Can you lose your faith? ( Original title read loose instead of lose in error. My bad.)

[Israel]

Author and finisher.

 

[gemcgrew]

Author and finisher.

On our way to work this morning, I was talking to my son-in-law about this thread. I told him that the "Author and Finisher" settles the matter. If a believer loses his faith, it the failure of Christ. But Christ fails not.

 

[Spotlite]

Author and finisher.

So it’s impossible for Paul to become a cast away - what was his concern in becoming one?

Author and finisher is the creation and completion in Jesus, he made the way available. It’s up us to stick with it.

 

[gemcgrew]

So it’s impossible for Paul to become a cast away - what was his concern in becoming one?

Paul was persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Author and finisher is the creation and completion in Jesus, he made the way available. It’s up us to stick with it.

Paul didn't believe it to be of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[Artfuldodger]

So it’s impossible for Paul to become a cast away - what was his concern in becoming one?

Author and finisher is the creation and completion in Jesus, he made the way available. It’s up us to stick with it.

You think God would do what he did on the road to Damascus to then, at some future point, let Paul the Prophet become a cast away?

 

[Spotlite]

You think God would do what he did on the road to Damascus to then, at some future point, let Paul the Prophet become a cast away?

Was Paul exempt from “any man” in Revelation 22?

 

[Spotlite]

Paul was persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Paul didn't believe it to be of works, lest any man should boast.

That’s all great, I feel the same way. I’m just as sold out as Paul but I’m still striving and God still loves.

Now, who are these that put their hand to the plow, returned to their vomit, needed restoring, what overtook them, etc?? The blame for every one of their failures is their own doing, not the lack of Gods’ love, not heights, not depth, nor powers.........it was their own week flesh.

God loved Adam and Eve, too. He loved Judas. He loved the rich man.

And works wasn’t part of my thought process but who are the wicked and slothful servants? Who are those that had their talents given to those that actually used them? And, are you and I exempt from “any man” that Revelation 22 warns of? Who is? Think a work such as that warning might affect your “sealing” or should we remove the warning?

 

[StriperAddict]

I’m still striving and God still loves.

'Cease striving and know" comes to mind.
Psalm 46:10

To know the love of God might mean we know the covenant He made with Himself to secure so great a salvation.

To know this security might mean we know that we have no boast in it. The new heart, aka new set of godly desires comes to mind, gifted by that same knowing - not striving to attain what we already have.

Sure, some "yeah, buts" come to mind ...

If Paul himself said he "has not attained it", then why would he say that he, and all believers, were made complete in Christ?
A contradiction?
God cannot lie.

The great news is that we are growing in the grace and knowledge of Christ, and no man can attain all of such grace and the full knowledge of who He is and who we are without additional daily revelation and reminders.

So on the one hand we no longer strive for the completeness and righteousness He died to give us freely. But as the renewal of our minds happen we find we need not shop for the "sons and daughters robes" we were clothed in. It's not a boast when it's a gift. It's a rest in a work not our own, sealed by a better covenant, a solid agreement between two parties ... God and God.

Heb 6:13, 18:
Since He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself ...

18 ... so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.

Striving to enter ... His rest? In Providence a believer has arrived at the rest in Christ.

 

[Artfuldodger]

Was Paul exempt from “any man” in Revelation 22?

Good point, there is also the resurrection of the good and bad, and the separation of the Sheep(good deed) and the Goats(evil deeds, never helping feed or clothe the poor.)

 

[Spotlite]

'Cease striving and know" comes to mind.
Psalm 46:10

To know the love of God might mean we know the covenant He made with Himself to secure so great a salvation.

To know this security might mean we know that we have no boast in it. The new heart, aka new set of godly desires comes to mind, gifted by that same knowing - not striving to attain what we already have.

Sure, some "yeah, buts" come to mind ...

If Paul himself said he "has not attained it", then why would he say that he, and all believers, were made complete in Christ?
A contradiction?
God cannot lie.

The great news is that we are growing in the grace and knowledge of Christ, and no man can attain all of such grace and the full knowledge of who He is and who we are without additional daily revelation and reminders.

So on the one hand we no longer strive for the completeness and righteousness He died to give us freely. But as the renewal of our minds happen we find we need not shop for the "sons and daughters robes" we were clothed in. It's not a boast when it's a gift. It's a rest in a work not our own, sealed by a better covenant, a solid agreement between two parties ... God and God.

Heb 6:13, 18:
Since He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself ...

18 ... so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.

Striving to enter ... His rest? In Providence a believer has arrived at the rest in Christ.

You are complete “in” Christ. When you’re not in Christ is the debate. You simply can’t serve two masters at once. There are those that are supposed to be in Christ yet their lifestyle proves otherwise. Some say they aren’t truly saved - that’s not my argument. I will say if you got the goods, you don’t want to do the former things, but I’m not naive enough to think that you can’t chose to do something. And I’m not naive enough to think that God overlooks something you’re doing that’s actually serving the other master. He even said be hot or cold, if you’re lukewarm he will spew you out. Fruitless branches get cut.

And of course there’s much scripture / scenarios as I hinted a couple above concerning those that return “after” knowing Jesus. And then we must figure out how to address Revelation 22 / because God can’t lie and if you can’t be removed, and if you are guilty of Revelation 22......but it sounds like you can’t even be guilty and removed because of that one......

 

[gordon 2]

1 th. 5:9 For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. 10 He died for us so that, whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him. 11 Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.
....................
I think that what Paul means here is that it is possible to live apart of him, even we know him-- but don't do it. Doing so makes one's faith of no account.

 

[Israel]

So it’s impossible for Paul to become a cast away - what was his concern in becoming one?

Author and finisher is the creation and completion in Jesus, he made the way available. It’s up us to stick with it.

Good question

what was his concern in becoming one?

Is this as good a question?


Did he find relief for that concern?

 

[welderguy]

Faith, once given, cannot be lost... ever.
But faith can become dead, without works.
We are sanctified continually, purged by the good Husbandman, chastened and even scourged, and converted many times throughout our lives, because we have an "expected end".

 

[Spotlite]

Did he find relief for that concern?

I’m sure he did once he laid to rest. It seems, though, that as time marches on, each generation is less concerned because they “got an eternal ticket” - regardless.

 

[Artfuldodger]

I’m sure he did once he laid to rest. It seems, though, that as time marches on, each generation is less concerned because they “got an eternal ticket” - regardless.

Perhaps each generation is more concerned. Each generation of Christians that is, not the world. Maybe the Scriptural "falling away" is a generational thing and not individual.

As time marches forward, maybe Christians are more "at rest," than "yoked."

 

[Israel]

I’m sure he did once he laid to rest. It seems, though, that as time marches on, each generation is less concerned because they “got an eternal ticket” - regardless.

Would I be wrong to interpret the above that there is a general and progressive loss of esteem of salvation?

 

[Israel]

Perhaps each generation is more concerned. Each generation of Christians that is, not the world. Maybe the Scriptural "falling away" is a generational thing and not individual.

As time marches forward, maybe Christians are more "at rest," than "yoked."

That's an interesting observation. If it is to be rightly discerned (a big "if") how would one know what is "at rest in God's salvation" vs what is at rest in presumption? Or just foolishly comfortable in the world?

 

[Spotlite]

Would I be wrong to interpret the above that there is a general and progressive loss of esteem of salvation?

I wouldn’t disagree with your interpretation.

 

[Spotlite]

”falling away”

As time marches forward, maybe Christians are more "at rest," than "yoked."

I’m inclined to agree with Israel. And the falling away seems to be something that’s less concerning the more “at rest” we are becoming. For some, it’s absolutely impossible.

Just my opinion only.

Or just foolishly comfortable in the world?

 

[Israel]

I wouldn’t disagree with your interpretation.

Do you see how, on one hand, what appears troubling is in another sense the assurance of the Lord's word(s)?

How that observing what the Lord has spoken as coming to pass "in the last days" must build you up in the faith and confidence of Him who spoke it...but also...how...as your "own" building up is taking place it encourages and reproves others as ordained of God?