Plumbing issues

[Barfolomew]

I am going about a year of moving into a house that was built in 1983 I think. The house has its share of age related issues, but is overall in ok shape. Recently, I had a pipe develop a pin hole leak which I was able to contain and have repaired. A section of pipe was cut out to be replaced due to a couple of pin hole leaks in it. We also surveyed the rest of the visible pipes for indications of potential leaks. Plumbing is all copper.

End result 3 pin hole leaks repaired and 3 more identified as potential future leaks. Inspecting the inside of the pipe that was cut out, it looks ok except for dots of corrosion every so often, all on the bottom of the pipe, all isolated to a point (not big splotches or concentrated dots). This is both hot and cold water lines.

Questions.

1) Chances this is an isolated incident and once I deal with these 6 items, I'll be done? Is this an indication that I'm going to have to repipe the whole house?

2) Any theories on what causes this type of failure?

3) Chances insurance covers pipe replacement as a potential whole house issue due to corrosion?

4) What do people think of PEX piping? How hard is it to DIY?

 

[BeerThirty]

I just had to deal with a water leak in my basement and got insurance involved. Every company is different, but I was flat out told that most insurance companies do not cover plumbing. They do cover the repairs from plumbing issues, but not the actual plumbing itself.

Oh, and I am no expert in pluming by any means. In fact, extent of my knowledge is limited to installing a toilet or fixing a leaky faucet, but I thought copper plumbing is the best you can get and totally corrosion resistant?

 

[NE GA Pappy]

1) 2 chances... slim and none

2) minerals in the water dissolving the copper

3) see question #1

4) It is not had to do, and it seems to be fairly reliable.

 

[rjcruiser]

I've seen adverts for a slime that they pump through copper piping to seal the inside and make it like new. That being said, it was years ago...so not sure if it is still something they do. Whole house copper re-piping isn't too difficult and can be done...but I figure PEX is taking over and would probably be easier/cheaper.

I'm not experienced with PEX, but if you can crimp, you can re-pipe. Or, if you want to go the $$ route, shark bite fittings work well.

I wouldn't mess with plumbing. Leaks and floodings because of leaks are no fun to deal with and aren't cheap.

 

[OmenHonkey]

I just plumbed my new construction with PEX. It was designed basically for replumbing homes. I love it.

 

[notnksnemor]

I've seen adverts for a slime that they pump through copper piping to seal the inside and make it like new. That being said, it was years ago...so not sure if it is still something they do. Whole house copper re-piping isn't too difficult and can be done...but I figure PEX is taking over and would probably be easier/cheaper.

I'm not experienced with PEX, but if you can crimp, you can re-pipe. Or, if you want to go the $$ route, shark bite fittings work well.

I wouldn't mess with plumbing. Leaks and floodings because of leaks are no fun to deal with and aren't cheap.

My house is 13 years old and plumbed with PEX using crimps.
In the last year I've had 3 leaks in the crawl space caused by the crimps corroding completely off. I replaced them with the sharkbite fittings.
The crimps don't seem to last long to me.

 

[Dbender]

What in the world are you keeping in your crawl space? I've never seen a properly installed crimp ring fail. The fittings may break or corrode but how does the crimp ring in contact with only plastic pipe corrode? That sharkbite junk is only a single cheap O-ring. Pex is good stuff if installed properly, and seems to hold up well enough. Rats and squirrels do like to chew it though. I'd choose it over pvc or cpvc for longevity/durability and over copper for ease of use.

 

[notnksnemor]

What in the world are you keeping in your crawl space? I've never seen a properly installed crimp ring fail. The fittings may break or corrode but how does the crimp ring in contact with only plastic pipe corrode? That sharkbite junk is only a single cheap O-ring. Pex is good stuff if installed properly, and seems to hold up well enough. Rats and squirrels do like to chew it though. I'd choose it over pvc or cpvc for longevity/durability and over copper for ease of use.

Just dirt.
All three were green and broken.
The properly installed may be the key.
I'm no plumber.

 

[Dbender]

Are your pipes laying in the dirt?

 

[notnksnemor]

Are your pipes laying in the dirt?

No, attached to the floor joists.
Plastic moisture barrier on top of the ground too.
I suspect they may have leaked a little for some time before the clamp let go.

 

[Dbender]

I'd be checking all of them extra carefully. I've never seen a crimp ring disintegrate.

 

[Havana Dude]

We had a similar situation with a leak at a sweated joint. Same exact scenario as you describe. Insurance report stated is was caused due to the mixing of the material applied to the copper, I forget the term, and the certain elements in the water. Sorry for the lack of knowledge of the correct terms, I used to remember the name. It’s the stuff they put on the pipe and the fitting, then slip them todether, and solder. It is supposed to aid in getting the solder around the whole joint.

 

[rjcruiser]

We had a similar situation with a leak at a sweated joint. Same exact scenario as you describe. Insurance report stated is was caused due to the mixing of the material applied to the copper, I forget the term, and the certain elements in the water. Sorry for the lack of knowledge of the correct terms, I used to remember the name. It’s the stuff they put on the pipe and the fitting, then slip them todether, and solder. It is supposed to aid in getting the solder around the whole joint.

Flux

 

[Havana Dude]

duh

Thanks, I feel stupid.

 

[rjcruiser]

duh

Thanks, I feel stupid.

It's all good. It took me a bit to remember it too.

I've heard of red clay being hard on copper and causing pin hole leaks under slabs. My new house is Pex under slab. Makes me a little nervous...but then again, anything under slab is a risk I guess.

 

[breathe in]

i heard a plumber on dave baker's show this past saturday who said copper you get today at hd and lowe's etc, is the thinnest walled copper out there and only lasts about 30 years?

also weird on the pex as supposedly been used in europe for years and years?

 

[GA native]

1) Chances this is an isolated incident and once I deal with these 6 items, I'll be done? Is this an indication that I'm going to have to repipe the whole house?

Chances are that you will not have to re-plumb the whole house. Probably just some spots in the crawler. I am a believer in sharkbites. Great product. Quick and easy to do yourself.

2) Any theories on what causes this type of failure?

Copper corrodes like any other metal. If this is in a crawlspace, as I am assuming, improve the ventilation to lower the humidity level.

3) Chances insurance covers pipe replacement as a potential whole house issue due to corrosion?

Don't know, but I doubt it.

4) What do people think of PEX piping? How hard is it to DIY?

Re-plumbing the whole house is not a DIY. Plumbing is a job that needs to be done fast and right. With that said, my last house I paid plumbers to redo the piping, and I did all the drywall repair. They re-plumbed the whole house in PEX, and did it in two days. Sometimes it is well worth paying the pros to come in.

 

[MonroeTaco]

The pinholes in the copper are most likely caused by electrolysis, dissimilar metals in the plumbing. Either missing dielectric unions or the copper touching metal somewhere. A re-plumb definitely needs to be done by a licensed plumber.

 

[CHANDLECTRIC]

Cheap thin copper water lines

Check with a real plumber , I think there was a lot of extra thin copper waterlines installed for several years .
( bad problem)

 

[NE GA Pappy]

Flux

4 letter words are not allowed in a g rated forum.