Dudley Do-Wrong
Senior Member
It seems that the Easter thread was turning into a law vs. faith discussion, so I decided to start a thread to discuss faith and law.
The way I read it and I have heard this many times, is that some folks believe that the Mosaic law is no longer applicable because Christ “did away” with that requirement. It is my contention that the law is still applicable, though not as a means unto salvation. Likewise, the Old Testament is applicable as well. Now, perhaps I am mis-reading some comments made by others, and I apologize if that is the case. But, allow me to present my case.
Just because we are no longer under the law does not mean it no longer applies, what else constitutes sin?
I John 3:4
Everyone who sins breaks the law; in fact, sin is lawlessness.
Romans 3:20
Through the law we become conscious of sin
Jesus said he did not come to “do away” with the law
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
The apostles continuously teached obedience
James 2:10-11, NIV. "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. For He who said, 'Do not commit adultery,' also said, ‘Do not murder.' If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker."
The Jewish concept of salvation was following the law and their traditions but they forgot about faith and having a relationship with God.
Matt 22:36-40
Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
Galatians 2:15-16, NIV. "A man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified."
Jesus continuously berated the Pharisees about this.
Mat 23:23
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier [matters] of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
The blood sacrifices meant nothing because of their lack of faith. Abraham was not saved by following the law; he was saved by his faith. So, salvation by faith applied even during the Old Testament times as well.
Rom 4:1-5
What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath [whereof] to glory; but not before God.
For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Our obedience is a result of our love and faith in Christ Jesus. Obedience without love and faith means nothing to God, Abraham understood this.
Romans 3:27-31, TLB. "Then what can we boast about doing, to earn our salvation? Nothing at all. Why? Because our acquittal is not based on our good deeds; it is based on what Christ has done and our faith in Him. So it is that we are saved by faith in Christ and not by the good things we do. And does God save only the Jews in this way? No, the Gentiles, too, may come to Him in this same manner. God treats us all the same; all, whether Jews or Gentiles, are acquitted if they have faith. Well then, if we are saved by faith, does this mean that we no longer need obey God's laws? Just the opposite! In fact, only when we trust Jesus can we truly obey Him."
Jesus was the final sacrifice; he alone was/is the perfect sacrifice. Doesn’t matter if the Jews start with blood sacrifices again because there can be no perfect sacrifice except for Christ Himself. His last words on the cross were “it is finished”.
The way I read it and I have heard this many times, is that some folks believe that the Mosaic law is no longer applicable because Christ “did away” with that requirement. It is my contention that the law is still applicable, though not as a means unto salvation. Likewise, the Old Testament is applicable as well. Now, perhaps I am mis-reading some comments made by others, and I apologize if that is the case. But, allow me to present my case.
Just because we are no longer under the law does not mean it no longer applies, what else constitutes sin?
I John 3:4
Everyone who sins breaks the law; in fact, sin is lawlessness.
Romans 3:20
Through the law we become conscious of sin
Jesus said he did not come to “do away” with the law
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
The apostles continuously teached obedience
James 2:10-11, NIV. "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. For He who said, 'Do not commit adultery,' also said, ‘Do not murder.' If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker."
The Jewish concept of salvation was following the law and their traditions but they forgot about faith and having a relationship with God.
Matt 22:36-40
Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
Galatians 2:15-16, NIV. "A man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified."
Jesus continuously berated the Pharisees about this.
Mat 23:23
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier [matters] of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
The blood sacrifices meant nothing because of their lack of faith. Abraham was not saved by following the law; he was saved by his faith. So, salvation by faith applied even during the Old Testament times as well.
Rom 4:1-5
What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath [whereof] to glory; but not before God.
For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Our obedience is a result of our love and faith in Christ Jesus. Obedience without love and faith means nothing to God, Abraham understood this.
Romans 3:27-31, TLB. "Then what can we boast about doing, to earn our salvation? Nothing at all. Why? Because our acquittal is not based on our good deeds; it is based on what Christ has done and our faith in Him. So it is that we are saved by faith in Christ and not by the good things we do. And does God save only the Jews in this way? No, the Gentiles, too, may come to Him in this same manner. God treats us all the same; all, whether Jews or Gentiles, are acquitted if they have faith. Well then, if we are saved by faith, does this mean that we no longer need obey God's laws? Just the opposite! In fact, only when we trust Jesus can we truly obey Him."
Jesus was the final sacrifice; he alone was/is the perfect sacrifice. Doesn’t matter if the Jews start with blood sacrifices again because there can be no perfect sacrifice except for Christ Himself. His last words on the cross were “it is finished”.