Church Switchers

[SemperFiDawg]

The church lost its power when it felt the need to be entertained instead challenged.

It's not that I disagree with anything you've said as much as we're talking past each other regarding your definition of the (American) church and the populace. I think you're painting all churches and the populace with just a slightly overly broad brush.

I’ll go on back to the sports forum now.

This is a great discussion that warrants more input. Yours has been stellar. Don't go leaving now. It's the first good discussion this forum has seen in some time. Hopefully some others will drop in and comment.

 

[brutally honest]

It's the first good discussion this forum has seen in some time.

It’s always nice to have an actual “discussion” in the Spiritual Discussion forum.

 

[gordon 2]

I like smaller churches, too.

What is interesting also is how a YouTube vid and a simple statement was the call to a remarkable open the window and let the fresh air in discussion. How that worked, I'm still not sure?

 

[BeerThirty]

Churches are no different than a business trying to attract and retain new customers: If they don't offer a product/service that meets the ever-changing needs of the congregation, then they will struggle with membership.

Now, about the video...

Yes, it's easy to see how church can be unfulfilling to some, especially when several go through the same motions every week without making any personal connections. But I would like to know how much effort the gentleman in the video actually put in because all I heard was "me, me, me, etc..." Did he or his wife bother to speak to anyone about getting more involved? Did they attend any of the church's extra-curricular events? Did they bother to share the good news an invite friends? All of those simple things could have made their prior church more enjoyable, perhaps.

And, in general, I feel like many big churches are aware of how their size can be intimidating or, simply not preferred. But it seems as if every large church I've been to lately sure is doing whatever it can to help people get connected and not feel like such a big church.

 

[brownceluse]

It's not that I disagree with anything you've said as much as we're talking past each other regarding your definition of the (American) church and the populace. I think you're painting all churches and the populace with just a slightly overly broad brush.


This is a great discussion that warrants more input. Yours has been stellar. Don't go leaving now. It's the first good discussion this forum has seen in some time. Hopefully some others will drop in and comment.

I believe there’s a remnant. Wit that said, they could be Baptist, Methodist, Pentecostal, Presbyterian, Etc. When I speak of the American church it is a broad brush. There’s churches on every corner near about. I just can’t wrap my head around the fact that we show for an hour on Sunday and our on Wednesday night and call that power. In most churches today let a man or woman hit the altar and need help to pray through and it last a little too long and see how that goes. lol. I’m not hating on the church. I would love to see it wake up!!!! Christians studying their faith. Praying seeking Gods face! Have an intimate relationship with Jesus. Trust me! 90% does neither.

 

[Ruger#3]

I wont berate other churches and only speak of ours in an informative manner not to claim “the way it’s done.”

In addition to a full days schedule on Sunday and Weds services bible study for folks like me who seek more understanding is offered. The pastor and elders are available to work with those in need about anytime. There’s various teams who do charity/mission work with other groups in the community. These folks are given a chance to walk the walk and be the face of the church. A group of members meet every morning to pray with the pastor at the start of the day. The Pastor will mention those who have sought help in the prayer call so the whole church can join in prayer for those in need. Sometimes the list is long, other times short. I think of church is like an investment. The more you put into your relationship the more you’ll get out of it.

 

[ClemsonRangers]

i switched because the pastor stopped teaching from the KJV

 

[BeerThirty]

Seems to me the biggest driver in church selection is worship style, or the music.

You so much as increase the tempo of a song or add an electric guitar to the band and the fuddy-duddy's go ballistic. But I will say that the fog machines are totally unnecessary...

Joking aside, my point still stands. I've seen a longtime church ripped apart because they simply became more progressive in their song selection, i.e. went from all hymnals to maybe half are now hymnals. I'm not one to judge, but for some people to walk way from a church after 15-20+ years simply due to a small music tweak, I just don't know. But then again, I know that worship can be a very deep and special time for many...

And at my church they've recently decided to offer an additional "traditional" service... no fancy lighting, projectors or any amplified music/sound, basically entirely acoustic. Lots of extra resources needed to pull this off for the older folks, but they seem to be enjoying it. Again, a retention "play" imo..

 

[gordon 2]

i switched because the pastor stopped teaching from the KJV

( Off topic) By switching because the pastor stopped teaching from the KJV, was it that the pastor was no longer able to edify the assembly in love? The pastor was unable to speak the truth in love if not teaching from the KJV? Or you are unable to see the truth in love without KJV?

(On topic.) For churches that cannot agree within themselves on the truth of Christ and so the truth in love, that cannot find a measure in love itself, let alone love a measure in common, the believer-citizens are ever walking, no tip toeing , on a spiritual mine field. And you can only do this for so long before you get battle fatigue from the cauldron's rolling boil and so you need to resign your commission and retire-rest or switch service in the hope of some salve and salvation from what once you thought was all salvation.

 

[j_seph]

I am a member of a small church. That Scott McConnell made a statement, about helping make better informed ministry decisions.
That is one problem I see, your church, pastor is depending on an outside source to make decisions. These should be made by seeking the Lord, asking him what would he have the church to do, not what some survey said to do. I have been watching and listening to some of the stuff going on in some of the mega churches. GOD HELP! Not saying they all are bad, not saying everyone in em is going to a Devils H3LL. There are some born again Christians in them that just have not found their way out (Bethel, Hillsong, ex..) Our walk and relationship with Christ is a personal journey, sometimes we need encouragement which is where the smaller churches come in. Example I see is Mrs Browns Husband dies after 60 years of marriage. They attend a mega church, maybe 2 or 3 know about it another 5000 don't even know her. Where is the support, the help for the widows at? Yeah she may have family, I do as well but am closer to some of my church family than them. I've never heard of a mega church carrying food to funeral home, to the house for each member that passes. Haven't heard of too many of em going to the hospitals to visit a dying member. You are a number in these churches for the most part, just as in any corporation.

 

[gordon 2]

I get the feeling that there is this idea here that to keep doing what we have been doing by going to our past and doing as then and doing as then even better than then, that we will get a different outcome than we have presently.

How could that work? We are the children our fathers raised and we are the fathers our children have now. Would the faith of our fathers raise other children for us, other than our children, the ones we have now ?

Doing the same spiritual things to get and expect different results? Or is there something else?

 

[Ruger#3]

Interesting, KJV being a breaking point. A translation written by a committee of monks to the satisfaction of a British King for use in the COE. FYI, I read mostly the KJV..

 

[NE GA Pappy]

Have an intimate relationship with Jesus. Trust me! 90% does neither.

there is the problem, and the answer to the problem.

 

[NE GA Pappy]

i switched because the pastor stopped teaching from the KJV

KJV isn't the end-all interpretation either. It is lacking in some respects because the words they used then don't mean the same thing as they do to us, or they didn't have words that would accurately interpret the thoughts the author was conveying. If you don't think I am right, try reading John 1:1-6 with the understanding of what John was trying to convey to his audience in Ephesus while he pastored there.

If you are dependent on one interpretation and don't study others, and the original languages ( I use an interlinear Bible because I don't read Hebrew nor Greek) you may not be getting all the understanding you could of what is being said.

I grew up on KJV, and if I am quoting scripture, I still use that interpretation because that is how I committed it to memory. There just seems to be a lot more depth to be gained by using other versions to make comparisions

 

[NE GA Pappy]

I am a member of a small church. That Scott McConnell made a statement, about helping make better informed ministry decisions.
That is one problem I see, your church, pastor is depending on an outside source to make decisions. These should be made by seeking the Lord, asking him what would he have the church to do, not what some survey said to do. I have been watching and listening to some of the stuff going on in some of the mega churches. GOD HELP! Not saying they all are bad, not saying everyone in em is going to a Devils H3LL. There are some born again Christians in them that just have not found their way out (Bethel, Hillsong, ex..) Our walk and relationship with Christ is a personal journey, sometimes we need encouragement which is where the smaller churches come in. Example I see is Mrs Browns Husband dies after 60 years of marriage. They attend a mega church, maybe 2 or 3 know about it another 5000 don't even know her. Where is the support, the help for the widows at? Yeah she may have family, I do as well but am closer to some of my church family than them. I've never heard of a mega church carrying food to funeral home, to the house for each member that passes. Haven't heard of too many of em going to the hospitals to visit a dying member. You are a number in these churches for the most part, just as in any corporation.

if that is your experience with larger churches, you are in the wrong church.

also see my post about how many people you will really know in a church... research proves the number tops out at 39 regardless of the size of the church

 

[ClemsonRangers]

Interesting, KJV being a breaking point. A translation written by a committee of monks to the satisfaction of a British King for use in the COE. FYI, I read mostly the KJV..

nose under the tent, next thing you know you are voting on female pastor

 

[ClemsonRangers]

KJV isn't the end-all interpretation either. It is lacking in some respects because the words they used then don't mean the same thing as they do to us, or they didn't have words that would accurately interpret the thoughts the author was conveying. If you don't think I am right, try reading John 1:1-6 with the understanding of what John was trying to convey to his audience in Ephesus while he pastored there.

If you are dependent on one interpretation and don't study others, and the original languages ( I use an interlinear Bible because I don't read Hebrew nor Greek) you may not be getting all the understanding you could of what is being said.

I grew up on KJV, and if I am quoting scripture, I still use that interpretation because that is how I committed it to memory. There just seems to be a lot more depth to be gained by using other versions to make comparisions

when you find a good KJV bible, stop looking

 

[Ruger#3]

nose under the tent, next thing you know you are voting on female pastor

You won’t find me there

There was vote on keeping old English in our services. Passed by a land slide.

 

[BeerThirty]

That is one problem I see, your church, pastor is depending on an outside source to make decisions. These should be made by seeking the Lord, asking him what would he have the church to do, not what some survey said to do.

If churches want to grow, then they need to sell a product that people want to buy, period. Turning to surveys and other outside sources are great ways for churches to better understand their landscape and the actual people they are trying to reel in.. Think of it as market research, if you will. The churches staying on top of these things and adapting are the ones growing. As long as they are staying within the confines of the Lord's will, then I have no problem with seeking input from other sources.

 

[NE GA Pappy]

when you find a good KJV bible, stop looking

i own several.