Do axis and fallow deer hold cure for Cwd?

Mr Bya Lungshot · May 7, 2018

While doing my research on cwd about the animals that don’t become infected or are immune. I have to imagine fallow and axis deer must hold the cure naturally and they must be the missing link. How much testing is being considered in finding the cure possibly held in those two species?
Injecting animals with cwd is not eliminating cwd so try something else and find that cure like injecting fallow or axis blood in a whitetail with cwd and test again. Eventually taking saliva from a fallow and give it orally to an infected moose. Take axis pee and get a elk to lick it. You get the idea “reverse testing” nature’s way from a similar animal with a little push from man that might just spread a cure instead.
Set up a fund where hunters and others can donate to fund research at the time of buying a license or small feed tax and know their money is going towards cwd research.
Nonetheless find that cure!!! Axis and fallow hmmm.
What do they have in their brains, blood, pee, scat or saliva that other antlered species don’t?

Throwback · May 8, 2018

be cool to have fallow and axis deer running around. They got bigger antlers

Major Wader · May 8, 2018

Throwback said:
be cool to have fallow and axis deer running around. They got bigger antlers

They get bigger and taste better, too.

Crakajak · May 9, 2018

Mr Bya Lungshot said:
While doing my research on cwd about the animals that don’t become infected or are immune. I have to imagine fallow and axis deer must hold the cure naturally and they must be the missing link. How much testing is being considered in finding the cure possibly held in those two species?
Injecting animals with cwd is not eliminating cwd so try something else and find that cure like injecting fallow or axis blood in a whitetail with cwd and test again. Eventually taking saliva from a fallow and give it orally to an infected moose. Take axis pee and get a elk to lick it. You get the idea “reverse testing” nature’s way from a similar animal with a little push from man that might just spread a cure instead.
Set up a fund where hunters and others can donate to fund research at the time of buying a license or small feed tax and know their money is going towards cwd research.
Nonetheless find that cure!!! Axis and fallow hmmm.
What do they have in their brains, blood, pee, scat or saliva that other antlered species don’t?

Can you post any links from articles or pm them to me. I have wondered why high fence operations with mixed deer in them didn't have issues with CWD in certain deer.

Mr Bya Lungshot · May 9, 2018

Goggle axis deer cwd. There you’ll find info that sparked this thread. Axis and fallow don’t seem to get cwd.

Crakajak · May 9, 2018

Mr Bya Lungshot said:
Goggle axis deer cwd. There you’ll find info that sparked this thread. Axis and fallow don’t seem to get cwd.

Thanks

ryanh487 · May 9, 2018

Elk and whitetails didn't used to get CWD either...

Though I wouldn't mind a bunch of fallow and axis to hunt. Especially if there was no season on them like out in Texas. Year round deer hunting? yes please.

ProAngler · May 10, 2018

considering they have not come close to finding a cure for any prion diseases in humans I doubt there is anyone is dedicating any resources to curing deer. Not to mention how much it would cost to try and keep trapping deer to try and cure them even if they had one.

JackSprat · May 10, 2018

Until someone finds a non-fatal way to test deer for the presence of CWD there's not much point in finding a "cure."

Hard to cure a dead deer of anything.

Mr Bya Lungshot · May 11, 2018

Since they found cwd (or have not) in urine, feces, saliva and blood. Doesn’t that mean there is actually a “live” test or can they not test those to be positive. It is one or the other.
As with anything, I’m sure the cure is natural and overlooked. Probably a plant that doesn’t grow in certain conditions or locations or quantities.
Google prion diseases. Tests show some advancements in mice. What are those axis and fallow deer eating that other animals are not getting access to?
Cwd being sporadic. It seems something is out there working in favor of some. When cwd is not found in a certain animal, that to me says that animal had the cure.

C.Killmaster · May 11, 2018

Mr Bya Lungshot said:
Since they found cwd (or have not) in urine, feces, saliva and blood. Doesn’t that mean there is actually a “live” test or can they not test those to be positive. It is one or the other.
As with anything, I’m sure the cure is natural and overlooked. Probably a plant that doesn’t grow in certain conditions or locations or quantities.
Google prion diseases. Tests show some advancements in mice. What are those axis and fallow deer eating that other animals are not getting access to?
Cwd being sporadic. It seems something is out there working in favor of some. When cwd is not found in a certain animal, that to me says that animal had the cure.

What it likely means is that there has to be a genetic predisposition to be susceptible to CWD, which is common with many prion diseases. Basically, they have to have the gene that codes for that specific protein. It probably has nothing to do with diet or that they have some cure chemical in their bodies.

ryanh487 · May 11, 2018

C.Killmaster said:
What it likely means is that there has to be a genetic predisposition to be susceptible to CWD, which is common with many prion diseases. Basically, they have to have the gene that codes for that specific protein. It probably has nothing to do with diet or that they have some cure chemical in their bodies.

So what you're saying is that if there is a genetic predisposition in certain animals for it, over time natural selection will essentially wipe out the disease from populations as those susceptable animals die out and those without the gene re-populate the region?

C.Killmaster · May 11, 2018

Mr Bya Lungshot said:
Since they found cwd (or have not) in urine, feces, saliva and blood. Doesn’t that mean there is actually a “live” test or can they not test those to be positive. It is one or the other.
As with anything, I’m sure the cure is natural and overlooked. Probably a plant that doesn’t grow in certain conditions or locations or quantities.
Google prion diseases. Tests show some advancements in mice. What are those axis and fallow deer eating that other animals are not getting access to?
Cwd being sporadic. It seems something is out there working in favor of some. When cwd is not found in a certain animal, that to me says that animal had the cure.

Regarding the live test, it's not really that simple to just test urine or saliva for prions. The current live tests being used, which are not all that reliable, use a tonsil or rectal fold biopsy and look for the characteristic plaques CWD causes. Those plaques are where billions of the misfolded prion proteins stack up and start killing cells, leaving a sponge-like area of live and dead tissue (hence spongiform encephalopathy). Proteins are about 375 million times smaller than a single blood cell, so you could imagine the difficultly in looking for them in urine or saliva as a test for the disease.

C.Killmaster · May 11, 2018

ryanh487 said:
So what you're saying is that if there is a genetic predisposition in certain animals for it, over time natural selection will essentially wipe out the disease from populations as those susceptable animals die out and those without the gene re-populate the region?

It's certainly possible, but as long as the incubation period is it would take hundreds of years for that to happen. Because deer can still reproduce during the incubation period, it slows natural selection tremendously.

Throwback · May 11, 2018

ryanh487 said:
So what you're saying is that if there is a genetic predisposition in certain animals for it, over time natural selection will essentially wipe out the disease from populations as those susceptable animals die out and those without the gene re-populate the region?

Ain't that what some folks call evolution?

JackSprat · May 11, 2018

Throwback said:
Ain't that what some folks call evolution?

They probably do, but they would be wrong.

A genetic condition (variation) originates with the parents. The genetic variation might eliminate the individual (genotype) but until you eliminate the parental gene combination that produces the variant (CWD susceptibility) it will reoccur.

If that were not the case, conditions such as hemophilia would have eliminated themselves thousands of years ago.

Sheep have had scrapie for hundreds if not thousands of years, and despite an almost 100% controlled breeding situation, it has selectively eliminated itself.

Plus as Mr. Killimaster points out, CWD infected deer can reproduce many times before being killed by the disease.

One question that has not been answered (among many) is to what extend the offspring of a CWD infected doe could be a CWD carrier, i.e. not have the genetic pre-disposition but physically carry the prion.

C.Killmaster · May 11, 2018

JackSprat said:
One question that has not been answered (among many) is to what extend the offspring of a CWD infected doe could be a CWD carrier, i.e. not have the genetic pre-disposition but physically carry the prion.

There is some evidence that it can be transmitted vertically:
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0071844

JackSprat · May 11, 2018

C.Killmaster said:
There is some evidence that it can be transmitted vertically:
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0071844

You have to love this.

Overall, our findings demonstrate that transmission of prions from mother to offspring can occur, and may be underestimated for all prion diseases

Amplifiable CWD prions were detected by sPMCA in 10 of 16 tissues tested from 6 full-term nonviable offspring (#23, #54, #25, #51, #52, #54, #56) born to CWD-infected dams (Table 2, Figures 4 and 5). All six nonviable offspring had at least two tissues containing amplifiable CWD prions– including obex, placenta, spleen, tonsil,

So it goes.

Do axis and fallow deer hold cure for Cwd?

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