The Official 2014 Woody's/ G O N Bow Hunting Challenge "SMACK TALK" Thread

[mickyu]

There is no way to satisfy everyone. When the new rules were posted this year, everyone wanted to cry about it being a "big buck" challenge and that the guys that kill dinks wouldn't have a chance. Now that we are in the thick of things and dinks are making a difference, guys want to cry about smaller bucks getting too many points. Rules are rules and we just have to strategize accordingly. There is always going to be a loser crying about something. Just be glad we don't have to make the rules and deal with all the criticism. Its a wonder how some of these guys have any fun hunting.

Well said.

 

[DuckArrow]

There is no way to satisfy everyone. When the new rules were posted this year, everyone wanted to cry about it being a "big buck" challenge and that the guys that kill dinks wouldn't have a chance. Now that we are in the thick of things and dinks are making a difference, guys want to cry about smaller bucks getting too many points. Rules are rules and we just have to strategize accordingly. There is always going to be a loser crying about something. Just be glad we don't have to make the rules and deal with all the criticism. Its a wonder how some of these guys have any fun hunting.

Basically it is and has always been a big buck challenge......is it not? The team that kills the biggest bucks do they not win? Ive been fortunate enough to kill two really good bucks the last three years in the challenge. Both are my two biggest ever. The challenge has made me get out of bed on mornings I would've slept in the past. It has also been a means to add interest to the season. I have also been able to get to know so really great folks, and have gotten to be friends with several. Yeah, its $10 and a competition, but to me it is more than that. I'll join it for the next 10 years even if I don't win......just to at the rest of the guys. It's all about the friendship and camaraderie.....Now if only I could get my teammates to kill deer, them not is putting a strain on our friendship

 

[100hunter]

Billy, you knew this was coming. People are already crying about the rules for next year. Down south hunters don't have big deer, northern hunters can't hunt over corn, dinks with a lot of kickers, mature deer with little racks, guys complaining about killing to many deer off their properties but still entered two bucks, it never ends. I've seen over a hundred free ranging bucks this year and I'm yet to enter one. The rules, no matter what they are will always favor the hunter who is patient, selective, and has the right skill set. How bout this for a rule change. Three bucks and six does per team no matter who kills em and if you've ever been a top scoring hunter in the challenge you can only enter does. That would eliminate myself, Bowrod, Jay Maxwell, and a host of others.

 

[deast1988]

Billy, you knew this was coming. People are already crying about the rules for next year. Down south hunters don't have big deer, northern hunters can't hunt over corn, dinks with a lot of kickers, mature deer with little racks, guys complaining about killing to many deer off their properties but still entered two bucks, it never ends. I've seen over a hundred free ranging bucks this year and I'm yet to enter one. The rules, no matter what they are will always favor the hunter who is patient, selective, and has the right skill set. How bout this for a rule change. Three bucks and six does per team no matter who kills em and if you've ever been a top scoring hunter in the challenge you can only enter does. That would eliminate myself, Bowrod, Jay Maxwell, and a host of others.

Walk softly and carry a big stick.

I like it, but eliminate yourself??

Why play.. All I do is hunt with some buddies talk trash and try an show yall what I kill. Some fare better then others as season progresses. I've enjoyed it regardless. Still plenty of time for some bump drafting. But I view this like a report card. Whole lot easier to change your grade in the early stages rather then the late.

 

[MCNASTY]

Basically it is and has always been a big buck challenge......is it not? The team that kills the biggest bucks do they not win? Ive been fortunate enough to kill two really good bucks the last three years in the challenge. Both are my two biggest ever. The challenge has made me get out of bed on mornings I would've slept in the past. It has also been a means to add interest to the season. I have also been able to get to know so really great folks, and have gotten to be friends with several. Yeah, its $10 and a competition, but to me it is more than that. I'll join it for the next 10 years even if I don't win......just to at the rest of the guys. It's all about the friendship and camaraderie.....Now if only I could get my teammates to kill deer, them not is putting a strain on our friendship

Not necessarily. A big buck challenge would be an actual score of P&Y. The rules are set up currently for the number of points a buck has is key. Which is kind of a leveling field for our south GA "dinks". How many ten points has most people let walk with a bow ? Dink or stud, a ten point or 8 point with 3 kickers evens the playing field for those who don't kill popers every year. A level/even chance gives hope. Hope let's people enter the challenge in hopes of competing for a top spot.

Guys I'm not trying to stir the pot here. I'm just sticking up for myself and others who may feel that this side of the story needs to be heard. If we're after mature bucks alone, then let's start pulling jaw bones and measuring teeth.

 

[BowChilling]

Billy, you knew this was coming. People are already crying about the rules for next year.

I did Willie and it's all good! I wanted to get some talk flowing and ideas for next year. All points made are being duly noted!

 

[BowanaLee]

Say you have a typical 8 pt, with double drop tines, double split g1's, g2's, g3's and an extra main beam. Your rule change will let a average typical 10 pt with the same spread and longest tine beat it by one point. Which is fine if your trying to give typical bucks favoritism ? Valid point ?

 

[DuckArrow]

Say you have a typical 8 pt, with double drop tines, double split g1's, g2's, g3's and an extra main beam. Your rule change will let a average typical 10 pt with the same spread and longest tine beat it by one point. Which is fine if your trying to give typical bucks favoritism ? Valid point ?

Wow.....that is kinda a unicorn right there. Would love to see that buck in front of me with a bow in my hands. However, that is the sad truth. He would score less than a typical 10pt. I don't like that possible change.

Here is a score sheet with the current scoring, the 1pt rule, and the doubling of spread and longest tine. I'm not against change don't get me wrong, but I'm against punishing the Hunter/Buck just because he is not 100% typical.

 

[Nathanj519]

Say you have a typical 8 pt, with double drop tines, double split g1's, g2's, g3's and an extra main beam. Your rule change will let a average typical 10 pt with the same spread and longest tine beat it by one point. Which is fine if your trying to give typical bucks favoritism ? Valid point ?

Just an idea, but you could score all abnormal points (kickers, droptines, splits, extra beams, etc.) as point per inch.

 

[100hunter]

Walk softly and carry a big stick.

I like it, but eliminate yourself??

Why play.. All I do is hunt with some buddies talk trash and try an show yall what I kill. Some fare better then others as season progresses. I've enjoyed it regardless. Still plenty of time for some bump drafting. But I view this like a report card. Whole lot easier to change your grade in the early stages rather then the late.

We're not totally eliminated. We could enter all six does. Weather we enter a buck or not, our personal goals are still set. I agree with McNasty if it levels the playing field and invites more people to participate then I'm all for it. I personally like the idea of two contest. A big buck challenge (two bucks), and the original team challenge (five deer each). Sign up for which ever one you want. I just want Frank and Derik back.

 

[kbuck1]

Just an idea, but you could score all abnormal points (kickers, droptines, splits, extra beams, etc.) as point per inch.

Thats the way Bowanna had it figured. The 10 point still comes out ahead by 1 point.

 

[sneakypete]

This will turn into a "big buck" challenge. Like I said before, in the extreme south east corner of this state we aren't blessed with great genetics and small pockets/funnels like some places. We are already at an disadvantage to the suburban hunters. Leave it as it be or you'll lose a ton of teams in this challenge due to favoritism. Killing a mature buck is a big task, we kill them every year, they're eight points normally with 15-16 inch spreads with 6-7 inch tines. Every so often there is a really good deer killed and it'll score in the 120's(which isn't a great deer ??

6-7 inch tines 15 inch spread that's average for the state of Georgia so I don't see what ur complaining about.
. does the pope and young system do all deer or even the majority of deer justice? absolutely not. maybe half if its lucky I think. competitions like this should use the Canadian water displacement scoring system whatever its called. Without doing any math at all basically it takes everything in on its own. mass and tine length are linked obviously and spread is linked to beam length correct? more tines , more beam length , more mass = more displacement. one number as accurate as it gets. I don't think it should be adopted officially but it could be used for stuff like this.

 

[BlackEagle]

6-7 inch tines 15 inch spread that's average for the state of Georgia so I don't see what ur complaining about.
. does the pope and young system do all deer or even the majority of deer justice? absolutely not. maybe half if its lucky I think. competitions like this should use the Canadian water displacement scoring system whatever its called. Without doing any math at all basically it takes everything in on its own. mass and tine length are linked obviously and spread is linked to beam length correct? more tines , more beam length , more mass = more displacement. one number as accurate as it gets. I don't think it should be adopted officially but it could be used for stuff like this.

This. The dinks are scoring way too high. I have a 10 pointer that I could kill that would score awesome. But hes a baby with no mass and shorter beams with decent tine length. Next year I expect the same deer to have a ton more mass and longer beams. The difference in score from this year if I killed him and next year if I kill him would be minimal (with exception of small increase in tine length). Based on current scoring method.

Give the bigger deer credit where its due! Ill still play no matter what scoring system is in place.

 

[MCNASTY]

6-7 inch tines 15 inch spread that's average for the state of Georgia so I don't see what ur complaining about.
. does the pope and young system do all deer or even the majority of deer justice? absolutely not. maybe half if its lucky I think. competitions like this should use the Canadian water displacement scoring system whatever its called. Without doing any math at all basically it takes everything in on its own. mass and tine length are linked obviously and spread is linked to beam length correct? more tines , more beam length , more mass = more displacement. one number as accurate as it gets. I don't think it should be adopted officially but it could be used for stuff like this.

Your right you don't know why I'm complaining. It has everything to do with fairness. You can look at the kill thread and tell we can kill em. The only chance we have is to kill a deer with lots of "tines" or points. That's the name of this game anyhow. It's fair to all bc each team can kill that kind of deer. Take a look at the GON Truck buck and tell me the same counties aren't in the running every year. Fact of the matter remains, you can't kill what you don't have. We don't, so it is what it is I guess.

A "big buck" challenge will make this competition unfair to some. I'm with Willie on killing 5 deer per team member like years past bc we just eat a lot of deer !!

 

[BlackEagle]

A "big buck" challenge will make this competition unfair to some. I'm with Willie on killing 5 deer per team member like years past bc we just eat a lot of deer !!

Its going to be "unfair" no matter what the rules are. It NOT being a "big buck" challenge is "unfair" to some....like us, because we dont shoot young bucks. I promise you we could be in the top few right now if we wanted to be. But we choose not to shoot immature bucks.

So, how would it being a Big Buck Challenge make it unfair? Not arguing, just trying to understand a little better.

 

[100hunter]

Its going to be "unfair" no matter what the rules are. It NOT being a "big buck" challenge is "unfair" to some....like us, because we dont shoot young bucks. I promise you we could be in the top few right now if we wanted to be. But we choose not to shoot immature bucks.

So, how would it being a Big Buck Challenge make it unfair? Not arguing, just trying to understand a little better.

I applaud you for not shooting immature bucks. I think what Mc N is saying is that in some areas genetics limit the hunters to typical 8 pt mature bucks which doesn't give them a chance to areas that produce 10 and 12 pt giants. Most guys wont kill two big bucks so it levels the playing field. Two 8's or One 12 and one dink. My teammate killed a dink 9pt which outscored alot of mature 8pts, but trust me he passed up several better bucks. The landowner asked us to give him some meat and the only deer we could get on was three 8pts and his 9pt. We didn't want to dissapoint the landowner so there you have it. We want to Win, put trophies on the wall, manage, and we want to eat, thats the dilemma. My other teammate missed a big pope with his recurve and refuses to shoot a doe if with a fawn. Could of been some different results had he chosen to use his compound. I've learned to respect my teammate personal goals weather we're in the winners circle or not. Having fun is what its all about.

 

[BlackEagle]

I applaud you for not shooting immature bucks. I think what Mc N is saying is that in some areas genetics limit the hunters to typical 8 pt mature bucks which doesn't give them a chance to areas that produce 10 and 12 pt giants. Most guys wont kill two big bucks so it levels the playing field. Two 8's or One 12 and one dink. My teammate killed a dink 9pt which outscored alot of mature 8pts, but trust me he passed up several better bucks. The landowner asked us to give him some meat and the only deer we could get on was three 8pts and his 9pt. We didn't want to dissapoint the landowner so there you have it. We want to Win, put trophies on the wall, manage, and we want to eat, thats the dilemma. My other teammate missed a big pope with his recurve and refuses to shoot a doe if with a fawn. Could of been some different results had he chosen to use his compound. I've learned to respect my teammate personal goals weather we're in the winners circle or not. Having fun is what its all about.

I agree with ya!

 

[Wack&Stackn08]

This. The dinks are scoring way too high. I have a 10 pointer that I could kill that would score awesome. But hes a baby with no mass and shorter beams with decent tine length. Next year I expect the same deer to have a ton more mass and longer beams. The difference in score from this year if I killed him and next year if I kill him would be minimal (with exception of small increase in tine length). Based on current scoring method.

Give the bigger deer credit where its due! Ill still play no matter what scoring system is in place.

This is the misconception that everyone has... This challenge started out to be a "bow hunting" challenge, not a "big buck" challenge, which means , IMO, who can kill the most critters with a bow.

I say if you want to get in a Big Buck challenge, make it a separate challenge. Put it back to 15 deer, leave the scoring system like it is. If you want to be in the "big buck" challenge , it will cost you an extra 10$, but you must be in the "bow hunting"challenge to be in the "big buck" challenge. Let the buck challenge replace the random draw.

This way there is one for the quantity guys, and one for the quality guys.

 

[swamp]

This is the misconception that everyone has... This challenge started out to be a "bow hunting" challenge, not a "big buck" challenge, which means , IMO, who can kill the most critters with a bow.

I say if you want to get in a Big Buck challenge, make it a separate challenge. Put it back to 15 deer, leave the scoring system like it is. If you want to be in the "big buck" challenge , it will cost you an extra 10$, but you must be in the "bow hunting"challenge to be in the "big buck" challenge. Let the buck challenge replace the random draw.

This way there is one for the quantity guys, and one for the quality guys.

 

[The Fever]

I applaud you for not shooting immature bucks. I think what Mc N is saying is that in some areas genetics limit the hunters to typical 8 pt mature bucks which doesn't give them a chance to areas that produce 10 and 12 pt giants. Most guys wont kill two big bucks so it levels the playing field. Two 8's or One 12 and one dink. My teammate killed a dink 9pt which outscored alot of mature 8pts, but trust me he passed up several better bucks. The landowner asked us to give him some meat and the only deer we could get on was three 8pts and his 9pt. We didn't want to dissapoint the landowner so there you have it. We want to Win, put trophies on the wall, manage, and we want to eat, thats the dilemma. My other teammate missed a big pope with his recurve and refuses to shoot a doe if with a fawn. Could of been some different results had he chosen to use his compound. I've learned to respect my teammate personal goals weather we're in the winners circle or not. Having fun is what its all about.

Zone 7 hunters will never be able to compete. Might be a freak in there here and there but from camden to charlton up through savannah and out to dublin are ont he coastal plain. If you are on the actual coast you are hunting the only genetics native to georgia before they restoked, the others suffer from poor forage and mass supply. Life isnt fair. Only way to even this out is an 8 score as same as all other 8's. Or to scale it based on zone but I feel that gets too complicated. This challenge is about hunting harder, meet some great folk, throw some smack talk out there. I have met four great hunters this way that I consider to be long term friends I intend to always keep in touch with. They have also greatly shortened my learning curve. Keep on gentlemen. I will play regardless. It is ten dollars.