarding.

Yes I hope for great things. And Americans will alway do great things, but America's Greatest days may be passing with its Greatest Generation.

My Opinion.


And a very valid opinion in my opinion. Good stuff.
 
6

60Grit

Guest
Liberalism has no clue what the greatest generation was all about. We could have been great also if the truth about this generation was taught in our public schools or If we had made it a priority to teach it to our children. Public schools should be banned and we should scrap the whole education system and start over.

The country is prime for a purging. I only hope it's not too late.
true dat, true dat,,,,,,,,,,preach it bro...............:bounce::flag:
 
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