New to reloading and have some questions…

[Jester896]

I think Hunter is between IMR4350 and IMR4831...kinda splits them

generally speaking the slower powders will give you more velocity in the longer barrels with magnum loads...

search for a burn rate comparison chart and print it...it may help you.

 

[Darkhorse]

I might eat my words one day, but I have never used a Large Magnum Rifle primer. I have loaded for both 7mag and 300 WM and never had the 1st problem using standard Winchester primers. In fact, the 7mag is my most accurate gun 154 SST, RL22 and Win large rifle primers.

Rosewood

Rosewood, I started loading the 7mm Rem. Mag. in about 1979, the .300 a decade or so later, and in all that time I have never loaded standard primers in either one. So I don't know about the accuracy or problems I might encounter loading with regular primers.
I do know this, when I load my hunting rounds, especially those intended for a out of state hunt, like elk, I would only use magnum primers. And all my load workup for that hunt would get the magnum primers also. I won't take the chance that a regular primer might give me slow or uneven ignition. But I don't really see a problem with using regular primers for general shooting. I guess that's up to the shooter.
I agree about the 7mm accuracy. Mine might be the most accurate rifle I own as I've gotten some groups .500", and maybe a little under. However I've gotten the same size groups with more under .500" with my .300. The difference is that I've got an adjustable brake on the .300 and I can tune it a little tighter.

 

[MtnBear]

Pardon the kiddo clutter in the background. But I wanted to share…

This is the 150g Barnes ttsx bt right next to the 165g Sierra Game King hpbt, and next to it is a 168g Sierra Match King sbt.

This 150g Barnes bullet is a lot taller then I expected. It’s as near as doesn’t matter the same length as the 165g gk hpbt.

Pretty cool.

 

[Jester896]

we told you the solids had a longer bearing surface or the bullet was longer to get the weight of the standards since the material was lighter

 

[MtnBear]

we told you the solids had a longer bearing surface or the bullet was longer to get the weight of the standards since the material was lighter

Yeah, but now I have context. I mean I know what a 150g cooper jacketed lead bullet looks like. But because I’ve never looked at any factory loads with the Barnes in’em I just wasn’t expecting it to be so much taller.

Now I know to ask you, @Jester896 for some context to go with all that wisdom ???

 

[MtnBear]

I think Hunter is between IMR4350 and IMR4831...kinda splits them

generally speaking the slower powders will give you more velocity in the longer barrels with magnum loads...

search for a burn rate comparison chart and print it...it may help you.

So given that this burns a little faster when compared to IMR4831 why does hunter drive the 150g Barnes at a faster velocity?

 

[BriarPatch99]

Ramshot Hunter(#133) is between IMR 4831(#132) and H4831(#137) ...

As far as bullet Weight/length ....it is length that is the determination as to what twist it takes ....

All copper bullets like Barnes TTSX are longer than Comparable lead core bullets ....

The Barnes 150 grain TTSX is 1.283" average .... which is longer than a 168 grain MatchKing at 1.215" average... .308 caliber

 

[MtnBear]

Ramshot Hunter(#133) is between IMR 4831(#132) and H4831(#137) ...

As far as bullet Weight/length ....it is length that is the determination as to what twist it takes ....

All copper bullets like Barnes TTSX are longer than Comparable lead core bullets ....

The Barnes 150 grain TTSX is 1.283" average .... which is longer than a 168 grain MatchKing at 1.215" average... .308 caliber

So something I’ve been pondering… This Barnes 150g bullet is, if I understand correctly, less dense than the 165g equivalent cooper jackets, but hits harder. So how does this 150g bullet deliver similar stopping power to a 180g traditional jacketed bullet as some have claimed? To be clear I do not doubt that they stop game dead in their tracks I’m just looking for the physics behind it all… or for someone to tell me why this question and the inherent lack of understanding behind it are off base…

??

 

[BriarPatch99]

So something I’ve been pondering… This Barnes 150g bullet is, if I understand correctly, less dense than the 165g equivalent cooper jackets, but hits harder. So how does this 150g bullet deliver similar stopping power to a 180g traditional jacketed bullet as some have claimed? To be clear I do not doubt that they stop game dead in their tracks I’m just looking for the physics behind it all… or for someone to tell me why this question and the inherent lack of understanding behind it are off base…

??

Bullet design .... and it ain't really "hitting" harder but the damage that the lighter bullet and design combo allows it to do ... Barnes bullets need speed to operate correctly.

Internal damage ...is key ...the bullet has to get to the vitals ....do the damage(killing the animal) .... some like the bullet to exit leaving a hole for blood to escape for tracking if the bullet does not give a DRT(Dead Right There) kill ...

 

[MtnBear]

Bullet design .... and it ain't really "hitting" harder but the damage that the lighter bullet and design combo allows it to do ... Barnes bullets need speed to operate correctly.

Internal damage ...is key ...the bullet has to get to the vitals ....do the damage(killing the animal) .... some like the bullet to exit leaving a hole for blood to escape for tracking if the bullet does not give a DRT(Dead Right There) kill ...

Ideally the animal will just drop. In your opinion how fast does the 150g Barnes ttsx need to fly to be drop’er in er tracks deadly?

 

[BriarPatch99]

Ideally the animal will just drop. In your opinion how fast does the 150g Barnes ttsx need to fly to be drop’er in er tracks deadly?

Ideally out of the .300 Winchester Magnum .... 3300 fps muzzle velocity .... and in my opinion the lower impact velocity at 2200 fps .....even though Barnes will say their bullets will expand at lower velocity .... I question how much expansion ....I think the full petal extension is better than "some" expansion...

 

[MtnBear]

Ideally out of the .300 Winchester Magnum .... 3300 fps muzzle velocity .... and in my opinion the lower impact velocity at 2200 fps .....even though Barnes will say their bullets will expand at lower velocity .... I question how much expansion ....I think the full petal extension is better than "some" expansion...

So max load w/ Ramshot hunter. What happens around 3,000fps?

 

[BriarPatch99]

So max load w/ Ramshot hunter. What happens around 3,000fps?

If you hit a deer in the correct spot ...you kill it ....

You getting your cart ahead the horse ... You need to really slow down and process all the "information" the others and myself have shared ... there is no magical gun, bullet, powder that wipes everything every other gun off the earth ....

First you said you a new reloader .... You need start out ...figure out the process ...before you start jumping to max loads .... there is learning curve that if you by pass that process .... you are trending in dangerous places ...

 

[MtnBear]

If you hit a deer in the correct spot ...you kill it ....

You getting your cart ahead the horse ... You need to really slow down and process all the "information" the others and myself have shared ... there is no magical gun, bullet, powder that wipes everything every other gun off the earth ....

First you said you a new reloader .... You need start out ...figure out the process ...before you start jumping to max loads .... there is learning curve that if you by pass that process .... you are trending in dangerous places ...

Assuming I am safe, responsible and a reasonable individual… Im asking because I’d rather have a guide to better understand where I am headed instead of having to blaze the trail alone. My view is I start at the finish line and work my way back. As the saying goes, aim away from failure. My problem is I don’t know what failure looks like and if I can learn from your success I want to.

I respect your warning but I’m here to absorb as much information as I can. I apologize if this is off putting or rude.

 

[BriarPatch99]

Assuming I am safe, responsible and a reasonable individual… Im asking because I’d rather have a guide to better understand where I am headed instead of having to blaze the trail alone. My view is I start at the finish line and work my way back. As the saying goes, aim away from failure. My problem is I don’t know what failure looks like and if I can learn from your success I want to.

I respect your warning but I’m here to absorb as much information as I can. I apologize if this is off putting or rude.

You are good .... I was trying to get you to "absorb" ..before you moved on too fast ....

I have 55 years loading experience .... you just can't pack that into a few questions and answers .... there was no internet around back then to get instant answers to questions .... most these fellows answering your questions have been at it a long time also....

Your question about the "3000 fps" verses the "3300 fps" says you are not really thinking this though .... and you are not the first reloader to ask these questions ...

Trust me ...You don't want to know What "failure" looks when reloading ....it can mean your eyes... your ears ....even your life .... or someone elses.

Please slow down ...ask your questions ...but make sure you are really understanding the answers ...

 

[MtnBear]

You are good .... I was trying to get you to "absorb" ..before you moved on too fast ....

I have 55 years loading experience .... you just can't pack that into a few questions and answers .... there was no internet around back then to get instant answers to questions .... most these fellows answering your questions have been at it a long time also....

Your question about the "3000 fps" verses the "3300 fps" says you are not really thinking this though .... and you are not the first reloader to ask these questions ...

Trust me ...You don't want to know What "failure" looks when reloading ....it can mean your eyes... your ears ....even your life .... or someone elses.

Please slow down ...ask your questions ...but make sure you are really understanding the answers ...

All the above is why I’m asking. Thank you for sharing your knowledge.

 

[bullethead]

Ideally the animal will just drop. In your opinion how fast does the 150g Barnes ttsx need to fly to be drop’er in er tracks deadly?

Nothing, regarding wild animals that have incredible wills to live, is set in stone by merely shooting the animal with a bullet.
1a. You need to use a bullet designed to do what is needed to be done.
1a. Placing that bullet in the precise spot in order to do its job.
The above are of equal importance. Both must happen.

Shots to the brain, spine and some heavy bone drop animals on the spot DRT. Shots close to the Central Nervous System drop animals more often than not.
A bullet through the heart and or lungs will drop deer on occasion and at times despite tremendous damage another deer may act as if it wasn't hit only to walk or run a bit and fall over dead.

Point being unless brain, spine, or central nervous system are hit there is no bullet that guarantees DRT performance when placed anywhere else.

 

[rosewood]

We are also saying "DRT". However I think we should really say instance incapacitation. A deer may drop and not be able to run, but not be dead also. I have hit at least 2 over the years in the spine that couldn't go anywhere, but had to be finished off.

Rosewood

 

[bullethead]

We are also saying "DRT". However I think we should really say instance incapacitation. A deer may drop and not be able to run, but not be dead also. I have hit at least 2 over the years in the spine that couldn't go anywhere, but had to be finished off.

Rosewood

You have causd me to re-define DRT to mean Down Right There.

 

[Nimrod71]

We are all glad to help you with your questions, but I think Briar has picked up on a point here. Mtn you are getting too much advanced loading information.

Have you read any reloading manuals? If not, this is the first step in starting in your reloading life. Most reloading manuals will answer most of the questions you have ask. All bullet manufacturers produce their own loading manuals listing loads for their products. Lyman to me is one of the best starter manuals.

If you have the ability to print the post from here it maybe helpful to divide them into chapters for your own reloading info book. A note to remember is always check the proper reloading manual before using any load data you get from an internet post. I have two friends that blow rifles up by errors and both were experienced reloaders. One lost and eye and scares on his face the other lost and eye and part of his nose.

Reloading is a dangerous process and we that have been doing it for decades have developed our own policies and procedures that we follow to prevent errors. From what you have stated you are asking our help, with good reason, to help you and we will, but you must do your own work and as with everything else in life you must start at the bottom and work up. You must develop your own reloading program that fits your own life style and environment.

I don't mean for this to sound as a wet blanket on your questions, I just don't want you to get in trouble, and I have seen it happen a number of times when someone used information and data they were not familiar with.

Mtn, please keep asking your questions, it makes us feel good for someone to ask for our knowledge on reloading.