Jordan Peterson

[Israel]

A man sets up his own discord in relationship to what he knows. If there be knowing...it is of God..."a man can receive nothing except it be given him from above"

A man cannot even "know" that he knows anything except that be given him...from above. Jesus says a curious thing (well, curious except that Jesus says it, and therefore means it)

These are Your words from a different thread. Are we culpable because we profess what we believe, given to us by God himself?

Are we culpable because we profess what we believe, given to us by God himself?

You ask the wrong one. It's not mine to decide or judge anyone's guilt.

Men bring out from themselves all that is in their heart. And God is judge.

We are both already on the altar plainly displaying what we have eaten; and bring and in this sharing, to be eaten. Our bowels are not hidden from His sight.

God alone is the righteous judge knowing all of what He has given. Even of what men may eat...and live. Of what men must eat...to live. In His sight, in and even under His terrible eye.

Our God is a consuming fire.

(BTW if by "us" and "we" in:

Are we culpable because we profess what we believe, given to us by God himself?

you mean 1gr8bldr and yourself...I have not heard him lay claim to his sharing as from "by God himself")

 

[Day trip]

You ask the wrong one. It's not mine to decide or judge anyone's guilt.

Men bring out from themselves all that is in their heart. And God is judge.

We are both already on the altar plainly displaying what we have eaten; and bring and in this sharing, to be eaten. Our bowels are not hidden from His sight.

God alone is the righteous judge knowing all of what He has given. Even of what men may eat...and live. Of what men must eat...to live. In His sight, in and even under His terrible eye.

Our God is a consuming fire.

(BTW if by "us" and "we" in:



you mean 1gr8bldr and yourself...I have not heard him lay claim to his sharing as from "by God himself")

I humbly apologize but your diction, its intended purpose, were I to purport that it had one of these, being challenging for myself to gain access to, perhaps lacks a certain clarity beneficial to the fundamental elements of communication, that in principle being to impart the reader with knowledge of your position on the matter.

St Paul said in 1 Corinthians 14:19- however, in the church I desire to speak five words with my mind so that I may instruct others also, rather than ten thousand words in a tongue.

Even though it may not be yours “to decide or judge anyone’s guilt”, you are indeed the one suggesting that their is guilt to be judged. Thank you, but can you help, can you reach down and give me a hand or will you just criticize me for not being able to jump out of this hole? Again, what would you have someone do? Walk around pretending? Lying? Hiding his shame over not being able to dissimulate as well as the other “believers”. Why can I not admit my faults in my attempt to overcome them?

 

[Day trip]

I don't know. Who thinks that? Your description of being in the spirit sounds like meditation. It sounds like something transcendent that can happen while playing music, working out, sleeping or being on psychedelics. I'm not so sure any of the modern descriptions of that experience are worthwhile. By modern, I mean as oral traditions.

I heard a Rumi quote from Deepak Chopra recently.

"The language of God is silence. Everything else is a poor translation."

Meditation is more like an old black and white TV, youre arranging the antennas and wrapping aluminum foil on them to get a signal. It trains the mind to be silent, to hear the whisper (1 Kings 19:12).
Connecting with the Spirit, I believe requires action. God gave his name to Moses as I AM. This is a verb, an action. I think yes, playing music, working out but not psychedelic drugs. Fortunately I have no experience with them so I wouldn’t be the one to ask.

But really connecting through the Spirit is about people. To refer back to the Bible, Jesus says, “Whereever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am in the middle.”
Playing music, meditating etc teaches us how to get out of our minds, but dealing with other living beings in truth and harmony is the pinnacle of spirituality. How many times has any of us really sat down with another with no preferences, no preconceived notions and dealt in truth while being vulnerable to wherever it may lead. These moments are true miracles!

That quote from Rumi is one of my favorites. It speaks about how hard it is to silence the mind and see truth only, acting and thinking without a bit of pride or spite. I just sent Israel a post that I was going to remove because it has a bit of vinegar in it. I decided to leave it because I hope to learn from it.

Thanks again, what do you think?

 

[hummerpoo]

...God gave his name to Moses as I AM. This is a verb, an action...

Would you give consideration to the thought that I AM does not describe and action, but a state of being.

 

[ambush80]

Meditation is more like an old black and white TV, youre arranging the antennas and wrapping aluminum foil on them to get a signal. It trains the mind to be silent, to hear the whisper (1 Kings 19:12).
Connecting with the Spirit, I believe requires action. God gave his name to Moses as I AM. This is a verb, an action. I think yes, playing music, working out but not psychedelic drugs. Fortunately I have no experience with them so I wouldn’t be the one to ask.

But really connecting through the Spirit is about people. To refer back to the Bible, Jesus says, “Whereever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am in the middle.”
Playing music, meditating etc teaches us how to get out of our minds, but dealing with other living beings in truth and harmony is the pinnacle of spirituality. How many times has any of us really sat down with another with no preferences, no preconceived notions and dealt in truth while being vulnerable to wherever it may lead. These moments are true miracles!

That quote from Rumi is one of my favorites. It speaks about how hard it is to silence the mind and see truth only, acting and thinking without a bit of pride or spite. I just sent Israel a post that I was going to remove because it has a bit of vinegar in it. I decided to leave it because I hope to learn from it.

Thanks again, what do you think?

I think that claiming a spirit like you describe is unfounded at this point in time.

 

[Day trip]

I think that claiming a spirit like you describe is unfounded at this point in time.

I can certainly see that. I can’t accurately describe an intuition or a feel. Like one born blind describing a sunset to another. The feel of focused warmness leaving your face, recognizing the somewhat regular nightly calming of the winds as evening approaches, the birds settling in and the whippoorwill starting his call, the smell of the grass standing out just a bit more than usual, you can tell something amazing is happening but any description will be majorly Lacking.

That’s why we have poetry, music and art.

 

[Day trip]

Would you give consideration to the thought that I AM does not describe and action, but a state of being.

Absolutely, what are your thought?

 

[ambush80]

I can certainly see that. I can’t accurately describe an intuition or a feel. Like one born blind describing a sunset to another. The feel of focused warmness leaving your face, recognizing the somewhat regular nightly calming of the winds as evening approaches, the birds settling in and the whippoorwill starting his call, the smell of the grass standing out just a bit more than usual, you can tell something amazing is happening but any description will be majorly Lacking.

That’s why we have poetry, music and art.

I don't get the impression that you would call something that you experience as a feeling a universal truth. I can't imagine that you would use your feeling about something to compel others toward as certain action.

 

[1gr8bldr]

Absolutely, what are your thought?

The use of "I Am" is in regards to who God is. This was the context when first used. It's like a blank check. The amount is whatever you write in. God was saying "I am" whom I will be. Like God "is". God being spirit "is" what he does. To much emphasis is put on this "I am". It was never intended to be because he tells us in the next verses what his name to be called is... Yahweh. This is his name to be remembered by for generation to generation.

 

[Israel]

I humbly apologize but your diction, its intended purpose, were I to purport that it had one of these, being challenging for myself to gain access to, perhaps lacks a certain clarity beneficial to the fundamental elements of communication, that in principle being to impart the reader with knowledge of your position on the matter.

St Paul said in 1 Corinthians 14:19- however, in the church I desire to speak five words with my mind so that I may instruct others also, rather than ten thousand words in a tongue.

Even though it may not be yours “to decide or judge anyone’s guilt”, you are indeed the one suggesting that their is guilt to be judged. Thank you, but can you help, can you reach down and give me a hand or will you just criticize me for not being able to jump out of this hole? Again, what would you have someone do? Walk around pretending? Lying? Hiding his shame over not being able to dissimulate as well as the other “believers”. Why can I not admit my faults in my attempt to overcome them?

Thank you, but can you help, can you reach down and give me a hand or will you just criticize me for not being able to jump out of this hole?

If you do know you are in a hole...the only one to help is the One raised out from it. But unless you believe Him, how could you possibly believe there is any to help?

Do you say you believe in God? Believe also in Him.

He is the resurrection. And the life.

 

[ambush80]

I humbly apologize but your diction, its intended purpose, were I to purport that it had one of these, being challenging for myself to gain access to, perhaps lacks a certain clarity beneficial to the fundamental elements of communication, that in principle being to impart the reader with knowledge of your position on the matter.

St Paul said in 1 Corinthians 14:19- however, in the church I desire to speak five words with my mind so that I may instruct others also, rather than ten thousand words in a tongue.

Even though it may not be yours “to decide or judge anyone’s guilt”, you are indeed the one suggesting that their is guilt to be judged. Thank you, but can you help, can you reach down and give me a hand or will you just criticize me for not being able to jump out of this hole? Again, what would you have someone do? Walk around pretending? Lying? Hiding his shame over not being able to dissimulate as well as the other “believers”. Why can I not admit my faults in my attempt to overcome them?

Isreal's goal doesn't seem to me to be discussion. It's more like art or something. The intent seems to be a product; a piece or event. You'll see.

 

[hummerpoo]

Absolutely, what are your thought?

I would have no idea how to condense it, since it really is quite foundational to most, if not all, that I believe. Not to mention that I am far to lazy to try to frame and explain it thoroughly within the limits of this format. However, there is a way out for both of us. The following are the first 3 links that came up when I googled "'I AM', bible". I may not agree with everything said, but if you read them, I think you will see where I am coming from, at least generally, when I said "state of Being".


https://www.desiringgod.org/messages/i-am-who-i-am

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_am_(biblical_term)

http://biblehub.com/exodus/3-14.htm
(you don't want to miss the "Exodus 3:14 Commentaries" link after the Matthew Henry Commentary).


Just a teaser from Gill's Commentary: "This signifies the real being of God, his self-existence, and that he is the Being of beings; as also it denotes his eternity and immutability, and his constancy and faithfulness in fulfilling his promises, for it includes all time, past, present, and to come; and the sense is, not only I am what I am at present, but I am what I have been, and I am what I shall be, and shall be what I am.

 

[1gr8bldr]

The use of "I Am" is in regards to who God is. This was the context when first used. It's like a blank check. The amount is whatever you write in. God was saying "I am" whom I will be. Like God "is". God being spirit "is" what he does. To much emphasis is put on this "I am". It was never intended to be because he tells us in the next verses what his name to be called is... Yahweh. This is his name to be remembered by for generation to generation.

To add to this... remember at this time they knew nothing of God. He told Moses, if they ask who sent him, to respond "I am" has sent me to you. It carried zero preconceived ideas, zero picture in their mind, zero in terms of definition. So keep in mind, that all that is said about this from the future, is working in hindsight. All the in depth, on and on commentaries, are shaping this based on future knowledge. There is a difference. "tell them I am has sent me to you" It is meant to be a blank check, that will be filled out, if you accept the check. Again, it's descriptive, not his name, Yahewh, is the name that he specifically said is his name to be remembered by

 

[Day trip]

To add to this... remember at this time they knew nothing of God. He told Moses, if they ask who sent him, to respond "I am" has sent me to you. It carried zero preconceived ideas, zero picture in their mind, zero in terms of definition. So keep in mind, that all that is said about this from the future, is working in hindsight. All the in depth, on and on commentaries, are shaping this based on future knowledge. There is a difference. "tell them I am has sent me to you" It is meant to be a blank check, that will be filled out, if you accept the check. Again, it's descriptive, not his name, Yahewh, is the name that he specifically said is his name to be remembered by

I’ve heard it said that the sound of inhaling and exhaling is
Yahweh. So at every breath, we recite the name of the Lord. Several meditation chants are based around this concept. Just FYI, get that stuck in your mind.

 

[Israel]

Isreal's goal doesn't seem to me be discussion. It's more like art or something. The intent seems to be a product; a piece or event. You'll see.

You're absolutely right.

 

[Day trip]

You're absolutely right.

So are you interested in growing, learning or helping others see? You are obviously a mystic but I again am sorry to say that I often can’t understand you. Regardless, I do enjoy you.

 

[ambush80]

So are you interested in growing, learning or helping others see? You are obviously a mystic but I again am sorry to say that I often can’t understand you. Regardless, I do enjoy you.

I like his art sometimes, too. And mystic is exactly the right word. I've been trying to come up with a word for what Isreal does for years.

 

[WaltL1]

So are you interested in growing, learning or helping others see? You are obviously a mystic but I again am sorry to say that I often can’t understand you. Regardless, I do enjoy you.

First -
Israel I know you will read this so I feel comfortable that I am not "talking behind your back"......
Israel often loses me and I struggle to get the point sometimes however I also have been able to pick out some individual "gems" that are very thought provoking to me even if the overall point eludes me.
I appreciate his participation here even though I sometimes get a headache trying to figure out what the heck he's talking about

 

[Israel]

But Er, Judah's firstborn, was evil in the sight of the LORD, so the LORD took his life. Then Judah said to Onan, "Go in to your brother's wife, and perform your duty as a brother-in-law to her, and raise up offspring for your brother." Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brother's wife, he wasted his seed on the ground in order not to give offspring to his brother.
But what he did was displeasing in the sight of the LORD; so He took his life also...


For there are some eunuchs, who were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, who were made eunuchs of men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I have known the many pleasures of intercourse, but the responsibility they engender is made plain to me I cannot bear.

Being an aging and impotent man is far more preferable to receive, and safe...(though I can blame non for despising it) than bearing responsibility for misbegotten children.

But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

I am completely impotent before this judgment.

You all help me.
See.

 

[ambush80]

But Er, Judah's firstborn, was evil in the sight of the LORD, so the LORD took his life. Then Judah said to Onan, "Go in to your brother's wife, and perform your duty as a brother-in-law to her, and raise up offspring for your brother." Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brother's wife, he wasted his seed on the ground in order not to give offspring to his brother.
But what he did was displeasing in the sight of the LORD; so He took his life also...


For there are some eunuchs, who were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, who were made eunuchs of men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I have known the many pleasures of intercourse, but the responsibility they engender is made plain to me I cannot bear.

Being an aging and impotent man is far more preferable to receive, and safe...(though I can blame non for despising it) than bearing responsibility for misbegotten children.

But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

I am completely impotent before this judgment.

You all help me.
See.