About Jesus Christ

[BanjoPicker]

The Fatherhood of God and the motherhood of Mary produced a single personality. After all, it must be remembered that God made man with the same bodily parts as He has in His Spirit body, only our bodies are earthly and human and His is spiritual and divine. He made man with the same kind of soul with feelings, emotions, passions, desires, and appetites, capable of the same soul-acts as He Himself was, only our soul is finite and His is infinite. He made man with a spirit with all the attributes and powers that He has, capable of the same acts; only our spirits are finite and His is infinite. In other words, man is endowed with exactly the same traits, characteristics, attributes, powers, feelings, and passions as God, only on a finite scale.
With this in mind one can see that the soul and spirit faculties that were born in Jesus Christ by a divine Father and a human mother were exactly the same as in any other being like God, so when Christ acted and used any one attribute or power as a man it was like the exercise of God in the same aspects, only His were perfectly untainted with the fall and its effects. When Christ acted He was like man before the fall and not like sinful man since the fall. Every fallen man when he is re-created in Christ and made a new creature is capable of proper exercise of his faculties in holy and lawful uses.

 

[Spotlite]

If they’re not one, who’s actually the Father of Jesus Banjo?? God or the Holy Ghost? Being separate and distinct - both can’t be the Father.

Scripture says Mary was with child from the Holy Spirit.

Scripture says Jesus is the Son of God.

Christ is also in there if you read more scripture.

 

[BanjoPicker]

We may express it this way, man in his fallen state acted exactly like God in the exercise faculties, only his attributes and powers were limited. He was capable of the same powers and acts only in a finite scale. what is finite in man when he is energized and acted upon and endued with supernatural powers can exercise his natural attributes and faculties in a supernatural degree or measure, depending upon what extent he is yielded to and energized by the Spirit of God. For example, Christ and the disciples when endued with power from on high were capable of God-action to destroy sin and sickness as much as if God Himself were doing the work without using them as instruments.

 

[BanjoPicker]

It must also be remembered that men when born again become partakers of the divine nature and to the extent to which that nature controls and works in and through their created faculties they live divine lives and do divine works. In such men the created faculties are liberated from evil acts and evil powers and become acts of divine energy through the Holy Spirit. Just as Christ was perfectly helpless in Himself and acted, spoke, worked, lived, and did all things through the anointing of the Holy Spirit, the believer to the extent that he becomes like Christ becomes God-inspired and God-energized and God-operated. Thus the Christain fully living in the fulness of God lives a divine human life in the Holy Spirit by the very presence and power of God in the human soul and spirit.

 

[BanjoPicker]

If we can understand these things, we certainly can understand how God could become so perfectly human and yet remain so perfectly divine as to be a perfect union God and man in one personality. Whether the divine attributes and power of God in Christ were limited and to what extent is a great question in Christian circles. Whether He laid them aside entirely for a time, or whether they were possessed by Him and voluntarily limited will always be a point of controversy. However, this much is settled that He was limited in the days of His flesh. Whether He was limited constitutionally or voluntarily is not the point. It is a fact that if it were done constitutional it was nevertheless voluntary as stated in Jn. 10:18; Heb. 10:5-9. He was not forced to do one thing. Everything was a voluntary action on His part. It matters not whether it was constitutional or whether He still retained all the divine powers and attributes in His person and chose to limit their use for His time of life on Earth; the fact remains that He was limited as a man, and if His choice was so powerful as to do away with all use of them, what is the difference between laying them aside and still retaining them without power to use them.

 

[BanjoPicker]

It was important that He limit Himself as a man to set the right example for man so that he can inspired to live like God on Earth by the same means Christ used. For all the arguments about His having two personalities, two natures in one personality, human nature without personality, or divine nature without human traits the fact will always remain that He was both human and divine, and if some cannot understand the how of it, the fact of it can be believed and must be if we want harmony of all Scriptures. One certainty is that His human nature had no separate existence before its union with the divine and is not in itself a separate personality from the divine person who became incarnated in the human flesh.
It was only important that He have two natures, human and divine, for the sake of man, but also for the sake of God, to be a true mediator between God and man. His twofold nature gives Him fellowship with both parties and capability of representing both to reconcile both. As God He can uphold the dignity of Deity, and as man He can be truly sympathetic and meet the needs of man. Because He is God His atonement has infinite value and effect.

 

[BanjoPicker]

Jesus Christ is Not the Father or the Holy Ghost

Many are misled in making Jesus the only person in the Godhead and more than what the Bible says He is and they rob the Father and the holy Spirit of their own separate personalities and make them less than what the Bible says they are, thus depriving them of their rightful and separate places in the unity of God. It is highly important to know whether there are three persons in the Godhead, so as to give each His rightful place proper love and worship, and to understand the Bible, so as to not to be led astray into many false doctrines that naturally come if we permit ourselves to contort Scripture to suit ourselves, or to conform to some human church creed.

 

[BanjoPicker]

The Father was in Heaven all the time that Jesus was on Earth, so the Father could not have been incarnated in Jesus Matt. 5:16, 45, 48; 6:1, 9; 7:21; 16:17; 18:10; 23:9.

Jesus said He would confess men "BEFORE MY FATHER" and BEFORE THE ANGELS" and this He could not do if He were not a separate person from the Father and the angels Matt. 10:32, 33; Lk. 12:8, 9; Rev. 3:2-5. Such language would not permit Him to be the angels as much as it would permit Him to be the Father. The word "before" means in the presence of, or face to face with, and requires both the Father and the angels to be distinct persons from Jesus. This word could never be used if only one person were involved, any more than it could be in 1,767 similar expressions in Scripture Matt. 14:6; 17:2; 1 Tim. 5:19, 20; 6:12; Rev. 4:5, 6; 5:8; 7:9, 11, 15; 8:2.

Jesus always prayed to the Father and addresses Him as a separate person from Himself Matt. 11:25; 26:39, 42-46; Lk. 10:21; 22:42; 23:34; Jn. 11:41; 12:28; 17:1-25. In no place do we read of the Father praying to anyone, but the Son constantly prays to someone else outside of Himself.

The Father was outside the body of Jesus protecting Him, so could not be incarnated in Jesus, or be all of God INSIDE of Jesus as some teach Matt. 2:12-23; 3:16, 17; 17:5; Lk. 22:39-46; Jn. 12:27-30.

 

[BanjoPicker]

All the Old Testament prophets quoted in the New Testament proves that the Father is a separate person from the Son, for it was the Father who spoke "by the prophets" and "through the Spirit" CONCERNING the Son Heb. 1:1-3; Acts 3:21; Rom. 1:1-4; 1 Pet. 1:1-16; 2 Pet. 1:21. Note THE SPEAKER and the person SPOKEN OF in Matt. 2:15, 23; 4:6; 12:17-21; 22:41; 27:9-11; Lk. 4:16-21; 24:27, 44-46; Jn. 18:9; Acts 2:22-34; 3:13-24; 4:25-31; 7:2-50; 8:32-37; 10:34-43; 13:23-41; Heb. 2:3-9; 5:5-10. Human language means nothing in the Bible if two and three persons are not understood in such statements as these passages.
Both Jesus and Satan refer to the Father as a separate person from the Son. "He [one person] shall give His angels charge CONCERNING THEE (Jesus, the Son of the Father, another person, Matt. 4:6.

 

[BanjoPicker]

Jesus constantly referred to the Father as a separate person from Himself and as being separated bodily from Him as far as the Heaven is above the Earth Mt. 7:21; 10:32, 33; 11:27; 15:13; 16:17, 27; 18:10-35; 20:23; Mk. 12:32; Jn. 5.
The New Testament writers called the Father, "The God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ," but such could never be if He were the Lord Jesus Christ Eph. 1:3, 17; 3:14; 1 Pet. 1:3; Mt. 27:46; Jn. 20:17.

 

[BanjoPicker]

The phrases "The Son of The Father" 2 Jn. 3, "his Father" Mt. 16:27; Rev. 1:6; 14:1, "my Father" (used 57 times, Mt. 7:21; Jn. 15:1; Rev. 2:27; 3:5, "my God" Jn. 20:17; Rev. 3:12, and other like statements made by Jesus of His Father and by others of God being the Father of Jesus could not be true if Jesus were the Father and the only person called God. If Jesus spoke of God the Father as being His Father and His God then He either lied or told the truth. Such Language demands of us to believe in another person who is God and Father of Jesus Christ. Not once did Jesus or any Bible writer use such terms as Jesus, the Father, the Father Jesus, spirit-Jesus, Father Jesus, one person in the Godhead, Jesus only, and other unscriptural terms used by some people.

 

[Spotlite]

The phrases "The Son of The Father" 2 Jn. 3, "his Father" Mt. 16:27; Rev. 1:6; 14:1, "my Father" (used 57 times, Mt. 7:21; Jn. 15:1; Rev. 2:27; 3:5, "my God" Jn. 20:17; Rev. 3:12, and other like statements made by Jesus of His Father and by others of God being the Father of Jesus could not be true if Jesus were the Father and the only person called God. If Jesus spoke of God the Father as being His Father and His God then He either lied or told the truth. Such Language demands of us to believe in another person who is God and Father of Jesus Christ. Not once did Jesus or any Bible writer use such terms as Jesus, the Father, the Father Jesus, spirit-Jesus, Father Jesus, one person in the Godhead, Jesus only, and other unscriptural terms used by some people.

No disrespect but this is the issue with the trinity doctrine - it demands you believe a certain way and it limits the power of God to our understanding because we can’t comprehend how He works in manifestation.

The Godhead is a “mystery” according to scripture. To state this is how I believe and this why I believe is one thing.

To state that scripture doesn’t exist is another….,,,,they exist. There are no equals to God. It’s all God.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory


Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Who is the “Him” in Colossians 2?

 

[gordon 2]

Jesus didn't receive the Holy Spirit until John baptized him. This truth doesn’t diminish Jesus’ deity. Rather, it reminds us the reality of Jesus’ humanity.
If Jesus was the same persona of the Father, why would he need his Father's spirit? Maybe Jesus is one person with one body, soul, and spirit. Perhaps the Holy Spirit is God's spirit and not a separate persona.
It's hard for me to fathom a persona of the Godhead receiving another persona of the Godhead if he is in fact that same persona himself.

Perhaps it is not the "Godhead persona" receiving itself. It is perhaps "Godhead persona" purposely descending and now acting into the world of men as redeemer. As man descends to the rivers and into the river and is baptized by man for the forgiveness of sins Jesus ( God) is so baptized as a man. From this point on Jesus will minister to the world here on earth both from heaven as the Son and by himself being a man. He will suffer and die as a man so much so that the very next thing scripture relates on Jesus is that he goes to the desert 40 days and is tempted! ( Between you and me, if ever I go to a desert the fact that I'm tempted everyday I'm there will not be fit to mention as out of sorts.)

So all righteousness as to God's will and so purpose is done due his baptism by John. Jesus will die as a man. No one will say Jesus died a Spirit or God for man. Jesus substituted his death as a man for ours and so our salvation according to the will of God.

" For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many!…"

When Jesus is baptized by John he is eventually making himself as a man the gift or the righteous sacrifice as a man with no sin, the righteous sacrifice, the spotless lamb, the spotless man, as to our redemption.

John says to Jesus, "Hey, it is you that should baptize me" But we know the rest of the story. John did not.

 

[BanjoPicker]

No disrespect but this is the issue with the trinity doctrine - it demands you believe a certain way and it limits the power of God to our understanding because we can’t comprehend how He works in manifestation.

The Godhead is a “mystery” according to scripture. To state this is how I believe and this why I believe is one thing.

To state that scripture doesn’t exist is another….,,,,they exist. There are no equals to God. It’s all God.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory


Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Who is the “Him” in Colossians 2?

warning against adding human philosophy and legality to the completeness in Christ.
Col. 2:9 For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Note it says bodily, for in him meaning, Christ, the Godhead bodily (Col. 2:9).
In Christ alone, not in the philosophies, vain deceit, human traditions of the Jews and Gentiles, or the world principles will be found in the fulness of the Godhead in reality, or bodily. Jewish institutions were mere shadows of the realties and of the redemption made through the offering of the body of Christ in sacrifice (v 14-17; Mt. 26:26-28; Rom. 7:6; Eph. 2:16; Heb. 10:1-18; 1 Pet. 2:24).
Hence, the Gr. word somatikos, bodies, refers to that which is real in contrast to that which is typical, or shadowy as in v 17; Heb. 10:1. It is found only here. The Gr. word for Godhead is theotes, meaning Deity it occurs only here and relates to the Godhead or Deity personally.
Christ is the personal and bodily manifestation of all the fulness of Deity. He was God incarnate and the manifestation of all the fulness of God's power and blessings to men Isa. 7:14; 9:6; Mt. 1:1825; Lk. 1:34, 35. The fulness of the Holy Spirit rested upon Him and work through His body Isa. 11:2; 42:1-7; 61:, 2; Jn 3:34; Acts 10:38. The fulness of redemption from the Deity came through His body 1 Pet. 2:24. This is why we become complete in Him and why he is the head of principality and power (v 10; 1:16-18; Eph. 1:20-23; Phil. 2:9-11; 1 Pet. 3:22).

No disrespect, so here we have Jesus being God incarnate and becoming the Son of God, and God becoming the Father the Holy Spirit resting upon Him working through His body. So now we have God as the Father and Jesus as the Son and the Holy Spirit which work through them which makes three and all having a body, soul, and spirit.

 

[BanjoPicker]

Jesus in parables illustrates His relationship to the Father as that of a Son and as a separate person from the Father Mt. 21:33-46; Lk. 20:9-18; Jn. 15:1-10. To believe in only one person as being both the Father and Son in these passages is to make Jesus a plain liar. If He said He was "the vine" and the Father was "the husbandman" Jn. 15 and God the Father is compared to "a certain householder" and the Son is compared to "his son" and "heir," then this relationship is the truth and nothing but the truth, thus distinguishing two persons known as "the Father" and "the Son" Mt. 21:33-46; Lk. 20:9-18.

 

[Spotlite]

warning against adding human philosophy and legality to the completeness in Christ.
Col. 2:9 For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Note it says bodily, for in him meaning, Christ, the Godhead bodily (Col. 2:9).
In Christ alone, not in the philosophies, vain deceit, human traditions of the Jews and Gentiles, or the world principles will be found in the fulness of the Godhead in reality, or bodily. Jewish institutions were mere shadows of the realties and of the redemption made through the offering of the body of Christ in sacrifice (v 14-17; Mt. 26:26-28; Rom. 7:6; Eph. 2:16; Heb. 10:1-18; 1 Pet. 2:24).
Hence, the Gr. word somatikos, bodies, refers to that which is real in contrast to that which is typical, or shadowy as in v 17; Heb. 10:1. It is found only here. The Gr. word for Godhead is theotes, meaning Deity it occurs only here and relates to the Godhead or Deity personally.
Christ is the personal and bodily manifestation of all the fulness of Deity. He was God incarnate and the manifestation of all the fulness of God's power and blessings to men Isa. 7:14; 9:6; Mt. 1:1825; Lk. 1:34, 35. The fulness of the Holy Spirit rested upon Him and work through His body Isa. 11:2; 42:1-7; 61:, 2; Jn 3:34; Acts 10:38. The fulness of redemption from the Deity came through His body 1 Pet. 2:24. This is why we become complete in Him and why he is the head of principality and power (v 10; 1:16-18; Eph. 1:20-23; Phil. 2:9-11; 1 Pet. 3:22).

No disrespect, so here we have Jesus being God incarnate and becoming the Son of God, and God becoming the Father the Holy Spirit resting upon Him working through His body. So now we have God as the Father and Jesus as the Son and the Holy Spirit which work through them which makes three and all having a body, soul, and spirit.

There’s absolutely nothing equal to God. There are no 3 distinct, separate, individual entities. Scripturally, it’s all one God - different manifestations. He’s Father in creation, Jesus in redemption, and spirit in salvation.

Here’s another example:

“Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16for by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they bethrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him”

Who is the above scripture referring to? How can Jesus be the Creator unless He’s just a manifestation of the Creator?

 

[Spotlite]

warning against adding human philosophy and legality to the completeness in Christ.
Col. 2:9 For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Note it says bodily, for in him meaning, Christ, the Godhead bodily (Col. 2:9).

I wanted to address this separately.

Yes, there’s a warning. Saying “it demands” you to believe something like “Father and Son” are two, separate, distinct individuals is found outside of human philosophy exactly where in scripture?

In Him bodily. If you read that entire chapter it’s talking about Jesus. Remember God manifest Himself in flesh.

Carry on.

 

[BanjoPicker]

Jesus taught men to go directly to the Father in all prayer and not pray to Him at all: "YE SHALL ASK NOTHING. . . .ask the Father IN MY NAME, he will give it you" Jn. 14:12-15; 15:16; 16:23-28. What could be clearer than that Jesus is not the Father? If men are commanded to "ASK ME NOTHING" but to "ASK THE FATHER" instead, then He is not the Father. It is one of the most unreasonable doctrines under the sun to teach that Jesus and His Father are one and the same person and that the body of Jesus is the Son and inner man of Jesus is the Father. It is ridiculous to as men to pray to one part of a person in the name of another part of the same person, or to call two parts of one person by different names one part called the Father, or inner part, and another part called the Son, or the body part, one part to be the authority to go to the other part in prayer, or more ridiculous still, as some people do, to ignore the Father part and pray only to the Son, or body part. If the language of Jesus does not refer to two persons, then we to conclude that He did not know how to use human language.

 

[BanjoPicker]

On certain occasions Jesus thanked the Father, "looking up to Heaven" where the Father dwelled (not looking inside Himself to a Father that dwelled within Jn. 11:41; Mt. 26:25-27; Mk. 8:6; 14:23. Was Jesus giving thanks to Himself and teaching us by example self-praise and self-worship, or was there a real Father OUTSIDE of Him who dwelled in Heaven as a separate person?

 

[gordon 2]

To no one in particular:

Jesus replied, “You do not realize now what I am doing, but later you will understand.”

Jesus thought in parable to divide his listeners or readers. He knew expertly how to use language. Possibly the reason for doing this was to discern what sort he was ministering or is ministering to. ( Know your audience.)

"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

At some point it should be evident that the kingdom of God of a born again person and the kingdom of God of a person having no second birth, yet they are especially spiritual both, will not agree.

The man that says God is One only or Trinity only is not seeing the same kingdom nor the same king as the one who would see that God is One and Trinity. And this becomes even more problematic that both would be bible based in their fellowship. Something other than their shared bible must cause such rifts.

Am I born again? Are you born again? " But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you." Can I be bible based regards this verse? that being Born Again makes a heaven of difference as to what meanings are added to my understanding and my understanding of both man and my Lord?