Purchasing Land

[Hawken2222]

I am looking at a small tract of land to purchase for hunting. I have walked the land twice and I really like. On one side of it, it is not marked well at all and it’s hard to tell the where the property line is at on that side. The other boundaries were easy to to determine. So the only area I really am unsure about boundary wise is the one side of it. My question is should I get a survey before making an offer? I have asked the sellers real estate agent if there is an existing survey and he said he would check on it. In the mean time I thought I would post here and get advice. Also if the seller does have a survey, is there anyway to follow up on that to insure it’s accurate? I am told that a survey of a tract this size could run 3-5 grand? I would hate to drop that much money on the survey and have something fall through on the deal.
I hope these aren’t dumb questions I am asking. It’s just that this is my first time buying raw land and with it being such a big purchase I want to have my ducks in a row.
Thanks in advance guys for any feedback.

 

[Dutch]

Yes. Getting a survey before buying will ensure no boundary headaches down the road.

When I had my property surveyed before buying, turned out the guy next to me had about 30 feet into the property fenced. He was not happy when he had to move it.

 

[Stumpsitter]

The seller most often has to produce a survey. Financial institutions will want one if you're borrowing money.

 

[Horns]

Seller should have the survey done. Try looking at Qpublic and see if you can find the tract

 

[westcobbdog]

No, don't spend the $$ BEFORE you go in contract, instead have either: A. a survey done inside your Due Diligence widow or B. Have a stip that stipulates the survey resolution period is not connected to your "free look" period and however much time it takes to complete a survey well that's how much is needed.
Also, don't assume the boundries! Those portions of the land that appear to be well defined may actually be a different persons land. I see this plenty.
Be sure and get quotes for more than 1 surveyor. I see some crazy variations in prices for the same thing. Also, be very specific what you want, just the boundries marked or more info like topo, title, ect
Keep in mind a survey can come in many forms, from a basic boundry line survey to a full blown Alta survey showing title, including easements and stuff running with or across the land, like a power line, ect.
If possible get an experienced land agent to draft contract for you and be in your corner, if its listed property that's free to you.
Don't let your earnest money go hard without being assured its the right tract for you, which translates to a 30 day due diligence period most likely.
Much more to the process...especially what can go wrong, so be double sure and purchase Owners Title Ins, too, buy it at closing.

 

[ucfireman]

Title insurance for sure, also have a stipulation for "natural resources" ie timber gas minerals etc.
Get the survey, have it written into the contract for the "price per ac per the survey" or full tract price dependent on the survey lines meeting your expectations.
The good thing about a "contact" is you can ask for anything as long as the other party agrees.
Also If its a large tract I would have them drop a pin with tape every 50-75 ft as they are surveying the lines (flags on trees disappear) and have a larger pipe anywhere there is a big change in direction.

You could even ask for half the survey costs by the seller or all closing costs minus the title insurance.
Just be sure of what you are buying, don't assume anything. If its not in writing it isn't agreed to. A mans word is not what it once was.
Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[Stumpsitter]

I agree with fireman, if it's not in writing you don't have a leg to stand on if a problem arises.

 

[livetohunt]

First thing you may want to do is have an agent represent you. It will cost you nothing(seller pays) since the seller already has an agent, and they will answer all your questions and represent you during the process. Right now no one represents you and their are a lot of pitfalls unless you are versed in buying land..I have bought a couple of farms with no agent but used someone to answer my questions that I paid out of my pocket. These sales were because the seller lowered the price so he didn't have to use an agent and pay them a fee.

 

[nmurph]

The seller most often has to produce a survey. Financial institutions will want one if you're borrowing money.

Not correct if it's in Ga.

Virtually every property has a survey at the courthouse. The quality of those surveys can be questionable if they are old. Newer surveys are usually pretty good. The rubber meets the road when it comes to finding the pins.

Deeds are prepared and reference the survey on file. The lender will have lenders title insurance and are pretty much covered if there's an issue boundary issue should they foreclose.

If there are questions about boundries, who pays for the survey can be a part of the negotiations. Generally I recommend a seller procures the survey so that should a sale fall through, they own the survey and can use it as a negotiating tool in future sales. Paying for the survey can usually be handled at the closing so the seller doesn't have to come up with money out of pocket if that's an issue.

Are you working with an agent?

 

[roscoe54]

The county your looking buying the property go to there Tax Assessor web page you can pull up the property. You can get a aerial of the property they have tools to measure the property you will get a general idea how many acres it is. I would call them they might know when the last survey was done. Good luck.

 

[Timberman]

Nearly every property line can be located by on the ground signs. Pins, rocks, tractor axles, hacks on trees, old fence, there’s something there. Get a compass and description and go find it.

When I was in the biz of buying land I never surveyed to buy only afterwards if I was subdividing. Too expensive.

Keep in mind these were rural tracts. YMMV

 

[Triple C]

Nearly every property line can be located by on the ground signs. Pins, rocks, tractor axles, hacks on trees, old fence, there’s something there. Get a compass and description and go find it.

When I was in the biz of buying land I never surveyed to buy only afterwards if I was subdividing. Too expensive.

Keep in mind these were rural tracts. YMMV

I'm of the same opinion as Timberman. Your closing attorney should be able to tell you if there is a legitimate risk or concern with the survey on file. Pick your real estate attorney wisely and let him or her advise as to whether you need to be concerned with a new survey.

 

[huntersluck]

The county your looking buying the property go to there Tax Assessor web page you can pull up the property. You can get a aerial of the property they have tools to measure the property you will get a general idea how many acres it is. I would call them they might know when the last survey was done. Good luck.

I have found the aerial maps on the tax assessor sites to be highly inaccurate in some cases to the actual lines.

 

[roscoe54]

I agree their not always accurate unless you have roads as a boundary. It's a guide on the outline of the property. Of the 5 property's I purchased only one was off. Survey is the only way for accurate reading. I just bought 84 acres the lawyer that help me look up the property on the Tax Assessor web inform me it had a survey in 2001 saved me a lot of money.

 

[ShortMagFan]

My 331 acre purchase turned into 353 acres because I as the buyer had a proper survey done to resolve a property line dispute before I closed. The county tax maps are still wrong nearly 10 years later

 

[Rich M]

When YOU have it surveyed as part of the purchase, make sure to ask them to mark the boundaries on all 4 sides. It will cost a little more but will come in real handy when the surveyors "only find the 4 corner pins" and skip doing a cut trail on one side. Happened to me.

Then, if I was you - make sure you do something to mark the boundary that can not be messed with - maybe a mowed trail, firebreak, fence, something where the neighbor/local hunter has to physically cross to enter.

 

[300 Mag]

Let me give you a real life example of my situation last spring. After 3 years of negotiations and multiple times having the deal fall apart, I was one day away from closing on 75 acres. To provide a little more color, it was a purchase from a family member and the land had been in my family for well over 100 years. My father killed his first buck on this property 50 years ago. So the tract and the boundaries were known. Albeit, the tract was what remained of a much larger farm that had been subdivided multiple times over the years. All boundaries that were recorded/reflected on the tax maps were exactly as I had known them to be all my life, 46 years old to be exact. I had a friend stop by to cruise the timber and rather than getting a call telling me what the timber value was, I was greeted with bad news that the tract was not 75 acres but rather 62 acres.

In a mad scramble, I postponed the close, spoke with several surveyors and they all viewed the tract and due to time constraints, attested to the approximate acreage based on GPS. The owner (family member) would not budge on the price in spite of it being 17% smaller. To say I was frustrated is an understatement. In the end, I pulled my offer.

Fast forward to September, the owners (family) reached out to me to see if I was still interested. Because of my high level of confidence in my friends knowledge that had alerted me to the acreage issue, along with the surveyors that I spoke with and using online acreage mapping tools, I made what I considered my best and final offer. While I did not want to throw away three years worth of effort, I dropped my offer price 25% and said take it or leave it.

Two weeks later, I closed on the farm and purchased it in conveyance of the tract and not by the acre. I still have to get a survey done so that I can get the tax records straight, but, given the recent pandemic, the extra $3K is not in the budget this year.

The moral of the story is, do not trust the seller to know the exact acreage or believe the tax records are correct either. The only way to know is with a survey.

 

[4HAND]

I wouldn't buy any piece of property without a fairly recent survey & title insurance.

 

[Buck70]

Exactly that, 4HAND

 

[Hawken2222]

Guys, I sure appreciate all of the information and advice. I am going to get a realtor and go from there.