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Wisconsin Shootings - the Police Report
- Thread starter TOW
- Start date
GeauxLSU
Senior Member
Wow! The whole thing is so surreal.... 
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
Michael Lee
Senior Member
Self defense is one thing, but this is MURDER.
I have been trying to put myself in VANG's place to see what I would do.
???
ML
I have been trying to put myself in VANG's place to see what I would do.
???
ML
Dog Hunter
Senior Member
WOW :
:Hunting Tarheel
Member
I guess the thing that bothers me most is how these guys had one gun with them. Maybe I am a little sick but in that situation I would had to anticipate that something possibly bad could happen here and play it overly cautious. It really seems like bad luck that he could hurt so many without a scratch on him.
With 5 people surrounding him would it have been better to take his gun and reassure him once he is escorted off the property he could have it back? Probably a bad call on my part but any other suggestions!
With 5 people surrounding him would it have been better to take his gun and reassure him once he is escorted off the property he could have it back? Probably a bad call on my part but any other suggestions!
Nick_T
Banned
Personally I think he asked for a lawyer to just bide himself some time to get his "story" straight before he called them back and talked without a lawyer. And this crap about it being some sort of cultural thing about not understanding private property is a load of bull also, it ain't really hard to understand that if ya don't have permission ya don't go there. The death penality ain't really justice for anything like this, all that does is keep us taxpayers from having to foot the bill for his living expenses for the rest of his life. I haven't a clue what could be actually done to bring "justice" in a case like this.
Sorry for the rant. I read the report twice and got madder each time.
Nick T
Sorry for the rant. I read the report twice and got madder each time.
Nick T
Meriwether Mike
Senior Member
Electrocution is too good for this man!
GeauxLSU
Senior Member
Apparently it is illegal in Wisconsin to carry a firearm on an ATV. :
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
dbone
Outdoor Cafe Moderator
given the adage that you are innocent until proven guilty , this is going to be a CourtTV jewel .
If there is any validity to Vangs statement , there are a few things that need to be asked .
how would he know that he was on 400 acres of private property if there wasn't a confrontation ?
If there was no confrontation , How did vang know that he had been sitting in the property owners sons' stand ?
How did Vang know know they were taking down his licence number if it had been scribbled on a dusty atv gas tank and why would he let them if his intentions were to cause them harm ?
Don't get me wrong I'm not defending this fella , but I believe there may have been a confrontation with these people where he felt his life was in peril especially if he was indeed shot at , and if he was the first shooting may have been justified , but he readily admits to shooting unarmed people afterwards which is murder unless he was so scared that his mind snapped , put yourself in the position of being surrounded by 5 or 6 angry men in the middle of the woods , you're lost , scared , and getting shot at what would you do ?? Yep CourtTV is going to have a hayday with this one
If there is any validity to Vangs statement , there are a few things that need to be asked .
how would he know that he was on 400 acres of private property if there wasn't a confrontation ?
If there was no confrontation , How did vang know that he had been sitting in the property owners sons' stand ?
How did Vang know know they were taking down his licence number if it had been scribbled on a dusty atv gas tank and why would he let them if his intentions were to cause them harm ?
Don't get me wrong I'm not defending this fella , but I believe there may have been a confrontation with these people where he felt his life was in peril especially if he was indeed shot at , and if he was the first shooting may have been justified , but he readily admits to shooting unarmed people afterwards which is murder unless he was so scared that his mind snapped , put yourself in the position of being surrounded by 5 or 6 angry men in the middle of the woods , you're lost , scared , and getting shot at what would you do ?? Yep CourtTV is going to have a hayday with this one
GeauxLSU
Senior Member
dBone - I can easily believe the guy
I have no problem believing his account of the incident is entirely accurate. Really, the only material difference between his account and the surviving victims is he said they fired a shot first (he does mention a second weapon which apparently has not materialized). Regardless, as you point out, he then goes on to admitting murdering unarmed people who were absolutely no threat and in fact attempting to flee.
So I'm going to take him at his word, he's now a self admitted multi murderer.
You are right, I can conceive of 'snapping' if someone fired a shot at me in those conditions and spraying all the lead I had at my disposal at everything moving, but hopefully, somewhere a LOT sooner than he did, I'd come to my senses.
I can also conceive of a slick defense lawyer, an inept prosecutor and an ignorant jury, letting him walk. Doubtful, but conceivable.
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
I have no problem believing his account of the incident is entirely accurate. Really, the only material difference between his account and the surviving victims is he said they fired a shot first (he does mention a second weapon which apparently has not materialized). Regardless, as you point out, he then goes on to admitting murdering unarmed people who were absolutely no threat and in fact attempting to flee.
So I'm going to take him at his word, he's now a self admitted multi murderer.
You are right, I can conceive of 'snapping' if someone fired a shot at me in those conditions and spraying all the lead I had at my disposal at everything moving, but hopefully, somewhere a LOT sooner than he did, I'd come to my senses.
I can also conceive of a slick defense lawyer, an inept prosecutor and an ignorant jury, letting him walk. Doubtful, but conceivable.
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
Kansashunter
Banned
As usual I don't agree with the majority
But his story is very believable. True? not sure. Let's say his story is 100% true. He is proven inocent for one case. Self defense. The other 5 will all be a guilty verdict for murder. The others assault. The guys fries either way. His story did not in anyway help his case. So what if they called him names. That happens all the time here. Nobody has shot anyone.
But just remember. We will never know the complete truth unless Vang himself tells it. You all know the survivers stories will be stretched. And I don't blame them one bit.
But his story is very believable. True? not sure.
Let's say his story is 100% true. He is proven inocent for one case. Self defense. The other 5 will all be a guilty verdict for murder. The others assault. The guys fries either way. His story did not in anyway help his case. So what if they called him names. That happens all the time here. Nobody has shot anyone. But just remember. We will never know the complete truth unless Vang himself tells it. You all know the survivers stories will be stretched. And I don't blame them one bit.
GeauxLSU
Senior Member
Yep. Though I'd assume he'll be charged with attempted murder (vs. assault) for the surviving victims, assuming of course they don't subsequently die from their injuries.Kansashunter said:But his story is very believable. True? not sure.
But just remember. We will never know the complete truth unless Vang himself tells it. You all know the survivers stories will be stretched. And I don't blame them one bit.
Hunt/fish safely,
Phil
Nick_T
Banned
Latest out.......
They are also investigating a 2001 deer hunting murder around Neilsville WI. It is being possibly linked now to him as well. That episode had 3 Hmong in a 87 Nissan truck that they never were able to id, all the rest of the hunters were id'd in the area. Turns out Vang had that exact truck type and was known to be hunting in that area that year.
They are also investigating a 2001 deer hunting murder around Neilsville WI. It is being possibly linked now to him as well. That episode had 3 Hmong in a 87 Nissan truck that they never were able to id, all the rest of the hunters were id'd in the area. Turns out Vang had that exact truck type and was known to be hunting in that area that year.
Cheri
Member
Skipper said:
There is no death penalty in Wisconsin ... The maximum penalty, if he is convicted, will be multiple life sentences ..
Kansashunter
Banned
Yep your right Phil
I missed that. Attempted Murder for sure.
gabuckeye, Is it legal to carry a side arm during bow season? Just wondering?
I missed that. Attempted Murder for sure.
gabuckeye, Is it legal to carry a side arm during bow season? Just wondering?
In Kentucky it is not legal to carry a side arm during bow season. However, you gotta understand, this is Kentucky. Carrying a pistol is what people do here. When I said you could expect to find 3 or 4 pistols on the deacons at church taking up the offering I wasn't BSing. I would expect that. I have know that several preachers have a firearm under the pulpit. Why? A few years ago some nut came in and robbed a few churches one Sunday night. He'd show up mask and all, walk down the isle like Jesse James and take the collection plate.
Women pack pistols in their purse here. It's just no big deal.
Now, when I'm on public land bow hunting I won't pack because of the law, but on private land, you betcha there's a snake shooter tagging along.
Skipper
Women pack pistols in their purse here. It's just no big deal.
Now, when I'm on public land bow hunting I won't pack because of the law, but on private land, you betcha there's a snake shooter tagging along.
Skipper
TOW
Senior Member
Nick_T said:
Authorities looking at possible Vang connection to 2001 hunter slaying, detective says
Associated Press
November 24, 2004 RELATED1125
MILWAUKEE -- Authorities are looking into whether the man suspected of killing six deer hunters in northern Wisconsin this week was involved in the unsolved slaying of another deer hunter three years ago, a detective told a newspaper.
``I can tell you we have been in contact with authorities from Sawyer County to address that,'' Clark County Sheriff's Department Detective Kerry Kirn told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel on Tuesday.
Jim Southworth was shot to death Nov. 23, 2001, as he hunted on family land 10 miles east of Neillsville and Kirn said he had exchanged frequent calls this week with investigators in Sawyer County, where the six hunters were killed and two others wounded Sunday.
But ``it is premature to speculate if there is a connection'' between the two incidents, Kirn said.
Kirn did not immediately return a call left early today by The Associated Press. Calls to the Sawyer County Sheriff's Department on the matter were referred to state Justice Department spokesman Brian Rieselman, who was not immediately available at his office early today.
Southworth was shot twice in the back, an autopsy found. Court record say several of those killed Sunday where shot in the back.
Witnesses said they saw a pickup truck with three men inside on a road near where Southworth's body was found, about 80 miles south of Sunday's shooting.
The three men were described as Asian from 5-foot-4-inches to 6-feet tall, driving a silver or gray Nissan or Chevrolet pickup truck, possibly a late 1980s model with a light-colored fiberglass topper.
Chai Vang, 36, of St. Paul, Minn., who is being held on $2.5 million bond in Sunday's shootings, is 5-foot-4, according to a court document.
Vang has owned a 1987 Nissan pickup, the Journal Sentinel said, attributing that information to an unnamed online search service.
Sawyer County authorities have said a dispute over use of a deer stand on private property was a factor in this week's shooting. One of the theories Clark County authorities have been pursuing is that Southworth was shot after confronting a trespasser.
Vang had an out-of-state license to hunt in Wisconsin during 2001, said Mike Bartz, a Department of Natural Resources warden manager. The St. Paul man also had a license in 2000, 2002 and this year, Bartz said.
Kirn described the three people sought in Southworth's murder ``persons of interest'' in that case.
``To our knowledge, those are the only three people who we haven't identified who were in that area that day,'' Kirn said.
The Clark County sheriff's detective said investigators from the state Department of Justice are investigating both cases.
``They need to do their investigation and when all facts come out, and they will relay that to me, and we'll make the comparison,'' Kirn said.
