To those who dont beleive

[Bird Slayer]

Geez, sounds like your God has less emotional maturity than most middle school girls.

So you are telling me if you are taking a bunch of kids on a trip somewhere (the fair for example). You make it clear that all the ones that behave will get rewarded with a piece of candy and give a fair warning that whoever misbehaves will get a spanking. All of the kids are being well behaved and following you except for 1 or 2 that you have to get on to and tell over and over again to behave and do as you say. Well at the end of the day and its time to leave you haave had enough. You give all the ones who behave their candy but instead of punishing the ones who didnt obey you you give them a smaller piece of candy.

Same concept. Heaven is the candy...he11 is the spanking.

 

[ambush80]

So you are telling me if you are taking a bunch of kids on a trip somewhere (the fair for example). You make it clear that all the ones that behave will get rewarded with a piece of candy and give a fair warning that whoever misbehaves will get a spanking. All of the kids are being well behaved and following you except for 1 or 2 that you have to get on to and tell over and over again to behave and do as you say. Well at the end of the day and its time to leave you haave had enough. You give all the ones who behave their candy but instead of punishing the ones who didnt obey you you give them a smaller piece of candy.

Same concept. Heaven is the candy...he11 is the spanking.

Maybe you should burn them in a pit of fire for eternity.

Honestly, who deserves THAT kind of "spanking"? Ghandi? Buddah? Hardly an appropriate punishment and for what crime? Why, it sounds downright evil.

 

[stringmusic]

He11 is complete separation from God, that is the main consequence to not accepting a relationship with God on this earth. Everyone is giving he11 a real humanistic torture method.

 

[Bird Slayer]

Say you or achillies, hamster boy, JFS, pnome or any of you other "atheists" had the power to give your son as the ultimate sacrifice for all man kind and all you asked is that they believe; believe the miracles he performed and miracles performed by the power given in his name. What would you do? How would you feel?

Take in mind you give your only son and he is taken, and at the command of his own people, is beaten far worse than any movie can ever depict and is murdered for no other reason than he wanted people to believe in you and still does.

You would do the same exact thing without any remorse and being that you would react in the flesh you would never give anyone else a chance to believe in him or you. In your mind you couldnt create a he!! hot enough.

You are only atheist because God allows you to have the free will to choose. If not, there would be no atheist because no one would be trying to prove God doesnt exist.

I completely agree. You "atheists" get mad when we try to talk to you about God and Christianity. Lord knows what you would do if you were in Gods shoes and gave your only son to die for people who wouldnt care and would turn their backs on you.

 

[ambush80]

Say you or achillies, hamster boy, JFS, pnome or any of you other "atheists" had the power to give your son as the ultimate sacrifice for all man kind and all you asked is that they believe; believe the miracles he performed and miracles performed by the power given in his name. What would you do? How would you feel?

Take in mind you give your only son and he is taken, and at the command of his own people, is beaten far worse than any movie can ever depict and is murdered for no other reason than he wanted people to believe in you and still does.

You would do the same exact thing without any remorse and being that you would react in the flesh you would never give anyone else a chance to believe in him or you. In your mind you couldnt create a he!! hot enough.

You are only atheist because God allows you to have the free will to choose. If not, there would be no atheist because no one would be trying to prove God doesnt exist.

I completely agree. You "atheists" get mad when we try to talk to you about God and Christianity. Lord knows what you would do if you were in Gods shoes and gave your only son to die for people who wouldnt care and would turn their backs on you.

Frankly, I do think I could do a far better and MORE JUST job than the God described by the Bible. First I'd scrap that notion of human sacrifice. It's so......primitive. Sounds like something desert herdsman would come up with.

 

[1handkneehigh]

Say you or achillies, hamster boy, JFS, pnome or any of you other "atheists" had the power to give your son as the ultimate sacrifice for all man kind and all you asked is that they believe; believe the miracles he performed and miracles performed by the power given in his name. What would you do? How would you feel?

Take in mind you give your only son and he is taken, and at the command of his own people, is beaten far worse than any movie can ever depict and is murdered for no other reason than he wanted people to believe in you and still does.

You would do the same exact thing without any remorse and being that you would react in the flesh you would never give anyone else a chance to believe in him or you. In your mind you couldnt create a he!! hot enough.

You are only atheist because God allows you to have the free will to choose. If not, there would be no atheist because no one would be trying to prove God doesnt exist.

If I am god I would definitely not be sending my ONLY ONLY SON to die. My dog would have the same power to safe mankind and can do the same things as jesus would. If you can send your labrador retriever why in the world would you send you only son?

 

[ambush80]

God didnt sacrifice His son. Jesus was murdered at the command of his own people. God turned his back and allowed it to happen just like he allows many other things to happen on this earth. Its free will and that same thing is what allows you to have your opinion.

If I am god I would definitely not be sending my ONLY ONLY SON to die. My dog would have the same power to safe mankind and can do the same things as jesus would. If you can send your labrador retriever why in the world would you send you only son?

Or skip the whole thing. There are better ways to make a point.

 

[JFS]

God didnt sacrifice His son. Jesus was murdered at the command of his own people. God turned his back and allowed it to happen just like he allows many other things to happen on this earth. Its free will and that same thing is what allows you to have your opinion.

So if people are saved due to the sacrifice, what would have happened without it? If people didn't kill Jesus, who would be saved?

Frankly the whole thing is just a tiresome echo of an ancient Jewish fetish for sacrifice. An omnipotent God can redeem whoever he wants, period. No just god condemns anyone for a failure to irrationally pick the right spooky stories.

 

[Buckhustler]

God didnt sacrifice His son. Jesus was murdered at the command of his own people. God turned his back and allowed it to happen just like he allows many other things to happen on this earth. Its free will and that same thing is what allows you to have your opinion.

How do you know this?

 

[Buckhustler]

How do you not?

Is that just some theory you have or do you have something like the bible to prove it?

 

[Buckhustler]

What verse?

 

[JFS]

Can you explain what would have happened if Jesus wasn't killed and just died of natural causes?

 

[Buckhustler]

Dont know... It wasnt part of gods plan.

 

[Oak-flat Hunter]

Dogma.! Dogma.! Dogma.!!!!!!!!

 

[Achilles Return]

How do you not?

Because you're making it up.

 

[Achilles Return]

Prove it!
And dont come back with some lame "You prove it". It is well documented throughout history in books written by over fourty authors that all refer to historical fact that has been proved that in fact God does exist.

You ,and many like you, feel you are more intellectually developed and feel you need no reason to acknowledge that God does exist because you dont want to answer for what you do in this life. Well I have bad news for you, you do have to answer. You have to answer to God, and he is angry. Angry at a world the continually denies Him, and He will judge me and you and every other soul that has and will walk the face of this earth. You are just one of many that will learn the hard way and will sorely wish you had heeded the gospel that I know you have read several times on this forum.

You really don't know how this logic thing works, do you? Do you know what proof is? Evidence? Your god has none of these. Did you honestly expect the mythical writings of a nomadic tribe from the middle east to be considered a such? Their contemporaries thought various gods controlled the weather, the ocean, the sun. That's the kind of societal intellect we're trusting with our 'after-lives'? haha, alright.

And did you mean historical facts like a 'world-wide flood'? The slavery of the Israelites in Egypt? The creation story? None of these things have any sort of historical evidence. In fact, our knowledge of the world through science and rational inquiry suggest that they didn't happen. Saying "God's existence is a historical fact and proven" is either absolute ignorance of the world or willfully lying.

The fact of the matter about 'proof' is this: We are born without the knowledge of anything. We call it 'tabula rasa', and it basically tells us that what knowledge we do gain is from our experience and sensory inputs. This also means we are born without beliefs. Like it or not, humans are born atheist, only to later become religious by the method of their upbringing. Since the state of disbelief is the default position, it is on the burden of the believers to prove their position. I am an atheist because I have absolutely no reason not to be. Every religious institution I've examined was absolutely unsatisfying to objectivity or irrational, and christianity was absolutely no exception. I personally maintain that the christian deity is paradoxical beyond something like deism or buddhism, so I have no trouble saying that the modern christian god doesn't exist.

The idea of me trying to 'escape' morality is nothing more than a pathetic cop-out. It's you trying to assert moral superiority so you can tell yourself that since I'm an arrogant immoral heathen, it necessitates that you haveto be right. The truth is, and I know you know this - Christians are absolutely no different than anyone else out there. You guys are supposed 'little-christs', and yet there's nothing significantly unique about the morality of christians. You guys lie, kill, cheat just as much as the rest of humanity. I know the response to this is that humans are human and they still sin, christian or not. But you think that the followers of the 'correct' god would be at least a smidgen more moral than the rest of society. You aren't.

So please, don't come at me and tell me I'm trying to get out of any sort of moral judgement. If there happens to be a deity that judges morality of my life after I die, I think I'll do alright. If there is a god that says he judges morality but judges 'belief' instead, well that's a cosmic game of dice that I was destined to fail anyways. And I'm not one to gamble - it goes against my ethics.

 

[Achilles Return]

Well, up until I believe the book of Acts, salvation through Jesus was only for the Jews. Not someone practicing the Jewish faith but blood born Jews. Long story short, the word was repeatedly refused and many gentiles professed faith but were unable to receive. God then granted that salvation to ALL who will believe.

As far as Jesus living to a ripe old age and dying, only one knows that and there is only one way to ask.

Thanks for pointing another example of why christianity is absolutely and positively immoral.

 

[Bird Slayer]

And I'm not one to gamble - it goes against my ethics.

Wait...whats that...

You arent one to gamble but you are willing to take a chance of burning for eternity. Sounds like a gambling man to me? hmmm.

 

[ambush80]

Wait...whats that...

You arent one to gamble but you are willing to take a chance of burning for eternity. Sounds like a gambling man to me? hmmm.

You're gambling that The Muslims aren't right. Or that the Buddhists or Wiccans aren't right. You pays your money, you places your bet. I'll put my money on "something that makes more sense".

 

[Achilles Return]

Long drawn out nothingness again. Thanks for wasting my time achilles.

And your inability to respond to any of my points speaks to the validity of your arguments. Thanks for trying. Better luck next time.