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Where to buy Blackhorn 209 powder
- Thread starter MikeyD6
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BarnesAddict
Senior Member
Good luck. With all this Covid stuff going on and the manufacturers not manufacturing, plus with all the CVA Paramount guys now, its becoming hard to find. Especially in 5#.
All my sources have been out of 5# containers but.... I did find another source. About $30 higher cost in the long run, but when you can't find it, buy it when you see it.
All my sources have been out of 5# containers but.... I did find another source. About $30 higher cost in the long run, but when you can't find it, buy it when you see it.
I had to look up a CVA Paramount, that's a cannon! I just got into muzzleloading this year, so I'm doing research and figuring out what works. I get good groups using hornady 250 grain sabots with 2 pellets of 777, but only if I swab between every shot. I was hoping to get away from that so I could get a reasonably quick follow up shot if need be. Thanks for the info, I'll keep my eyes open.
Fork Horn
Senior Member
Just ordered some powder from Midway USA. I couldn’t find it anywhere near me. Also had to order some 209 primers, again couldn’t find any near me and several places online were out as well.
flintlock hunter
Senior Member
This is off point, but have you tried Pyrodex yet. 99% of my shooting, (flintlocks) is with real black powder, but in both my caplocks I've found the R/S Pyrodex allows me at least 10 accurate shots without doing anything but loading the next charge.
Your 209 primers should be more than hot enough to give consistant ignition as well, which is another plus. Just thought another option might be a good thought.
Your 209 primers should be more than hot enough to give consistant ignition as well, which is another plus. Just thought another option might be a good thought.
Thanks flintlock, that’s really what I want to be able to do. Be it blackhorn or pyrodex I don’t want to swab every time. Do pellets create more crud than loose powder in general? Maybe some type of binder that holds them together? It is convenient to just drop them down the barrel but dumping a pre measured tube of loose powder wouldn’t really be any more difficult.
flintlock hunter
Senior Member
I've found the powder residue of Pyrodex is softer than black powder, which I think is the reason so many shots can be fired with no swabbing. IMO clean up is a bit easier too.
If you're using a speedloader to keep your loads premeasured and ready, all you need do is pour the powder into the bore, settle it, then load the bullet. It's only a minor difference between loading pellets or loose powder when it's already premeasured.
Bottom line is use the powder that does what you can depend on, and that includes not needing to swab between shots. I use R/S for the range, and Select for hunting. I've also settled on Birchwood Casey Barricade as a preservative since it takes only a small amount to dampen the patch to coat the bore when you're done cleaning and the bore is dry. Maybe the best part is there is no need of wiping excess preservative from the bore before loading because once the Barricade dries there is no excess to remove in an effort to keep the cold, clean, fouling round in the group. The fouling round generally stays with the group, and we all know which round puts the venison on the ground!
Hope this helps out.....you will love muzzleloading!
If you're using a speedloader to keep your loads premeasured and ready, all you need do is pour the powder into the bore, settle it, then load the bullet. It's only a minor difference between loading pellets or loose powder when it's already premeasured.
Bottom line is use the powder that does what you can depend on, and that includes not needing to swab between shots. I use R/S for the range, and Select for hunting. I've also settled on Birchwood Casey Barricade as a preservative since it takes only a small amount to dampen the patch to coat the bore when you're done cleaning and the bore is dry. Maybe the best part is there is no need of wiping excess preservative from the bore before loading because once the Barricade dries there is no excess to remove in an effort to keep the cold, clean, fouling round in the group. The fouling round generally stays with the group, and we all know which round puts the venison on the ground!
Hope this helps out.....you will love muzzleloading!
The "crud ring" issue comes from using 209 primers with both pellets and loose. Using "caps" will mitigate it somewhat but it will not solve the issue. If "you" are bent on shooting black powder, 777, Pyrodex and the such you will have swab the bore after every couple shots.
If that's the way you go, take a few patches and soak them in Windex. Squeeze the excess out and swab. Works great but i guess you could use any premoistened BP cleaning patch
BH 209 will not reliably ignite with "low strength" 209's, that were designed for black powder substitutes. It will take the regular 209's for shotgun shells. I use the CCI 209M with BH 209 and have no problems with ignition or a crud ring but then again BH209 is not Sulphur based powder.
I have shot my rifle up to 25 times using BH 209 with no stabbing and it was as easy to load on the 25th time as it was the 1st and the cleanup time is short. 3-4 patches through the barrel, clean breech plug and put it up. Good luck.
flintlock hunter
Senior Member
As I eluded to, pellets are not something I generally use, so there is no way I would dispute your findings. I tend to use CCI #11 Magnum caps with Pyrodex, and never had a "crud" problem. Based on your post, the standard 209 primers might not produce that crud ring when using Pyrodex, the same as the Magnum # 11 caps have shown no problem with it in my Thunderhawk.
I think MickeyD6 was more concerned with accuacy being maintained, which is the reason I stated 10 shots fired accurately. Pyrodex in my gun will continue to load easily even after accuracy begins to fall off.
Thank for sharing the information from your experience as well, knowledge brings success.
I think MickeyD6 was more concerned with accuacy being maintained, which is the reason I stated 10 shots fired accurately. Pyrodex in my gun will continue to load easily even after accuracy begins to fall off.
Thank for sharing the information from your experience as well, knowledge brings success.
As for "jamming another one the barrel and shooting" what's the use in that. Maybe I should have also stated that along with the easy loading accuracy never degraded any.
Unless you just want to stay nostalgic and belch smoke you will really like BH209 and the best part BH209 is easier to find most times. I find it at wally world.
flintlock hunter
Senior Member
I always felt a great deal of the fun and enjoyment of muzzleloading was the learning part, and it looks like you have a couple of options to look into now.
The 280 Man seems to like a less traditional approach, while I am more of the flintlock traditional, which ever one works out for you is the one to go with. BH powder isn't in my bag of tricks, but BP and Pyrodex is. If the BH doesn't lose accuracy in 25 rounds it is a modern improvement to say the least, but I can count on one hand the deer I had to shoot a second time, so Pyrodex in my caplocks is good, and three shots without swabbing or loss of accuracy in my flintlock rifles and pistols using real BP is all I need to float my boat.
I would suggest trying what you have the materials for first, and if it is what you're looking for, you're home!
Here's a 9 shot group using three different powder charges, including the fouling round from my 54 caliber flintlock.
The 280 Man seems to like a less traditional approach, while I am more of the flintlock traditional, which ever one works out for you is the one to go with. BH powder isn't in my bag of tricks, but BP and Pyrodex is. If the BH doesn't lose accuracy in 25 rounds it is a modern improvement to say the least, but I can count on one hand the deer I had to shoot a second time, so Pyrodex in my caplocks is good, and three shots without swabbing or loss of accuracy in my flintlock rifles and pistols using real BP is all I need to float my boat.
I would suggest trying what you have the materials for first, and if it is what you're looking for, you're home!
Here's a 9 shot group using three different powder charges, including the fouling round from my 54 caliber flintlock.
Railroader
Billy’s Security Guard.
That's dang good shooting, FH...Dang good.
To the OP, just getting started...
There are no wrong answers in the muzzleloader world, and there are a ton of options.
After a lot of playing with all this stuff over a lotta years, I have concluded this.
The best shooting, most accurate, and best performing load is a Hornady GP 385 cast bullet, and 90gr good old Black Powder.
My Hawken? Yes.
My scoped TC Omega? Yes.
My 20" Buckskinner? Drop the charge to 80gr, but yes.
I get results almost as good as FH, and cleanup is as easy as any other product.
Have fun, cause that's what it's about.
To the OP, just getting started...
There are no wrong answers in the muzzleloader world, and there are a ton of options.
After a lot of playing with all this stuff over a lotta years, I have concluded this.
The best shooting, most accurate, and best performing load is a Hornady GP 385 cast bullet, and 90gr good old Black Powder.
My Hawken? Yes.
My scoped TC Omega? Yes.
My 20" Buckskinner? Drop the charge to 80gr, but yes.
I get results almost as good as FH, and cleanup is as easy as any other product.
Have fun, cause that's what it's about.
35 Whelen
Senior Member
Over the last several years I have tried a number of different powder/bullet combinations in my New England Firearms Huntsman and I get the best results from 70 grains of FFG Triple Seven and a 385 grain Hornady Great Plains bullet.
flintlock hunter
Senior Member
Thank you for the compliment Railroader!
I had forgotten about the Hornady GP bullet, it does shoot really good, and with powder charges from 70-90 Grs. If I remember correctly a 90 gr charge delivered an approximate 1400 fps, and a trajectory of roughly 2" high @ 50 yds giving a 100 yd zero. Bullet came with some kind of dri lube on it, and was very accurate.
Forgive me please if my memory is a bit faulty with those specs, but I'm starting to get a bit old and decrepid!
Looks like yet another option snuck in there for you Micky! And Railroader's correct, opinions on muzzleloading are like noses on faces, nearly everyone has one!
I had forgotten about the Hornady GP bullet, it does shoot really good, and with powder charges from 70-90 Grs. If I remember correctly a 90 gr charge delivered an approximate 1400 fps, and a trajectory of roughly 2" high @ 50 yds giving a 100 yd zero. Bullet came with some kind of dri lube on it, and was very accurate.
Forgive me please if my memory is a bit faulty with those specs, but I'm starting to get a bit old and decrepid!
Looks like yet another option snuck in there for you Micky! And Railroader's correct, opinions on muzzleloading are like noses on faces, nearly everyone has one!
flintlock hunter
Senior Member
Just what I need, more options! But seriously, I appreciate the info. I’m flying solo on this, so anything I can learn is a plus. I do wonder though, is a 250 grain sabot enough to put a deer down?
This one I DO have in my arsenal! I use a Traditions 250gr saboted round in my T/C Thunderhawke with a 100 gr charge of Pyrodex Select. The load groups right at 1 1/2" @ 100 yds, and waffels deer on the spot. Only once did I have to track over 50 yds using it, that was a doe coming straight on that "bent" the bullet when it deflected on bone, but transverved to the oppsite ham. Shot was only 65 yds.
Yes Sir, a 250 gr sabot is up to the task. As flconch53 said, just aim well. Deer don't travel far with both shoulders broken.
