Dixie Dawg
Senior Member
I am on a number of Yahoo email groups, and this came across in one of my Judaism groups, and I thought some of you might enjoy reading it. I realize you may not agree with what it says, but it does give some food for thought. I think there are a lot of interesting points made here... enjoy!
"There is no concept of equating sins (unintentional or intentional) with a fallen nature of man. The whole idea of a fallen man is pagan and NOT Jewish.
The story of Adam and Chava (Chava) shows the gulf between Xianity and Judaism. Chavan at this starting point the two faiths diverge greatly. Original sin is not a Jewish concept. People are not “born into sin” because of the fall of Adam and Chava (Chava). The serpent is not Satan – it is just a serpent.
Xianity NEEDS original sin. Xian theology holds that a sinless J* was part of the heavenly Father's plan from the outset, to redeem mankind. After all, the act of disobedience by Adam and Chava in the Garden of Eden, the Fall of Man, placed the stain of sin on humanity, one that cannot be removed through a person's own actions.
This opens the way for J*, the perfect sacrificial offering of the future, was born through the impregnation by the Holy Spirit of the virgin, Mary. J* was thus born without the stain of Original Sin, since he was conceived of G-d and not through the customary act of copulation by two sinful humans.
First of all: sex is not “sinful” it is a gift from G-d to “be fruitful and multiply.”
Secondly there is no original sin that makes all of mankind tainted so that a human sacrifice (or god-sacrifice) has to come along to redeem us. Man is not born “into” sin.
How do we know that the sin wasn’t that grievous (a fallen nature)?
Because of the Hebrew word used to describe the sin. In Hebrew there are many words for sin, but the big “three” are pasha (a rebellion against G-d), an ovom (a lustful act of passion) and a cheit – an unintentional “missing of the mark.”
Torah tells us that Adam and Chava committed a 'cheit'. A 'missing of the mark'. The word comes from an arrow that misses its target. The result may have ramifications, but the act was not done with malice aforethought.
Hardly the stuff “original sin” comes from.
Further we know that G-d didn't immediately punish Adam and Chava and bar them from the Tree of Life because they disobeyed and ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, but He gave them an opportunity to repent and tell Him the truth (after they had eaten and could recognize that it was wrong to disobey). Teshuva – repenting and turning to G-d.
But Adam and then Chava failed to do teshuvah but blamed someone else for their actions. Chava blamed the serpent. Adam blamed Chava. No one said “I’m sorry. I did wrong. Forgive me.”
So was the real sin the eating of the fruit, or the immature finger pointing and refusal to take responsibility that happened after they ate the fruit? The far greater sin is the second one. The whole point is that teshuvah is an essential part of Torah, and thus Torah gives us the opportunity to partake of eternal life (i.e, communion with G-d) Chavan when we sin – but we must take responsibility for our own actions.
Xians say G-d cursed Adam and Chava – to a horribly hard life and to death. This is because of their “fall from grace.” Man has a fallen nature in his soul because of Adam. But that is not what Torah says happened. G-d curses the serpent – not Adam and Chava!
Quote:
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“Cursed are you”, arur atah, is not repeated, nor is a synonym used when G-d addresses Chava and Adam. Instead G-d says arurah ha'adamah, cursed is the earth/ground.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This speaks of the earth/ground that Adam will have to work - but G-d does ot curse Adam or Chava.
This major point is lost in the Xian concept.
G-d does not curse Adam and Chava!
Adam and Chava are punished, but they are not cursed. They are told that they will not be "on easy street" because of their transgression - she will have pain in childbirth, and he will have to sweat to earn his bread.
People are not born into sin.
People are born with an inclination to evil and may choose between good or evil. Again, this is clearly stated in Torah.
This is re-enforced in Genesis 4:7 when G-d speaks to Cain and tells him that good and evil are his choices and that he (Cain) should choose good. G-d tells Cain that he can master evil.
Ergo if Cain can CHOOSE, he isn’t “born evil” or “born into sin.”
Read the psalm 24 which speaks of man being given a pure heart. In Genesis we also find out that mankind has an "evil inclination" ("evil in their heart") from their youth, not from birth:
Genesis 8:21 - And the L-rd smelled the pleasant aroma, and the L-rd said to Himself, "I will no longer curse the earth because of man, for the inclination of man's heart is evil from his youth, and I will no longer smite all living things as I have done.
So G-d tells us as early as Genesis 4 that we ourselves can master sin and evil – that we ourselves must take responsibility and atone. Not only are we NOT born into “original sin”, there is no other person that can take the blame for your actions. You and you alone must atone for your sins.
Evil is not external to you – a devil or a taint. Evil is internal to you – it is part of who you are. Evil and good battle inside each of us and we have the power to choose good over evil. We are, with the aid of G-d, our own saviors.
What is sin? Sin is anything that moves you farther away from G-d. "
"There is no concept of equating sins (unintentional or intentional) with a fallen nature of man. The whole idea of a fallen man is pagan and NOT Jewish.
The story of Adam and Chava (Chava) shows the gulf between Xianity and Judaism. Chavan at this starting point the two faiths diverge greatly. Original sin is not a Jewish concept. People are not “born into sin” because of the fall of Adam and Chava (Chava). The serpent is not Satan – it is just a serpent.
Xianity NEEDS original sin. Xian theology holds that a sinless J* was part of the heavenly Father's plan from the outset, to redeem mankind. After all, the act of disobedience by Adam and Chava in the Garden of Eden, the Fall of Man, placed the stain of sin on humanity, one that cannot be removed through a person's own actions.
This opens the way for J*, the perfect sacrificial offering of the future, was born through the impregnation by the Holy Spirit of the virgin, Mary. J* was thus born without the stain of Original Sin, since he was conceived of G-d and not through the customary act of copulation by two sinful humans.
First of all: sex is not “sinful” it is a gift from G-d to “be fruitful and multiply.”
Secondly there is no original sin that makes all of mankind tainted so that a human sacrifice (or god-sacrifice) has to come along to redeem us. Man is not born “into” sin.
How do we know that the sin wasn’t that grievous (a fallen nature)?
Because of the Hebrew word used to describe the sin. In Hebrew there are many words for sin, but the big “three” are pasha (a rebellion against G-d), an ovom (a lustful act of passion) and a cheit – an unintentional “missing of the mark.”
Torah tells us that Adam and Chava committed a 'cheit'. A 'missing of the mark'. The word comes from an arrow that misses its target. The result may have ramifications, but the act was not done with malice aforethought.
Hardly the stuff “original sin” comes from.
Further we know that G-d didn't immediately punish Adam and Chava and bar them from the Tree of Life because they disobeyed and ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, but He gave them an opportunity to repent and tell Him the truth (after they had eaten and could recognize that it was wrong to disobey). Teshuva – repenting and turning to G-d.
But Adam and then Chava failed to do teshuvah but blamed someone else for their actions. Chava blamed the serpent. Adam blamed Chava. No one said “I’m sorry. I did wrong. Forgive me.”
So was the real sin the eating of the fruit, or the immature finger pointing and refusal to take responsibility that happened after they ate the fruit? The far greater sin is the second one. The whole point is that teshuvah is an essential part of Torah, and thus Torah gives us the opportunity to partake of eternal life (i.e, communion with G-d) Chavan when we sin – but we must take responsibility for our own actions.
Xians say G-d cursed Adam and Chava – to a horribly hard life and to death. This is because of their “fall from grace.” Man has a fallen nature in his soul because of Adam. But that is not what Torah says happened. G-d curses the serpent – not Adam and Chava!
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“Cursed are you”, arur atah, is not repeated, nor is a synonym used when G-d addresses Chava and Adam. Instead G-d says arurah ha'adamah, cursed is the earth/ground.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This speaks of the earth/ground that Adam will have to work - but G-d does ot curse Adam or Chava.
This major point is lost in the Xian concept.
G-d does not curse Adam and Chava!
Adam and Chava are punished, but they are not cursed. They are told that they will not be "on easy street" because of their transgression - she will have pain in childbirth, and he will have to sweat to earn his bread.
People are not born into sin.
People are born with an inclination to evil and may choose between good or evil. Again, this is clearly stated in Torah.
This is re-enforced in Genesis 4:7 when G-d speaks to Cain and tells him that good and evil are his choices and that he (Cain) should choose good. G-d tells Cain that he can master evil.
Ergo if Cain can CHOOSE, he isn’t “born evil” or “born into sin.”
Read the psalm 24 which speaks of man being given a pure heart. In Genesis we also find out that mankind has an "evil inclination" ("evil in their heart") from their youth, not from birth:
Genesis 8:21 - And the L-rd smelled the pleasant aroma, and the L-rd said to Himself, "I will no longer curse the earth because of man, for the inclination of man's heart is evil from his youth, and I will no longer smite all living things as I have done.
So G-d tells us as early as Genesis 4 that we ourselves can master sin and evil – that we ourselves must take responsibility and atone. Not only are we NOT born into “original sin”, there is no other person that can take the blame for your actions. You and you alone must atone for your sins.
Evil is not external to you – a devil or a taint. Evil is internal to you – it is part of who you are. Evil and good battle inside each of us and we have the power to choose good over evil. We are, with the aid of G-d, our own saviors.
What is sin? Sin is anything that moves you farther away from G-d. "
