Curious visitor. Copper headed water rattler

After zooming in on the pic for a closer look, that looks to me like a Rat Snake. It doesn't even have a diamond shaped head, which on a cottonmouth is VERY pronounced. Most cottonmouths only grow to be 3-4 feet long and have a very thick body. This one is definitely not a cottonmouth, but still a beautiful snake.

krazywayne said:

Copperheads are beautiful to look at but will ruin the day of a yard cat

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my calico shows up about oncet a year with half her head all swelled up, and she's about 4yo now.

what kind of snake is making her noggin swell up?

do you reckon she is winning, or losing?

Beautiful picture, whatever it is the muddy water really makes it pop. Regardless what kind it is I assume every snake is going to cause me a slow and painful death... So I just scream like a girl and run the opposite direction.

we were at a park the other day and had a long black snake with white rings around it cross the pond and charge up the bank towards us. It also had it's head elevated when it was swimming, ya know like a cottonmouth does - they elevate their head sort of like a cobra when in the water. This was no cottonmouth but it seemed to be acting like one, trying to be intimidating.

I've come very close to some cottonmouth moccasins, diamond shaped head, they have a black stripe on either side of their face, and they will chase you. We had one come after us below Hamburg mill dam last year, not cool. Another time boat came up on one roosting on a blowdown at bearcamp, i could've gotten a time life photo of that snake.

JEG60 said:

Since the snake's body is on top of the water while swimming, does that mean it is poisonous? I've always heard that was the case.

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I can't think of any physical difference or scientific basis for that to be the case. There are no physical differences between the bodies of venomous and non-venomous snakes. I've seen plenty of non-venomous snakes swim on top of the water, especially species of non-venomous water snakes.

I've kept snakes as pets for decades and have no fear of any snake. I've been bitten by pet snakes (non-venomous) more times than I can count and it's FAR worse to get scratched by a cat! I had a big 7 foot boa that bit my hand while I was giving it some injections (so yes, I deserved it, from his point of view) and it was about like getting caught in some briars and bled more like a shaving cut. It was nothing. Most snakes are completely harmless and if a harmless one did bite you, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. If he bit you on your pants or shoe, it wouldn't even penetrate the cloth. They have tiny teeth.

It doesn't take much effort to get educated on the kinds of snakes we have in GA to set fears aside for those who are afraid of snakes. That being said there are plenty of water snakes that look a great deal like cottonmouths for a good reason, but again they are harmless and serve an important role in nature. A little studying might save some folks a scary moment and save a few harmless snakes their lives.

I used to fish a little trout stream that had a beaver pond on it and little harmless snakes would swim back and forth across it all day. One day I was wading in this beaver pond and a little snake was headed straight for me. Snakes have very poor eyesight, so I knew exactly what he'd do when he got close enough, because snakes will flee when they are able. I know that as a fact from keeping them so many years, but just like anyone, snakes can be cranky and in a bad mood sometimes. So anyway, this little snake swims right up to me and then freezes like, "OH crap" when he sees what I am, figuring I'm about to make a meal out of him. He does a 180 and swims right back to where he came from - having floated on the water the entire time, by the way. Exactly what I knew he would do. Snakes are no big deal once you understand them. You're 6 feet tall, he's like maybe 3 inches tall. Who's the one that should be scared?

Old Dead River said:

nice snake, doesn't really look like a cottonmouth to me, looks like it's got its head up out of the water trying to look the part, but it seems aweful long and slender to be a cottonmouth moccasin, just my opinion. I enjoy the snake photos, keep 'em coming.

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I was silently thinking the same thing. The cottonmouth's that I see in Florida aren't very long but have huge bodies with very large head. Darker than that snake also.

here's a couple youtube videos of cottonmouths swimming.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bGA-omBRws

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDX9JhWcqow

I appreciate your view on snakes and you make alot of valid points.. Forgive my lack of education on snake id.. Just not gonna stop and see if its gonna bite me or not.. Your right most will flee unless you corner or intimidate them. From the ones I have seen.. The timber rattler that bit me was minding his business I ran him over with the Atv. Got off to see if be was dead and he was crawling away from me. Of course I done the stupidest thing as you all know by now and decided to stomp the fool thing flvery dumb thing to do.. Had I left him be probly would have went on his merry way, however with 2 young children and 2 elderly men I felt I had to try to kill it.. Did a whole heap of things wrong here.. So before all you moncho forum Rambos start bashing me again i live daily with my stupidity as I'm stuck with what's left of the bite.. There aren't to many men that would man up and tell the truth. Most would have some bull cocky story. Wouldn't want there man hood to be deprived of being dumb.. Anyways thanks for the edumcation

I used to assume cottonmouths wouldn't get that longbutI was wading the flint last summer fishing for shoalies and one slid off the bank not ten feet from me. It was every bit of 6 foot long, black as night and as big around as my forearm . There was noooooo mistaking what it was!!

I have an irrational fear of snakes.

Funny...was about to post a thread about an encounter I had with the Self appointed assistant lake police at the pond behind my brothers subdivision yesterday.
I show up...and ole Barney Fife(Yes he looks like him) makes a beeline to make sure I am authorized to fish the pond. A pond I fished for the first time almost 40 years ago when it still a farm....have fished the 12 years my brother has lived there...7 of which under the intense scrutiny of the Head self appointed lake police...and the year and a half Barney since Barney moved here from Cracker Florida.

Anyway...Barney slows when he realizes it is me....When he and his 8 year old son stop to speak...Barney starts reliving what he was sure would have me in awe of his obvious manliness and bravery...His shooting of a cottonmouth that was halfway to escaping in the water when Barney's cough .40 cal snake load hit it dead nuts...cutting it in half.

I asked what did the snake look like? Barney described a banded water snake to the tee. I mentioned this fact...and reassured me that being from Florida he knew what a cottonmouth looked like. I asked him if he left the half snake sitting where he shot it. He said yeah.

I told him that I hope it was a cottonmouth...because here in this part of Georgia....there are a lot of rocks. Little ones on the surface and bigger ones under the dirt...that on the glancing downward angle the shot called for right toward the water 8 or so inches away..there was no telling where that .40 cal might have ended up had it hit rock.

Not only are their houses 400 or so feet through the woods(One of those Barney's ironically)....there are trails on the opposite end of the lake away from the subdivision that lead to a high school...whose cross country team regularly use for practice.

He looked at me with a dumb look that showed multiple sources of confusion...One was the look of person who had shot into flat...soft ground all his life and never heard a projectile whiz by his head after a rock had sent it pinging off several surfaces before whizzing by the head of the shooter. One was confusion as to why I was not as impressed with his manly display of snake killing prowess.

The dumb looks drained straight from his face when I told him...in a very clear...concise...and genuine way that had my wife and I been down here when he shot...even if it had been a cottonmouth...he woulda been pistol whipped with his own gun....or if his errant shot came close enough...shot dead with the .22 revolver I sometimes carry on hike in fishing trips....for rabid coyotes...shooting dinner if necessary...but mainly for idiots that are far enough away from civilization that the hawgs will get to em before any people will.

I then started out toward what turned out to be the dead body of a water snake....the half that didn't make it into the water before Barney rushed a lucky shot that hit the snake instead of the slate rock barely poking up above the ground.

I informed Barney that he had not only made a very stupid shot to kill a non poisonous snake....He had broken a law against discharging a firearm within 1,000 feet of a house. I then pointed to the holster on his side and asked if he had a GWL...he said no...he didn't need one to carry here.

I was gonna let that go till he informed me as to why he carried....The folks who came through the trails from those woods and had cleaned out the lake of fish. Ain't nothing but dinks now.

Those were the high school kids who had been coming to the lake through the trials since the school was built....years before either of the lake police had. The lake had always had a very good population of 4 -5-6 pound bass....and every spawn we'd watch the nests where the most 12 pound plus females I have ever seen would come to lay their genetics of gold.

As my thread I'm gonna post soon will chronicle...it was the Head Idiot that instituted a zero tolerance CandR policy against my objections with printed material from Ralph Manns.....because he convinced the neighborhood that being a tournament fisherman with a big shiny boat had to know more than a dude with a backpack and spinning gear.

Now...the fruits of his idiocy have come home to roost...just as I said it would seven years ago...and it's much easier to blame some high school kids with access to about 5% of the lake instead of your own obvious idiocy.

Welp...Barney and his idiocy yesterday has sent into motion a chain of events that will remove him and the head idiot from their self appointed ownership and rule of the lake. A few deputies who are locals....along with some locals who have kids at the school...and hopefully me..are going to have a come to jesus meeting with barney and boss hogg before I leave for Jackson MIss Sunday.

Barney and Boss Hogg...both of whom are not locals..are gonna be educated in Georgia firearms....trespassing... and wildlife laws that Boss Hog broke when he transported about 8 3 to 4 pound Florida strain bass in his livewell and stocked them in the lake..along with some west point crappie...being that said lake is connected to the Chattahoochie watershed by a creek.

Out of the goodness of my heart...I'm gonna offer snake ID and how to catch bass in places other than the bank.

Awesome post Sweetwater.

LongStrangeTrip said:

I have an irrational fear of snakes.

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I used to be the same way until a friend of mine got his first pet snake, a ball python, when I was about 17. He would try to get me to touch that thing all the time and I was like, "No way am I ever going to touch that snake!" LOL. But eventually I realized that the snake didn't bite, so my fear started to go away. After gradually getting used to the python by barely touching it, then touching it a little more next visit, so on and so on, I got to where I wanted to carry it around all the time when I was at his house.

Getting some experience around them can really make a difference, because trust me, I used to be horribly afraid of any and every snake. The thing you have to realize about different snakes is that they are kind of like how people view different dog breeds - some dog breeds are known for having a nasty disposition and being biters, and some dogs are known to be generally nice and calm and never bite. Snakes are the same way - copperheads, tree boas and tree pythons have nasty attitudes and will bite you in a heartbeat, while other species like the coral snake, ball python, Dumeril's boa, and corn snake rarely or never bite, depending on the individuals. There are even some species that will constantly bite as juveniles, because they live in fear of getting eaten, being so small, but when they reach a certain size, their tendency to bite goes completely away. Pretty fascinating to me anyway.

As for my original post, if it in any way sounded condescending to anyone, I certainly did not mean it that way. I was just trying to be informative, not talk down to anyone. I have had a lot of fun over the years keeping snakes and other reptiles and I hate for them to get such a bad and undeserved reputation. Most snakes do not deserve to be thought of as dangerous and habitual biters of people.

LongStrangeTrip said:

I have an irrational fear of snakes.

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Best way I've heard this fear described is, "We (humans) tend to be afraid of critters that have either too many legs, or not enough."

Explains my irrational fear of scorpions and especially centipedes.

Snakes, I've never really worried about, I've lived in a pretty woody area for 20 something years now and I've seen a grand total of 1, count 'em 1, copperhead. We see a rat snake or a garter snake every now and then, but still it's rare. The infrequency with which I see snakes in an area that should be lousy with them definitely makes me believe that they are as disinterested in messing with me, as I am in messing with them.

Funny snake story

Maybe 25 years ago, before the yankees invaded Jackson Lake, in the spring you'd see water snakes, copperheads, and rattlers laying out on branches along the lake sunning themselves.
Back then it was no big deal to blast one with a .410 shotgun, if there was nothing in the background...house or anything like that.
I'm fishing with my buddy, I am up in the front seat and I spot a big fat rattler on a limb not too far from where Tussahaw Creek enters the main lake. BOOM...I blow him in half but the front part of him is still trying to swim.
I use the electric motor to get a closer look at him and I'm down on my knees peering over the bow concentrating on Mister Snake.
My buddy in the back quietly takes his fishing rod with a plastic worm on it and eases that worm across the back of my neck without me knowing it was coming.
The scream from me and the profanity that followed could've been heard 5 miles away as I jumped about 2 feet into the air from a kneeling position in the boat
We both laughed long and hearty about that later..but at the time it SCARED THE DAYLIGHTS out of me.
Try to imagine feeling that worm across the back of your neck while staring in the face of a half dead rattlesnake about 4 feet away in the water.

That had to be the funniest thing ever I bet. I am sure at the time it was not funny after what happened to me my buddy might have died right there lol

No cottonmouths have ever been confirmed in Jackson,Sinclair,oconee ...got to go on down a bit. Only one I've ever seen was in ocmulgee just above Macon.
Snake in pic is a brown water snake without doubt.1000s of them at Jackson.

shoot2grill said:

No cottonmouths have ever been confirmed in Jackson,Sinclair,oconee ...got to go on down a bit. Only one I've ever seen was in ocmulgee just above Macon.
Snake in pic is a brown water snake without doubt.1000s of them at Jackson.

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I have never understood that folklore either, something marion nelson used to say too. I saw the biggest cottonmouth of my life near a flooded creek in andalusia- looked like something out of indianna jones and the temple of doom, this has been over 20 years ago. As the crow flies that isn't far from sinclair, and I've seent cottonmouths in tobler creek behind the ford place as well.

did the yankees kill the snakes off?

ThomasCobb123 said:

Maybe 25 years ago, before the yankees invaded Jackson Lake, in the spring you'd see water snakes, copperheads, and rattlers laying out on branches along the lake sunning themselves.
Back then it was no big deal to blast one with a .410 shotgun, if there was nothing in the background...house or anything like that.
I'm fishing with my buddy, I am up in the front seat and I spot a big fat rattler on a limb not too far from where Tussahaw Creek enters the main lake. BOOM...I blow him in half but the front part of him is still trying to swim.
I use the electric motor to get a closer look at him and I'm down on my knees peering over the bow concentrating on Mister Snake.
My buddy in the back quietly takes his fishing rod with a plastic worm on it and eases that worm across the back of my neck without me knowing it was coming.
The scream from me and the profanity that followed could've been heard 5 miles away as I jumped about 2 feet into the air from a kneeling position in the boat
We both laughed long and hearty about that later..but at the time it SCARED THE DAYLIGHTS out of me.
Try to imagine feeling that worm across the back of your neck while staring in the face of a half dead rattlesnake about 4 feet away in the water.

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I'm no snake expert just know they are awesome and a few differences in a few breeds. This looked like a moccasin to me and that's enough or me to leave it be. Had it been on my carport it would be different. Lol. I will leave them be in there house if they leave me be in mine. I usually try to transport a snake to the woods at home but if nikki sees it it has to die. Still working on that. Lol