From Darwin to Nietzsche to Hitler

[SemperFiDawg]

I don't believe I said anything about Hitler being a Christian.
I posted. "Based on...words. Right?"
And, I posted Hitler's words. Didn't see anything about Christians

That being said, Hitler himself, characterized himself as being a Christian.

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before in the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice.... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.... When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very devil if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom to-day this poor people is plundered and exploited.

-Adolf Hitler, in his speech in Munich on 12 April 1922

Why does that amuse you?

http://www.amazon.com/Bonhoeffer-Pastor-Martyr-Prophet-Spy/dp/1595552464

Read this and you would understand......maybe; or this for that matter.

http://www.amazon.com/King-James-Bi...ks&ie=UTF8&qid=1393534491&sr=1-4&keywords=KJV

 

[Denton]

The story of the person in power separating those out he didn't approve of and sending them off to a place of horror and torture so that he would then only be surrounded by those he did approve of has been around since long before Hitler.

Like Noah's flood? God only approved of Noah and his family and the animals.

 

[SemperFiDawg]

The story of the person in power being separated from those who didn't approve of him and sending themselves off to a place of horror and torture so that they would then only be surrounded by those who didn't approve of Him has been around since long before Hitler.

Fixed it. Now it's truthful, and you're welcome btw. Only problem is now it doesn't contextually fit. Imagine that.

 

[WaltL1]

Originally Posted by WaltL1 View Post
The story of the person in power separating those out he didn't approve of and sending them off to a place of horror and torture so that he would then only be surrounded by those he did approve of has been around since long before Hitler.

Like Noah's flood? God only approved of Noah and his family and the animals.

One could go much broader than that.

 

[Denton]

http://www.amazon.com/Bonhoeffer-Pastor-Martyr-Prophet-Spy/dp/1595552464

Read this and you would understand......maybe; or this for that matter.

http://www.amazon.com/King-James-Bi...ks&ie=UTF8&qid=1393534491&sr=1-4&keywords=KJV

The actions of another christian, as saintly as he may be, are only the actions of one man. When you put them up against the actions of another man who also considered himself christian...then you get two men and their actions who both consider themselves christian. To hold one up as more christian as another is to say something like the Braves are more of a baseball team than the Mets. Both are baseball teams, and both men have expressed their belief in christ as their savior. Sure, actions speak louder than words, but who are you to judge?

Hitler was evil, he twisted religion, science, a longstanding cultural hatred, and a feeling of injustice formed from the Treaty of Versailles's results to create a basis for his actions which convinced enough people to aid him and even more people to go along with his policies. Everyone was a victim of Hitler and to pin the fault on darwin, or god is simply an attempt to use his evil as a basis for your own goals.

Are you that gullible? We have known that the rise of Nazi Germany was a complicated thing for a very long time. To think that only evolution was the cause of the genocide is absurd and embarrassing that this guy got published. Are we happy about eugenics? Of course not, its a stain on science and a stain on humanity. But it was only people using what sounded like science to further their own hateful goals. Eugenics didn't work at the time (skull measurements and other actual experimental science didn't support it) and it for sure doesn't work now.

SFD, you're smarter than this. We need better from you. Please stop trying to usurp terrible things as the basis for your campaign against agnostics and athiests. In the last month its been a child burning mother and now hitler. It's not a secret that Hitler's Nazi Germany used any method possible to convince people to do its bidding. Please think about what you are saying when you post this book review and say, "sounds like a good informative book". That means you are supporting the books ideas and by inference blaming modern science for the genocide, as if Hitler was science's creation. If you really wanted to discuss this book with us, just ask, "What are your thoughts on this author's idea that darwin and nietzsche influenced Hitler's genocide? I understand that Eugenics has its basis in evolution and I was wondering if there is a direct causation."

To which I'd say, no, Hitler's hatred of the Jews was first and he used Religion, Eugenics and philosophy to twist germans into doing his bidding.

 

[Denton]

One could go much broader than that.

gasp!!!!! like H-E-double hockey sticks???? Is god a coolaid-ocidal maniac? Must drink this or go to heck.

We are laughing but someone on this forum is going to say, yes, if you don't accept christ into your heart you will go to heck but god loves you and wishes you'd just do this simple thing or burn for all eternity.

 

[Denton]

uh, why is he11 a dirty word on this forum?

 

[WaltL1]

gasp!!!!! like H-E-double hockey sticks???? Is god a coolaid-ocidal maniac? Must drink this or go to heck.

We are laughing but someone on this forum is going to say, yes, if you don't accept christ into your heart you will go to heck but god loves you and wishes you'd just do this simple thing or burn for all eternity.

gasp!!!!! like H-E-double hockey sticks???? Is god a coolaid-ocidal maniac? Must drink this or go to heck.

Well my point of view is slightly different. I don't attribute these stories to "God". I attribute them to the men, inspired by men/themselves, who wrote them.

We are laughing but someone on this forum is going to say, yes, if you don't accept christ into your heart you will go to heck but god loves you and wishes you'd just do this simple thing or burn for all eternity

SOMEONE is going to say it? I would assume every Christian is going to say it. Or if not say it they believe it.
Indoctrination is a powerful, powerful thing.

 

[bullethead]

Fixed it. Now it's truthful, and you're welcome btw. Only problem is now it doesn't contextually fit. Imagine that.

It is in no way truthful.

And nobody should be allowed to "fix" anything for anyone without the first person asking for their help in doing so.

Unless of course you don't mind us "fixing" your posts???

 

[WaltL1]

It is in no way truthful.

And nobody should be allowed to "fix" anything for anyone without the first person asking for their help in doing so.

Unless of course you don't mind us "fixing" your posts???

He knows I have him on ignore and cant even see his posts when Im logged in. I had to log out just to see it was my post he "fixed".
It doesn't matter. For me the only value his posts have is I could always print them out should I run out of toilet paper.
We all know what he's about.

 

[centerpin fan]

The actions of another christian, as saintly as he may be, are only the actions of one man. When you put them up against the actions of another man who also considered himself Christian ...

If Hitler considered himself a table lamp, would that make it so?

If he considered himself the fifth Beatle, would that make it so?

If he considered himself:

1) the 1937 Cy Young winner
2) a Radio Shack employee named Maury
3) the inventor of the hula hoop

... would that make it so?

 

[hummdaddy]

If Hitler considered himself a table lamp, would that make it so?

If he considered himself the fifth Beatle, would that make it so?

If he considered himself:

1) the 1937 Cy Young winner
2) a Radio Shack employee named Maury
3) the inventor of the hula hoop

... would that make it so?

40,000 denominations he could have fit in somewhere

 

[centerpin fan]

40,000 denominations he could have fit in somewhere

Westboro Baptist wouldn't even have him (although they would appreciate his work in sending homosexuals to the gas chambers.)

 

[WaltL1]

If Hitler considered himself a table lamp, would that make it so?

If he considered himself the fifth Beatle, would that make it so?

If he considered himself:

1) the 1937 Cy Young winner
2) a Radio Shack employee named Maury
3) the inventor of the hula hoop

... would that make it so?

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior

According to the "what makes a person a Christian" threads, the above in red qualifies him as a Christian.
What he did doesn't make him a nonChristian. It makes him a Christian who did horrible things.
As for your other examples, as far as we know he didn't claim to be any of those things so they are just a deflection away from the above.

 

[centerpin fan]

According to the "what makes a person a Christian" threads, the above in red qualifies him as a Christian.

I could not care less. The "what makes a person a Christian" threads are not the standard by which I will be judged.

As for your other examples, as far as we know he didn't claim to be any of those things so they are just a deflection away from the above.

My point is that merely claiming to be anything does not make it so.

 

[bullethead]

If Hitler considered himself a table lamp, would that make it so?

If he considered himself the fifth Beatle, would that make it so?

If he considered himself:

1) the 1937 Cy Young winner
2) a Radio Shack employee named Maury
3) the inventor of the hula hoop

... would that make it so?

He did not claim to be any of those things. It seems in his mind and according to his writings he was every bit as Christian as every other Christian thinks they are. He may very well have made himself right with Jesus in the last moments of that bunker. Everybody has got skeleton's. You might have to share yours with Adolf over brunch whether you like it or not.

 

[WaltL1]

I could not care less. The "what makes a person a Christian" threads are not the standard by which I will be judged.




My point is that merely claiming to be anything does not make it so.

I think maybe you are your using your own standard of "what Hitler did was so bad therefore he was not a Christian".
That goes against the whole repent and be forgiven thing that acknowledges Christians sin. Now admittedly you know more than I on the subject but I don't know of a
"Hit List" that's says 1 thru 10 is bad but you can still repent and remain a Christian but 11 thru 15 means you weren't actually a Christian. Can you give us a link to that?

My point is that merely claiming to be anything does not make it so

And vice versa. You claiming he wasn't doesn't make it so.
And I get no "satisfaction" from saying Hitler was a Christian. Atrocious things have done by persons of every religion and no religion.
I do find it odd though that you would say Hitler wasn't a Christian for what he did but God flooding the earth isn't even a speed bump. I guess maybe it all depends on who is doing the genocide as to whether it is right or wrong.

 

[Artfuldodger]

I could see where Hitler's belief in Darwin could be where he acquired his interest in genetics. He also believed in a supreme being if not the Christian God.
Is the OP trying to show a relation between a belief in natural selection and mass murders for forming a super race? One could just as easily find mass killings contributed to "doing it for God."
This is like trying to relate looking at regular porn making someone look at child porn or smoking pot making someone do meth.
I follow the beliefs of Darwin and Natural Selection but I've never had a desire to form a super race. Some Christians on the other hand did feel superior to other races back in the Sixties.
Emperor Hirohito of Japan was very religious and didn't mind killing and committing war crimes. He also drunk hot tea. It might have been the tea that made him kill all of those people.
Benito Mussolini was an atheist most of his war years. It was probably his love of garlic that made him kill people.

 

[mtnwoman]

Actions speak louder than words.

I believe that Hitler was part of the antichrist....he came to kill, steal and destroy anything that had to do with the God of Abraham. God warned the Jews in the OT that His protective hand of the chosen would be taken from them and pretty much they were on their own. That's just more confirmation for me about the Bible being the Word.

 

[centerpin fan]

I think maybe you are your using your own standard of "what Hitler did was so bad therefore he was not a Christian".

I think the Holocaust meets or exceeds everybody's standard.