A great example....

[bullethead]

A person saying that organized religion is bad because of certain people is bad logic, just like saying that all atheists have no morals is bad logic.

There are many examples throughout THOUSANDS of years of atrocities and bad acts being done due to the practices of Organized Religion. The people involved were/are an accepted member of an Organized Religious sect and in a position of power within that Organization where they are able to makes decisions which involve and effect other members and non members of that Organization.
You are taking an example of a specific instance where Organized Religion is responsible for the case at hand and then trying to paint another example with a wide brush in order to make it fit.
There are thieves in religion as well as non religion. That cancels each other out.
In this case you have an autistic boy being denied by the "rules" of a man who is a representative of a specific denomination of an organized religion. Not due to a set of individual beliefs or non beliefs tied to no organization.

If you could have somehow used a similar situation where an autistic person was denied something by an ORGANIZED atheist group, then you would have connected some dots.

 

[j_seph]

The right that his denomination gives him as according to their rules.

Name the denominations/religions that dont have "middle men/man".
And you are kind of making my point for me -
All this man made "stuff" between God and the people.
That man made "stuff" is..... organized religion (in my view). Which is comprised of all the different opinions of men.

Our baptist church does not have a middle man. Unless maybe you would call the pastor and preachers that preach a middle man. However the bible tells of preachers and men who carry Gods word. Now as far as a middle man we answer to, only one I would call that would be the one that sits at the right hand of the father.

 

[Spotlite]

There are many examples throughout THOUSANDS of years of atrocities and bad acts being done due to the practices of Organized Religion. The people involved were/are an accepted member of an Organized Religious sect and in a position of power within that Organization where they are able to makes decisions which involve and effect other members and non members of that Organization.
You are taking an example of a specific instance where Organized Religion is responsible for the case at hand and then trying to paint another example with a wide brush in order to make it fit.
There are thieves in religion as well as non religion. That cancels each other out.
In this case you have an autistic boy being denied by the "rules" of a man who is a representative of a specific denomination of an organized religion. Not due to a set of individual beliefs or non beliefs tied to no organization.

If you could have somehow used a similar situation where an autistic person was denied something by an ORGANIZED atheist group, then you would have connected some dots.

You don’t cancel each other out because both make bad choices, you still have two bad choices. You just got bad apples in every basket, it’s called life. There’s some not so great atheists / agnostics / non believers out there doing all kinds of things in the name of hate - do they represent all of y’all? Does it make the whole group bad?

 

[bullethead]

You don’t cancel each other out because both make bad choices, you still have two bad choices. You just got bad apples in every basket, it’s called life. There’s some not so great atheists / agnostics / non believers out there doing all kinds of things in the name of hate - do they represent all of y’all? Does it make the whole group bad?

Point out to me the part where I missed you giving examples of those Atheists, Agnostics and non believers being part of an ORGANIZED institution.
String and you are totally bypassing the ORGANIZED part of religion in favor of making extremely broad comparisons between things that are not comparable.

The specific topic at hand is Organized . It is a specific religion, a specific denomination, a specific church, a specific clergy which are all linked in an Organized fashion. THAT is what we are talking about here.
Not, guy with hair chokes baby, therefore all guys with hair are bad.
That is not what we are saying here.
History is full of examples of bad, wrong, immoral, horrible, atrocious etc etc things that were the result of having Organized Religion involved. The Organized part of religion, meaning the chain of command, the written rules, the unwritten rules, the do as I say not as I do, the appointing of an individual and individuals who represent THE Organization is what we are talking about here. Those people make the rules and decisions that followers adhere to. It is Organized!!! Therefore linked. Therefore together.
If the religious want to argue that 40,000 different denominations all lead to one God then it is not a stretch to include the bad with the good. That priest, father, padre IS part of the entire Organization and also a representative.

If I am wrong, show me what Organized club I belong to merely for my own thoughts. Surely you can see the difference I am pointing out here.

 

[Spotlite]

Point out to me the part where I missed you giving examples of those Atheists, Agnostics and non believers being part of an ORGANIZED institution.
String and you are totally bypassing the ORGANIZED part of religion in favor of making extremely broad comparisons between things that are not comparable.

The specific topic at hand is Organized . It is a specific religion, a specific denomination, a specific church, a specific clergy which are all linked in an Organized fashion. THAT is what we are talking about here.
Not, guy with hair chokes baby, therefore all guys with hair are bad.
That is not what we are saying here.
History is full of examples of bad, wrong, immoral, horrible, atrocious etc etc things that were the result of having Organized Religion involved. The Organized part of religion, meaning the chain of command, the written rules, the unwritten rules, the do as I say not as I do, the appointing of an individual and individuals who represent THE Organization is what we are talking about here. Those people make the rules and decisions that followers adhere to. It is Organized!!! Therefore linked. Therefore together.
If the religious want to argue that 40,000 different denominations all lead to one God then it is not a stretch to include the bad with the good. That priest, father, padre IS part of the entire Organization and also a representative.

If I am wrong, show me what Organized club I belong to merely for my own thoughts. Surely you can see the difference I am pointing out here.

Organized isn’t the issue. There must be some form of organization in anything, even a hunting club. There are ways you’ll act in public if you’re representing.......even your work place.

The problem is still “men” and their ideology and any tool available will be used, even atheism if it’ll push their ideology.

Your disdain for religion won’t allow to you objectively look at human nature, it’s automatically a religious problem.

For every bad apple in religion, there’s plenty of good ones that will agree that the boy should take communion if his understanding is enough to know that it’s more than drinking a drink.

 

[Spotlite]

Here ya go bullet - yup, atheist don’t assemble in any type of group or organization. BTW, you should study atheism a little more, they have several categories ?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nation...heists-just-want-you-to-laugh-at-religion/amp

 

[bullethead]

Organized isn’t the issue. There must be some form of organization in anything, even a hunting club. There are ways you’ll act in public if you’re representing.......even your work place.

The problem is still “men” and their ideology and any tool available will be used, even atheism if it’ll push their ideology.

Your disdain for religion won’t allow to you objectively look at human nature, it’s automatically a religious problem.

For every bad apple in religion, there’s plenty of good ones that will agree that the boy should take communion if his understanding is enough to know that it’s more than drinking a drink.

You're enthusiasm for religion does not allow you to see that it is ALL man and zero God.
What is involved with religion that is not involved elsewhere? What force is involved that is the CEO, the Face of the company, the Leader?
If a being of ultimate truth actually has a hand in it then there would be no "wrongs" , especially within the Organization that represents that God.

You and others credit God for all that is good and in every instance then blame man for what god cannot do, does not do and will not do.

 

[NCHillbilly]

A person saying that organized religion is bad because of certain people is bad logic, just like saying that all atheists have no morals is bad logic.

The best organized religions I have ever experienced have been little community churches back in the middle of nowhere. Actually look after their community and have no imbedded corruption.

 

[bullethead]

Here ya go bullet - yup, atheist don’t assemble in any type of group or organization. BTW, you should study atheism a little more, they have several categories ?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nation...heists-just-want-you-to-laugh-at-religion/amp

Spot, the Organized part of any Organization is only as good as the head honcho. They are representatives of the entity.
Now, if you are comparing and relating a group of Organized atheists that absolutely agree that they represent Man with the Organized religious who agree they represent a being above man....then I have to believe you know both are totally the result of man and represent man.
I agree with the general assessment that individuals (humans) are not a representative of the whole. Although you see leadership take the consequences for the actions of the pee-ons all the time.
But here we are talking about Human vs God. One fallible and the other supposedly infallible.
Which one would have a better grasp of what every employee or potential employee and representative can or will do and could take the appropriate actions to make sure everything is done perfectly every time?

 

[bullethead]

Organized isn’t the issue. There must be some form of organization in anything, even a hunting club. There are ways you’ll act in public if you’re representing.......even your work place.

The problem is still “men” and their ideology and any tool available will be used, even atheism if it’ll push their ideology.

Your disdain for religion won’t allow to you objectively look at human nature, it’s automatically a religious problem.

For every bad apple in religion, there’s plenty of good ones that will agree that the boy should take communion if his understanding is enough to know that it’s more than drinking a drink.

Are you self employed?
If not who do you answer to for your actions,who do they answer to , who do they answer to, and on and on?

 

[stringmusic]

There are many examples throughout THOUSANDS of years of atrocities and bad acts being done due to the practices of Organized Religion. The people involved were/are an accepted member of an Organized Religious sect and in a position of power within that Organization where they are able to makes decisions which involve and effect other members and non members of that Organization.
You are taking an example of a specific instance where Organized Religion is responsible for the case at hand and then trying to paint another example with a wide brush in order to make it fit.
There are thieves in religion as well as non religion. That cancels each other out.
In this case you have an autistic boy being denied by the "rules" of a man who is a representative of a specific denomination of an organized religion. Not due to a set of individual beliefs or non beliefs tied to no organization.

If you could have somehow used a similar situation where an autistic person was denied something by an ORGANIZED atheist group, then you would have connected some dots.

Apparently, I must not have explained my point very well. Never mind it.

 

[stringmusic]

The best organized religions I have ever experienced have been little community churches back in the middle of nowhere. Actually look after their community and have no imbedded corruption.

There are some large churches doing great things that don’t have corruption too, they just don’t get the “coverage” because it doesn’t make good headlines.

I like small churches too, they usually got the best food from all the lil ol lady’s.

 

[NCHillbilly]

There are some large churches doing great things that don’t have corruption too, they just don’t get the “coverage” because it doesn’t make good headlines.

I like small churches too, they usually got the best food from all the lil ol lady’s.

You ain't eat until you eat at a church homecoming/decoration day here.

 

[Spotlite]

You're enthusiasm for religion does not allow you to see that it is ALL man and zero God.
What is involved with religion that is not involved elsewhere? What force is involved that is the CEO, the Face of the company, the Leader?
If a being of ultimate truth actually has a hand in it then there would be no "wrongs" , especially within the Organization that represents that God.

You and others credit God for all that is good and in every instance then blame man for what god cannot do, does not do and will not do.

Your opinion of being all man and no God isn’t relevant. The issue here is human nature, man problem, etc. Based on your understanding, guns kill people, not people.

 

[Spotlite]

Are you self employed?
If not who do you answer to for your actions,who do they answer to , who do they answer to, and on and on?

I am not, but my one employer doesn’t represent every employer ?

 

[WaltL1]

Point out to me the part where I missed you giving examples of those Atheists, Agnostics and non believers being part of an ORGANIZED institution.
String and you are totally bypassing the ORGANIZED part of religion in favor of making extremely broad comparisons between things that are not comparable.

The specific topic at hand is Organized . It is a specific religion, a specific denomination, a specific church, a specific clergy which are all linked in an Organized fashion. THAT is what we are talking about here.
Not, guy with hair chokes baby, therefore all guys with hair are bad.
That is not what we are saying here.
History is full of examples of bad, wrong, immoral, horrible, atrocious etc etc things that were the result of having Organized Religion involved. The Organized part of religion, meaning the chain of command, the written rules, the unwritten rules, the do as I say not as I do, the appointing of an individual and individuals who represent THE Organization is what we are talking about here. Those people make the rules and decisions that followers adhere to. It is Organized!!! Therefore linked. Therefore together.
If the religious want to argue that 40,000 different denominations all lead to one God then it is not a stretch to include the bad with the good. That priest, father, padre IS part of the entire Organization and also a representative.

If I am wrong, show me what Organized club I belong to merely for my own thoughts. Surely you can see the difference I am pointing out here.

The Organized part of religion, meaning the chain of command, the written rules, the unwritten rules, the do as I say not as I do, the appointing of an individual and individuals who represent THE Organization is what we are talking about here. Those people make the rules and decisions that followers adhere to.

Yes this is ^ who/what I'm talking about when I say "organized religion".
I'm not talking about the every day folks who "organize" together at church.
I'm talking about the "Board of Directors".

 

[WaltL1]

You ain't eat until you eat at a church homecoming/decoration day here.

Ive eaten at some pretty fancy high $ resteraunts.
Not a one of them has even come close to a church lady meal served on a paper plate!

 

[WaltL1]

Organized isn’t the issue. There must be some form of organization in anything, even a hunting club. There are ways you’ll act in public if you’re representing.......even your work place.

The problem is still “men” and their ideology and any tool available will be used, even atheism if it’ll push their ideology.

Your disdain for religion won’t allow to you objectively look at human nature, it’s automatically a religious problem.

For every bad apple in religion, there’s plenty of good ones that will agree that the boy should take communion if his understanding is enough to know that it’s more than drinking a drink.

The problem is still “men” and their ideology and any tool available will be used, even atheism if it’ll push their ideology.

Essentially .. yes.
And in my view, organized religion (all of them not just Christianity) are a tool that man created to push their various ideology(s).
Organized religion is the "middle man" between God and the people.
And the "middle men" have convinced the people that they have to go through them AND FOLLOW THEIR RULES/IDEOLOGIES/ etc..... to properly get to God.
When I reject "organized religion", I am rejecting the "middle man".
If there is a God, I am rejecting what the middle man is telling me what that God is/believes/wants and how and why Im supposed to worship it.
And why do I reject the middle man? Cuz just like you said -

The problem is still “men” and their ideology and any tool available will be used, even atheism if it’ll push their ideology.

 

[WaltL1]

Our baptist church does not have a middle man. Unless maybe you would call the pastor and preachers that preach a middle man. However the bible tells of preachers and men who carry Gods word. Now as far as a middle man we answer to, only one I would call that would be the one that sits at the right hand of the father.

Unless maybe you would call the pastor and preachers that preach a middle man.

Yes, I would.
And being Baptist pastors/preachers they preach Baptist ideology.
Which was determined by Baptist hyerarchy.
Who determined what Baptist beliefs are.
And what the Baptist rules for worship are.
And.......

EDIT -
By the way j_seph….
I am NOT in any way "bashing" pastors/preachers etc. So please don't jump to that conclusion.
I think its a fact that the vast majority of them are honest, God lovin'/fearin', hard working, give you the shirt off their back, just down right good men who do their job with the absolute best of intentions.
Thats an entirely different subject than where do the beliefs come from that they preach.

 

[Israel]

but I think I see a flag on the play...