A little Legalism For Everyone ? LOL

[Israel]

Because the church is an institution whereby Saints pool resources and gifts in order to make the Kingdom prosperous. It is not essential to salvation. But would you like to be operated on by an "I fly solo" physician or one that is associated with a college of physicians.???

Just a point. No polemics required brother. I trust the Lord is by your side, ...ask Him.

Also to say that Jesus was not a member of a religion is a stretch. His mommy and daddy were...

You make interesting points...first, to the last.
If Jesus was indeed, IS indeed a member of a religion, then any who are called by his name would be "of that", no?
But that begs the question...who is Jesus? Is he from the beginning? Is Judaism practiced in heaven? Was Jesus a Jew before he stepped onto this soil? Is God a Jew?
And if so, what right could any man have to claim His name and not be?
What makes a "Jew"?
(And here I liberally use that word to describe those to whom the ordinances and law were given, I am sure some, wanting to be more precise, would remind me that Jew is one from the tribe of Judah)

As to your first point, I see a divide between the Church and religion, I no longer equate the two. Is being a member of the church the same as being a member of a "christian" religion? Who or what makes us a member of the church...and who or what makes us a member of a religion?

As to the middle point. There is only "One" who has the right to operate on any of us. We are his workmanship, and forasmuch as he works through other believers (and even unbelievers) to bring about his desire...it remains his work alone. Are we more likely to get tuned up among those who have faith in his name? Surely.
But that is precisely why I am eager to hear where a man stands, does he have hope in his religious beliefs, or is he endeavoring to stand in Christ alone? Has he been taught by what I see as the Holy Spirit (and I know I must be careful not to discount those who see farther ahead just because I do not have an experience to validate their testimony), or taught by religion. I know I must give an answer for what I have done with the Lord when he makes himself known to me...through whatever vessel.
But, from my perspective, they are mutually exclusive...never blending.
Identity is a most powerful thing. If a man is casually content to call himself by a religious affiliation, well, all I can say is what I believe I have seen of the Lord...what we place over us, has authority over us.

 

[gordon 2]

You make interesting points...first, to the last.
If Jesus was indeed, IS indeed a member of a religion, then any who are called by his name would be "of that", no?
But that begs the question...who is Jesus? Is he from the beginning? Is Judaism practiced in heaven? Was Jesus a Jew before he stepped onto this soil? Is God a Jew?
And if so, what right could any man have to claim His name and not be?
What makes a "Jew"?
(And here I liberally use that word to describe those to whom the ordinances and law were given, I am sure some, wanting to be more precise, would remind me that Jew is one from the tribe of Judah)

As to your first point, I see a divide between the Church and religion, I no longer equate the two. Is being a member of the church the same as being a member of a "christian" religion? Who or what makes us a member of the church...and who or what makes us a member of a religion?

As to the middle point. There is only "One" who has the right to operate on any of us. We are his workmanship, and forasmuch as he works through other believers (and even unbelievers) to bring about his desire...it remains his work alone. Are we more likely to get tuned up among those who have faith in his name? Surely.
But that is precisely why I am eager to hear where a man stands, does he have hope in his religious beliefs, or is he endeavoring to stand in Christ alone? Has he been taught by what I see as the Holy Spirit (and I know I must be careful not to discount those who see farther ahead just because I do not have an experience to validate their testimony), or taught by religion. I know I must give an answer for what I have done with the Lord when he makes himself known to me...through whatever vessel.
But, from my perspective, they are mutually exclusive...never blending.
Identity is a most powerful thing. If a man is casually content to call himself by a religious affiliation, well, all I can say is what I believe I have seen of the Lord...what we place over us, has authority over us.

Gee. A ball of yarn by a playful cat ( LOL) is to much for my spinning wheel this morning . However, I think briefly what is important here is that Jesus not only had God in his heart but man as well. ( I know it sounds stupid to say such a thing.) What comes with man is his institutions. Religion is one. If Christ is to stand with man, than he stands with man's religion.

Jesus never stood alone except with tears if I recall. Jesus was a jew who was instructed and instructed his community--He participated or observed the Holydays. He was notof the religion like the samaritans and he made a point to disassociate himself from that denomination--saying you don't know what your about.

Now Jesus is the example then that one is not the slave of his religion or church for that matter ( they are different) and religion is not set up to lord it over the followers. That it does now and then is undeniable. In such cases religion and denominations become cults.

Put it this way I am RC, but I am not a deciple of it. I cannot be a deciple of an institution. But I feel very much at home there, except for when I am in the Spirit and with you.

 

[Ronnie T]

I probalby am over my head here with a response. The legalist is not comfortable or accustomed to grace, ...perhaps.

You're probably right.

 

[Ronnie T]

"There are the Church of Christ legalists who put the members under law and say if you are not baptized in water according to the method in their church you are not saved. There are the Seventh Day Adventist legalists who put their members under law and condemn other Christians who celebrate Sunday. Then there are the cults like the Mormons and the Jehovah Witnesses who are so legalistic and blinded by dark light that they cannot even be called Christian."

Funny the Mormons are trying so hard to be considered Christians....See the Glenn Beck thread.....RW

So, are you saying I'm a legalist if I don't offer baptism as an 'option only'.
I'll discuss this with you in pm's if you like, but don't call me a legalist because I "insist" on instructing exactly as God's words instructs.

 

[Lowjack]

Come out of [Babylon], my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues; for her sins are piled up to heaven, and God has remembered her crimes". (Revelation 18:4-5)

 

[dawg2]

Dominic/Dawg....

Curious as to your thoughts on the section above. Tried to weed out some of the "hate" speech...as even I think it was a bit "overdone." Is the above sections not an accurate view of the Catholic Church?

It is about as accurate as a football bat. The RC recognizes there will be many in Heaven, even Baptists

 

[dawg2]

I am not one of the two Ds , but I know a little about the CC. It is not an accurate view. For example the CC says you don't even have to be a RC to know salvation, so that the offices of the CC are required for salvation is blown out at the C's front doors.

I did not see this earlier, you are correct. Lowjack's article is a gross and deliberate misrepresenation of the CC. It is obviously written by someone who has nothing but an agenda to further their book sales or trick people into dumping more money in that metal dinner plate that gets passed around in their "church."

 

[dawg2]

Because the church is an institution whereby Saints pool resources and gifts in order to make the Kingdom prosperous. It is not essential to salvation. But would you like to be operated on by an "I fly solo" physician or one that is associated with a college of physicians.???

Just a point. No polemics required brother. I trust the Lord is by your side, ...ask Him.

Also to say that Jesus was not a member of a religion is a stretch. His mommy and daddy were...

That is funny

 

[dawg2]

Come out of [Babylon], my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues; for her sins are piled up to heaven, and God has remembered her crimes". (Revelation 18:4-5)

To where shall we go? I asked you in another thread and you never answered.

 

[Spotlite]

Lowjack's article is a gross and deliberate misrepresenation of................

Lowjack has either bumped his head or his head has swollen up so much from the "I" am highly learned in everything attitude and believes he can do and has done everything but died and has tried that twice attitude.....................either way, the blood flow has been shut off to the brain

 

[apoint]

My question is do RC pray to saints? Believe in purgatory? Confess their sins to a man? Call their priest Father? Chant repetitious prayers? Tell their followers they have to stay catholic to be saved?
I once new a preacher that was brought up Catholic and changed to Baptist, and this is what he told me. His family & CC disowned him when he changed faiths.. Dont shoot the mesenger please.

 

[Dominic]

My question is do RC pray to saints? Believe in purgatory? Confess their sins to a man? Call their priest Father? Chant repetitious prayers? Tell their followers they have to stay catholic to be saved?

We ask for their prayers.

We do as we are told in Scripture (James 5:15-16)

Yes, we do. Do you call a Teacher, Teacher? Are we to take this literally? If so what about St. Paul in Romans 9:10 or St. Stephen in Acts 7:2

We do not use vain repetition, which is what Scripture warns. If you are worried about repetitious prayer you should exclude Psalm 136.

Does the Catholic Church say this to its followers, or is it just what you have heard?

I once new a preacher that was brought up Catholic and changed to Baptist, and this is what he told me. His family & CC disowned him when he changed faiths.. Dont shoot the mesenger please.

What of it? I know a priest who was brought up Baptist and his family as well as his Baptist Church disowned him when he changed faiths.

Stupidity knows no faith

 

[gordon 2]

To where shall we go? I asked you in another thread and you never answered.

I think that perhaps the hesitation this time is that we'all have to make peace with the cannanites when we get there, unlike the last go around--which is one of them (what chu-ma-call) paradigm shifts. This is why all the coughing and hacking before the answer. There will be lots more swallowing than hollaring...

It will be like the negociations with the Isreali and Palastine except a lot more intense--because this time we are the Hebrews and the Cananites with no place to go other than to our hearts.

 

[dawg2]

My question is do RC pray to saints? Believe in purgatory? Confess their sins to a man? Call their priest Father? Chant repetitious prayers? Tell their followers they have to stay catholic to be saved?
I once new a preacher that was brought up Catholic and changed to Baptist, and this is what he told me. His family & CC disowned him when he changed faiths.. Dont shoot the mesenger please.

When I was getting married we met with my wife's preacher (Baptist). He told her / us that she would be required by the CC to sign papers demanding when we had kids they had to be Catholic (not true). If they were not, the kids would be taken from her (not true). He also ranted on about statue worshipping (not true). He also asked her if she was OK with sleeping with the priest on our wedding night since this was a requirement (not true). He told her this was done for all people marrying a Catholic (not true). He said Catholics were not Christian and did not recognize Jesus Christ (not true).

This was all first hand so don't shoot the messenger.

I would say Dominic summed it up nicely.

Just remember: A single isolated event or circumstance does not a hypothesis nor theory make.

 

[dawg2]

I think that perhaps the hesitation this time is that we'all have to make peace with the cannanites when we get there, unlike the last go around--which is one of them (what chu-ma-call) paradigm shifts. This is why all the coughing and hacking before the answer. There will be lots more swallowing than hollaring...

It will be like the negociations with the Isreali and Palastine except a lot more intense--because this time we are the Hebrews and the Cananites with no place to go other than to our hearts.

Interesting, I like it.

But I would like for Lowjack to clarify this himself. Maybe he can't type on Sunday because of the Sabbath, it may be viewed as work.

 

[gordon 2]

Interesting, I like it.

But I would like for Lowjack to clarify this himself. Maybe he can't type on Sunday because of the Sabbath, it may be viewed as work.

Perhaps he can sing a hyme in response. Reading scripture and singing hymes was all the work my presbytirian grand-ma did on the Lord's day. Her family hailed from the Heberdies and I think she shared a bit of the brogue like this sweetheart... And her name was also Kate.

Something like this:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/9WNG5rMV9xY?fs=1&hl=en_US&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/9WNG5rMV9xY?fs=1&hl=en_US&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

 

[apoint]

Thank you for your responces. We all have to make our own personal decisions on what our HOLY book KJV etc actually says.
I try to read mine daily but I am not a scholar yet.
Sorry for my late response but I do have to sleep sometimes. Now I'm off to my nondenominational church.

 

[Jeffriesw]

Stupidity knows no faith

Amen Brother, Truer words have never been spoken.

 

[apoint]

Interesting, I like it.

But I would like for Lowjack to clarify this himself. Maybe he can't type on Sunday because of the Sabbath, it may be viewed as work.

I know this might be a shock to you but Sunday is not the Sabbath.

 

[apoint]

We ask for their prayers.

Jesus teach us to pray," our Father who art in heaven"------------



Yes, we do. Do you call a Teacher, Teacher? Are we to take this literally? If so what about St. Paul in Romans 9:10 or St. Stephen in Acts 7:2

Call no man Father but The Father in heaven.-----------------Romans 9:10 is a flesh parental Father by birth. Not a priest Father that people kneel down to and kiss his hand and call him holy father.-------------

We do not use vain repetition, which is what Scripture warns. If you are worried about repetitious prayer you should exclude Psalm 136.

Psalm 136 is not repetition, each verse says something entirely different giving thanks in a song.----------------






What of it? I know a priest who was brought up Baptist and his family as well as his Baptist Church disowned him when he changed faiths.

Stupidity knows no faith

Is this quote in the RC bible ^ --------------------------- This has been my observation, dont shoot the messenger.