Recognizing Bad Genetics in Deer

[Hit-n-Miss]

I didn’t even pay attention to who I was talking to! Glad all is well neighbor. Haha

Do I know you? Yep I’m still kicking.

 

[splatek]

That's certainly important, but there are several other contributing factors that all play a role.
-When a buck is born can affect the first couple of sets of antlers. If a doe gets bred late in the breeding season, her offspring have less time to build body mass which can impact antler development.
-The nutrition that the mother has access too while pregnant can influence her offspring's antler development.
-Epigenetics also control gene function and how much a buck can reach his full genetic potential. You can't unlock the genetic potential of a given deer herd until you've provided maximum nutrition sustainably through multiple generations of deer. In terms of managing a new piece of land for deer, if you make dramatic improvements in habitat conditions and nutrition you will certainly see improvement fairly quickly. However, you won't really reach the true potential until you've sustained those conditions for 10 years or so. Here's some of that research from MSU:

http://extension.msstate.edu/sites/default/files/publications/publications/P3013_web.pdf

Wow! Thanks.
We don’t manage our lease and that’s likely why we max out at +/-100” bucks. But they sure do taste great on a diet of acorns.

As always, Thanks Charlie!

 

[C.Killmaster]

Charlie, has the science advanced far enough that we know for certain that some bucks are just genetically predisposed to have poor racks? Or, as you pointed out in the post above, long term nutrition of the mother and herd are what really makes the difference and any buck can develop well given the right conditions?

There may occasionally be a handful that just won't really grow much antler, about the same number that are the exceptional examples like B&C class bucks. With that said, a buck could have the genes to be a B&C, but without the nutrition he may only grow average antlers. The distribution of antler quality is very much like a bell curve, the vast majority of bucks will be in the middle around the average. To grow more big deer, we try to shift the bell curve to the right in hopes of producing a handful more of those exceptional deer. In short, a 4.5 year old fork horn is about as rare as a 170.

 

[NCHillbilly]

They all taste similar.

 

[splatek]

They all taste similar.

I was being cheeky

 

[Long Cut]

“Bad Genetics” is arguably the lowest “hole in the bucket” so-to-speak in regard to managing a whitetail herd.

Once a property has ;
-Properly managed it’s timber stand
-Removed Invasive Weeds
-Planted roughly 10% of the land in food plots, that have soil tests & amendments done
- Completed trail camera surveys to determine deer density & age structure
- Consider starting a supplemental feed program (at least from January-May)
- Remove any excess does & older age class bucks NOT meeting antler requirements.
-Get your deer herd density to around 50-75 Deer Per Square Mile, with a 1:1 Buck/Doe ratio

I’m sorry for the rant, but I’m seeing so many folks talk about “culling bucks”, when they’ve got 100+ deer per square mile, with habitat that can only support maybe 75 deer per square mile… with browse lines 5-6’ tall.

We cannot always manage timber, do Rx fires or plant 10% in food plots… BUT… we can at least conduct trail camera surveys and bring the deer population down to sustainable numbers for the habitat to naturally support.

 

[Deerhunter12454]

A lot of people seem to forget that does carry 50% of the genes. Kill all the “cull” bucks you want.
Forgot what study it was but a bucks first 2 years of its life are the most important. Stress on does when pregnant plays a huge role.

Some of the biggest deer I’ve seen lived in Kudzu patches. “Invasive” weeds still have higher protein and nutrient levels than most things we plant.

One of the biggest arguments was “once a spike always a spike” that was proved wrong years ago. Got to shoot 2 small bucks to make up for a mature deer. “Bad” genetics in Georgia is funny. Cant kill big deer when you use “cull bucks” as an excuse to shoot the first 1.5 6 point that walks out.

 

[Rebel 3]

I'm convinced that people or clubs that shoot spikes and small basket racks as culls are really just brown it's down hunters. They are just using that as an excuse to try to make it sound better. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with shooting little bucks as long as it is legal, but at least admit you enjoy shooting them.

 

[Unavowed]

It doesn't really work that way.

Wouldn't removing 6 bucks from x acres create a void and allow other deer move in?