Vector Borne Diseases - Lyme, Bartonells, Babesia, RMSF, etc

[Gadget]

A couple examples of the problems facing the treatment of Lyme and it's co-infections.

In order to treat a medical condition, there must be literature to support the treatment. Without proper literature, the physicians can be cited for treating outside the guidelines for proper medical treatment. Just Google Dr. Joseph Jemsek to get an example of what the medical boards will do.

Here is the kicker, the drug companies rule the medical journals and won't let any pertinent literature get published. To get published, you must have all your ducks in a row and be able to prove your claims. This has been done numerous times and the medical journals still will not publish the literature. Their reasoning...................too much public outcry. For examples, Google Dr Stephen Fry and Protomyxzoa Rheumatica or look up Dr Alan Macdonald on Youtube. Both of these brilliant physicians have ground breaking information that should have been published and adopted but were refused publication. It is appalling that our government allows this to happen and we the people must continue to suffer.

Excellent info Matt.

It's sad how the government is run by lobbyists, and the drug companies are one of the biggest!
Lately Lyme has been getting more attention in the media than I've ever seen before, maybe that will help make a change...

 

[jbird1]

Rick,

What doxy dosage/duration did you ask for?

 

[Bow Only]

Some info on Doxycycline:

Doxy is and has been the drug of choice for Lyme Disease prevention and early onset Lyme Disease. It is what helped me with my first bout of Lyme. The usual dosage is 100mg twice a day. Even though this works for many, it doesn't work for others. It depends on what stage of Lyme you have.

In the early stages of Lyme Disease, the Borrelia bacteria doesn't cross the blood-brain barrier. The blood-brain barrier is a compartment so to speak. It's separate from the rest of the body and encompasses the brain and spinal column. It "protects" the brain from most pathogens. Borrelia do cross the blood-brain barrier and there is debate on how long this takes. Once Borrelia is in the brain, a condition called neuroborreliosis occurs. Some consider this a later stage of Lyme disease but I believe it can be an early stage.

The problem with Doxycycline is that it doesn't cross the blood-brain barrier. Any bacteria that have crossed the barrier are protected and will not be killed by Doxycycline. That is why many Lyme physicians use Minocycline. It crosses the blood-brain barrier. But Minocycline isn't the cure all either. The Borrelia bacteria can exist in 5 known forms. In order for a drug to kill the bacteria, it must enter the bacteria. The spirochete form of the bacteria is easily penetrated and killed, but the other forms are so easily penetrated. The most common other forms are the "L" form or the round or cystic forms. These are dormant forms of the bacteria and are not often destroyed by antibiotics. The bacteria lies dormant as a survival mechanism. Another survival trait that causes treatment problems is the formation of biofilms. A Youtube search for biofilm formation will give you a good example of what biofilms are and the difficulty in treating them. It's a six minute montage.

 

[jbird1]

Some info on Doxycycline:

Doxy is and has been the drug of choice for Lyme Disease prevention and early onset Lyme Disease. It is what helped me with my first bout of Lyme. The usual dosage is 100mg twice a day. Even though this works for many, it doesn't work for others. It depends on what stage of Lyme you have.

In the early stages of Lyme Disease, the Borrelia bacteria doesn't cross the blood-brain barrier. The blood-brain barrier is a compartment so to speak. It's separate from the rest of the body and encompasses the brain and spinal column. It "protects" the brain from most pathogens. Borrelia do cross the blood-brain barrier and there is debate on how long this takes. Once Borrelia is in the brain, a condition called neuroborreliosis occurs. Some consider this a later stage of Lyme disease but I believe it can be an early stage.

The problem with Doxycycline is that it doesn't cross the blood-brain barrier. Any bacteria that have crossed the barrier are protected and will not be killed by Doxycycline. That is why many Lyme physicians use Minocycline. It crosses the blood-brain barrier. But Minocycline isn't the cure all either. The Borrelia bacteria can exist in 5 known forms. In order for a drug to kill the bacteria, it must enter the bacteria. The spirochete form of the bacteria is easily penetrated and killed, but the other forms are so easily penetrated. The most common other forms are the "L" form or the round or cystic forms. These are dormant forms of the bacteria and are not often destroyed by antibiotics. The bacteria lies dormant as a survival mechanism. Another survival trait that causes treatment problems is the formation of biofilms. A Youtube search for biofilm formation will give you a good example of what biofilms are and the difficulty in treating them. It's a six minute montage.

Wow, great insight. Is there really any way to "kill" the infection with the right meds once it has reached the late stage or do you just mange it at that point? What a shame there aren't any LLMD's that are local. It would seem that any infectious disease specialists would be constrained by CDC guidelines and therefore unable to adequately treat the infection.

 

[Gadget]

Rick,

What doxy dosage/duration did you ask for?

Because mine went untreated for some time and I had more advanced symptoms it took three rounds of antibiotics. The first round they gave me something else for the usual 10days, maybe amoxicillian; on my next visit to the doctor is when I basically self diagnosed and suggest I had lyme, they then did I think 30 days of Docxy. During this time things were actually still getting worse, I developed the Bell's Palsy, was having joint pain, nerve pain, problems concentrating, etc. They then put me on Prednisone, month or two of that, then another cycle of Doxy; might have been 60days.

As Matt indicated, my Lyme was advanced and caused a lot more problems than the average case. I still feel I've never recovered fully, it left me with some mild nerve and joint problems which are probably permanent at this point. One thing is I developed knee pain and problems during this time, which I never had before. I'm actually scheduled for knee surgery next Thursday.

 

[jbird1]

Because mine went untreated for some time and I had more advanced symptoms it took three rounds of antibiotics. The first round they gave me something else for the usual 10days, maybe amoxicillian; on my next visit to the doctor is when I basically self diagnosed and suggest I had lyme, they then did I think 30 days of Docxy. During this time things were actually still getting worse, I developed the Bell's Palsy, was having joint pain, nerve pain, problems concentrating, etc. They then put me on Prednisone, month or two of that, then another cycle of Doxy; might have been 60days.

As Matt indicated, my Lyme was advanced and caused a lot more problems than the average case. I still feel I've never recovered fully, it left me with some mild nerve and joint problems which are probably permanent at this point. One thing is I developed knee pain and problems during this time, which I never had before. I'm actually scheduled for knee surgery next Thursday.

My major issues are really bad tinnitus (seems like it's coming from my brain more than my ears) and my eyesight is getting worse. My wife says it's due to too many concussions on the gridiron but I am beginning to think more along the lines of Lyme. I am also having joint issues (hip, shoulders, elbows.) and the head fogginess and concentration issues.

Good luck with your surgery and keep us posted on your recovery.

 

[Bow Only]

Wow, great insight. Is there really any way to "kill" the infection with the right meds once it has reached the late stage or do you just mange it at that point? What a shame there aren't any LLMD's that are local. It would seem that any infectious disease specialists would be constrained by CDC guidelines and therefore unable to adequately treat the infection.

After the disease gets to the advanced stages, it can not be killed by antibiotics IMO. That is not saying you can't live a normal life. I would bet a lot of money that over half of the adults here in the South have the Borrelia bacteria. That doesn't mean they have Lyme Disease. Some individuals have enough immune response to suppress the symptoms caused by the bacteria. Nutrition and genetics play a big role in this.

 

[jbird1]

After the disease gets to the advanced stages, it can not be killed by antibiotics IMO. That is not saying you can't live a normal life. I would bet a lot of money that over half of the adults here in the South have the Borrelia bacteria. That doesn't mean they have Lyme Disease. Some individuals have enough immune response to suppress the symptoms caused by the bacteria. Nutrition and genetics play a big role in this.

That's very interesting that you mention genetics. My father who is in his mid-70's, claims to have inherited Fibromyalgia and dealt with it since his 20's. This is one of the conditions LD mimics so he could just as easily have LD.

 

[Bow Only]

That's very interesting that you mention genetics. My father who is in his mid-70's, claims to have inherited Fibromyalgia and dealt with it since his 20's. This is one of the conditions LD mimics so he could just as easily have LD.

Correct. Fibromyalgia is just a symptom with unknown origin. It's caused by a vector borne disease IMO. Ringing of the ears and taste/smell alterations are also common symptoms of VBD. Syphilis has been called the "Great Imitator" because it's symptoms can mimic any disease. Borrelia infection is exactly the same. They're both spirochetes.

Borrelia has been shown to be able to be transmitted from the mother to a child during pregnancy. It, and babesia, have been isolated in semen. This leaves the door open for sexual transmission. It would be more likely to be transmitted from male to female than vise versa. I would not expect this to be a high rate of transmission, but I believe it happens.

 

[Bow Only]

For anyone who wants a great source of information on Borrelia infection or health in general, Youtube Dr. Thomas Rau. He has multiple lectures that are very educational. They're over an hour each, but his approach is the best I've seen.

If you want better health, I would suggest reading about Dr. Terry Wahls and her diet. Dr. Joel Fuhrman's book Super Immunity is an interesting read. Anyone with cancer would benefit from reading it.

 

[Gadget]

That's very interesting that you mention genetics. My father who is in his mid-70's, claims to have inherited Fibromyalgia and dealt with it since his 20's. This is one of the conditions LD mimics so he could just as easily have LD.

Fibromyalgia has been one of my main problems, several symptoms fall under FM, fatigue, sleep, memory, mood, pain, I have all of them. Although it's gotten much better, like I said earlier, I've never felt the same since and at this point I don't think I ever will.

When I had the Bell's Palsy, it lasted for 4 months, I have a small amount of residual nerve damage in my face, my smile is not the same as it used to be. During that time I lost my eye sight, taste, feeling. I couldn't even tell hot from cold.


Another thing is I believe I've had two infections not one; a year or two before this I was sick for about 4-5 months. I went to the doctor several times and took several rounds of different antibiotics, it would get better then come back. I believe this was LD or RMSF and it went undiagnosed and not treated properly. LD was never even mentioned by my doctor.

 

[jbird1]

Fibromyalgia has been one of my main problems, several symptoms fall under FM, fatigue, sleep, memory, mood, pain, I have all of them. Although it's gotten much better, like I said earlier, I've never felt the same since and at this point I don't think I ever will.

When I had the Bell's Palsy, it lasted for 4 months, I have a small amount of residual nerve damage in my face, my smile is not the same as it used to be. During that time I lost my eye sight, taste, feeling. I couldn't even tell hot from cold.


Another thing is I believe I've had two infections not one; a year or two before this I was sick for about 4-5 months. I went to the doctor several times and took several rounds of different antibiotics, it would get better then come back. I believe this was LD or RMSF and it went undiagnosed and not treated properly. LD was never even mentioned by my doctor.

Since I've been researching LD the past few days, it seems co-infection with LD is not the exception but more likely the rule. I agree, you most likely had multiple infections as there are a myriad of other suspects...each with it's own symptoms and requiring different treatment methods. Igenex has a co-infection test 5095 that looks for several other infection sources besides Borrelia.

 

[jbird1]

Borrelia has been shown to be able to be transmitted from the mother to a child during pregnancy. It, and babesia, have been isolated in semen. This leaves the door open for sexual transmission. It would be more likely to be transmitted from male to female than vise versa. I would not expect this to be a high rate of transmission, but I believe it happens.

This evidence goes a long way towards explaining the significant incidence of infection cases whereby the patient has no recollection of ever being bitten by a tick...very interesting.

 

[Bow Only]

This is probably what I have. I have isolated these in my own blood cultures but without diagnostic testing, I can not ascertain if what type of piroplasm I have. It did respond well to anti-protozoal medications and to anti-malarial Chinese herbs. I, however, remain infected. If it were just Babesia, I believe I would be cured by now.

http://protomyxzoa.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Protozoal-Infection-Dr-Frye-Interview.pdf

 

[Bow Only]

Out of an entire drop of blood, I could only find a few of these protozoas. They are the small round bumps attached to the RBC's near the center of the picture. The arrow may point to another.

 

[Gadget]

wow you really have done your research.!

 

[jbird1]

This is probably what I have. I have isolated these in my own blood cultures but without diagnostic testing, I can not ascertain if what type of piroplasm I have. It did respond well to anti-protozoal medications and to anti-malarial Chinese herbs. I, however, remain infected. If it were just Babesia, I believe I would be cured by now.

http://protomyxzoa.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Protozoal-Infection-Dr-Frye-Interview.pdf

Thanks for posting this and what food for thought. With a family history including several autoimmune diseases like CFS and ALS, this information could be life altering. It is interesting to note that I believe I have experienced the Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction before when experimenting with a whole food, plant based diet. And as in Rick's case, he experienced a flare in symptoms upon commencement of his antibiotic treatment. Now that I know that this is most likely typical, it can be easier to mentally cope with the reaction and fight through it with knowledge that one is actually getting through the biofilm and/or depriving the organism.

Even though you are still infected, have you been able to mitigate your symptoms to the point of remission through the techniques described in the interview?

 

[Bow Only]

I can lessen all symptoms but insomnia, brain fog (I'm just slowly slipping mentally), and increased CO2 upon exertion. No one would even know I have a problem just looking at me.

 

[jbird1]

I can lessen all symptoms but insomnia, brain fog (I'm just slowly slipping mentally), and increased CO2 upon exertion. No one would even know I have a problem just looking at me.

Now I understand the 3am posts. I think I'm going to get the Igenex Complete Lyme panel 6050 and the Complete Co infection panel 5095 for some peace of mind. I am unsure if this would include protomyxzoa or not but it's a good place to start. With my family history and current symptoms, it couldn't hurt. If anything comes up, there is an infectious disease specialist in my area that specializes in LD. I assume that would mean LLMD but I'm not sure.

 

[Bow Only]

Now I understand the 3am posts. I think I'm going to get the Igenex Complete Lyme panel 6050 and the Complete Co infection panel 5095 for some peace of mind. I am unsure if this would include protomyxzoa or not but it's a good place to start. With my family history and current symptoms, it couldn't hurt. If anything comes up, there is an infectious disease specialist in my area that specializes in LD. I assume that would mean LLMD but I'm not sure.

I feel it is a waste of time to get those tests run because of the high false negative rates. You would be better off getting the new ISpotLyme test. Its more accurate. Infectious disease physicians are not trained properly to treat Lyme or any other VBD. There are no LLMD's in GA and only 1 in AL. Science doesn't even acknowledge that Protomyxzoa Rheu. even exists. The only test for it is done in AZ.