Does burning nests matter?

[buckpasser]

Do you see poults the first week of March year after year or are you setting March 7 as a date, 28 days prior to seeing the first poult?

I’m giving them 28 days plus 14 for laying the clutch.

 

[across the river]

Everyone here probably knows my opinion on this as it’s voiced pretty often. I want to know what the GON faithful think. Does destroying turkey nests for the sake of late rx fire matter? Is it your opinion that the benefit of the burn might outweigh the negative? Why would you rather burn late than early? Can burn objectives be met prior to clutches of eggs being on the ground? Let us know!

So there are advantages to a spring burn for sure. You gain better control of more of the stuff you don't want (woody plants, scrubs, etc.) if you burn them after they have started sprouting. If you don't fully kill them, it takes them longer to re-sprout burning them late over burning early when there were no leaves on the plant. You get more of the stuff you want and less of the stuff you don't. Sort of like timing a drawdown on moist soil. If you burn in winter, you also get months of ash covered ground that doesn't benefit much at all in terms of game until spring. If you burn after green-up, it pretty much starts to green back up immediately. I get the concern, but in my experience, which agrees with the research I have read, the turkeys don't really nest much in whatever area you burned after the first or second year if they have the option. They also typically nest near the edges as well close to the woods. If you are burning smaller sections of the place every 3-5 years, the number or nests in those area will be very minimal. If the burns are being done in rotation, I think the impact is nil. The bigger problem is in a lot of places, the nesting and brood habitat is pretty dismal, and that is far more of an issue than springtime burns. I think it is an emotional issue, but really don't see it being a problem. I think far more nests are lost to fields being cut in the March /April timeframe.

 

[buckpasser]

So there are advantages to a spring burn for sure. You gain better control of more of the stuff you don't want (woody plants, scrubs, etc.) if you burn them after they have started sprouting. If you don't fully kill them, it takes them longer to re-sprout burning them late over burning early when there were no leaves on the plant. You get more of the stuff you want and less of the stuff you don't. Sort of like timing a drawdown on moist soil. If you burn in winter, you also get months of ash covered ground that doesn't benefit much at all in terms of game until spring. If you burn after green-up, it pretty much starts to green back up immediately. I get the concern, but in my experience, which agrees with the research I have read, the turkeys don't really nest much in whatever area you burned after the first or second year if they have the option. They also typically nest near the edges as well close to the woods. If you are burning smaller sections of the place every 3-5 years, the number or nests in those area will be very minimal. If the burns are being done in rotation, I think the impact is nil. The bigger problem is in a lot of places, the nesting and brood habitat is pretty dismal, and that is far more of an issue than springtime burns. I think it is an emotional issue, but really don't see it being a problem. I think far more nests are lost to fields being cut in the March /April timeframe.

You make good points. If a land manager or burner had your mindset and was plans in mind I agree the impact would be minimal. That said, you’re still saying that you’d mostly avoid burning nests and burn in less desirable cover and on a moderate size scale.

 

[Gaswamp]

Imho growing season burns wud b better on 20 acre blocks or less than 1500+ blocks.

 

[across the river]

You make good points. If a land manager or burner had your mindset and was plans in mind I agree the impact would be minimal. That said, you’re still saying that you’d mostly avoid burning nests and burn in less desirable cover and on a moderate size scale.

Imho growing season burns wud b better on 20 acre blocks or less than 1500+ blocks.

It is indeed better to burn small blocks if you are specifically managing for turkeys, but like anything else, nothing exists in a vacuum. Most land owners or managers are not running around burning specifically to improve there land for turkey habitat. Most people, don’t really give a rip about turkeys in all honestly. If you are burning to control undesirable growth, after greenup is better hands down. The question then becomes, is it better to burn in April than not burn at all, and the answer is 100% yes.

 

[cowhornedspike]

So there are advantages to a spring burn for sure. You gain better control of more of the stuff you don't want (woody plants, scrubs, etc.) if you burn them after they have started sprouting. If you don't fully kill them, it takes them longer to re-sprout burning them late over burning early when there were no leaves on the plant. You get more of the stuff you want and less of the stuff you don't. Sort of like timing a drawdown on moist soil. If you burn in winter, you also get months of ash covered ground that doesn't benefit much at all in terms of game until spring. If you burn after green-up, it pretty much starts to green back up immediately. I get the concern, but in my experience, which agrees with the research I have read, the turkeys don't really nest much in whatever area you burned after the first or second year if they have the option. They also typically nest near the edges as well close to the woods. If you are burning smaller sections of the place every 3-5 years, the number or nests in those area will be very minimal. If the burns are being done in rotation, I think the impact is nil. The bigger problem is in a lot of places, the nesting and brood habitat is pretty dismal, and that is far more of an issue than springtime burns. I think it is an emotional issue, but really don't see it being a problem. I think far more nests are lost to fields being cut in the March /April timeframe.

Unfortunately almost all of the later (growing) season burns we are complaining about are done for timber management purposes and not wildlife management purposes and therefore are also going to be larger burns as opposed to the smaller ones that would not harm the nesting as much. From what I can see, very little burning, even on wma's, is done solely for wildlife management purposes...almost all is done for timber management it appears. For MOST wildlife those two don't have to be opposed, but for turkeys a good timber management burn is NOT always going to be what should have been done.

 

[across the river]

Unfortunately almost all of the later (growing) season burns we are complaining about are done for timber management purposes and not wildlife management purposes and therefore are also going to be larger burns as opposed to the smaller ones that would not harm the nesting as much. From what I can see, very little burning, even on wma's, is done solely for wildlife management purposes...almost all is done for timber management it appears. For MOST wildlife those two don't have to be opposed, but for turkeys a good timber management burn is NOT always going to be what should have been done.

I agree, but it is still better to have them burn, even “late”, verses not burning at all. Like I said earlier, most land owners don’t give a rip about turkeys. Wanting them to not burn because they might destroy a couple of nests is short sighted because the long term benefits of burning outweigh any short term negative impacts. Better they burn late than not at all.

 

[cowhornedspike]

I agree, but it is still better to have them burn, even “late”, verses not burning at all. Like I said earlier, most land owners don’t give a rip about turkeys. Wanting them to not burn because they might destroy a couple of nests is short sighted because the long term benefits of burning outweigh any short term negative impacts. Better they burn late than not at all.

I don't want them to not burn at all. Just burn early rather than late. It is NOT a question of burn vs not....never has been.

 

[across the river]

I don't want them to not burn at all. Just burn early rather than late. It is NOT a question of burn vs not....never has been.

.


Again, most people burning don’t care about what you or I want want, or a turkey for that matter. My point is at least they are burning, which overall, benefits turkeys. Of all the issues turkeys face, this isn’t high on the list of problems.

 

[Hoosier06]

Found 2 sets of fresh gobbler tracks and a fresh set of hen tracks in a wma burn from Feb 21. They didn't seem to use the burn last year. It looks good this year and found good sign there on my evening run with the lab. No fresh tracks on the side that just finished logging

 

[doehunter]

Burning on cohutta today

 

[Gut_Pile]

Nope...Im just seriously amazed there are any osceolas left. There has to be more pressure on them than any other, but they keep surviving, and I guess maintain a healthy population.

the florida panther making a strong comeback is the best thing that ever happened to the osceola turkey

 

[buckpasser]

Burning on cohutta today

That’s terrific.

 

[doehunter]

Let’s get the flames a going!!

 

[buckpasser]

Let’s get the flames a going!!

I’m tired of just burning nests. I’ve started ringing big blocks at night. That way I’m able to kill not only the eggs, but sometimes I get lucky and smoke a hen or a fresh clutch of poults too! It’s awesome and doesn’t hurt a thing! They bounce right back and the habitat improvement makes it all worth it. Woohoo!

 

[Whit90]

1 egg lost by means of prescribed human management practices, is 1 egg too many.
I think one thing that all hunters can actually agree on is the benefits of prescribed fire, but why can we not get the same effects from burning any other time besides nesting and brooding time?

 

[dhsnke]

They burned both sides of Pocket Rd at John's mountain WMA again this year. Right in the middle of April. How can one side be doing studies on turkey decline and the other side just ignore it?

 

[buckpasser]

They burned both sides of Pocket Rd at John's mountain WMA again this year. Right in the middle of April. How can one side be doing studies on turkey decline and the other side just ignore it?

$

 

[2dye4]

I came by Ft Benning yesterday and they were burning south of Upatoi creek. I think that’ll get rid of some poults for sure.

 

[buckpasser]

I came by Ft Benning yesterday and they were burning south of Upatoi creek. I think that’ll get rid of some poults for sure.

Good deal.